Enter the forest at the darkest point - Julius Fann, Jr

Religion and Secularism
21

From the FAQ/rules

h. Threads that consist of repetitive posting of the same comments, information, or links without meaningful development or responsive discussion will be considered a form of spamming or trolling and may be locked or deleted at the Moderators’ discretion.

This is not a warning. I didn’t say you violated anything. I and another member asked you a question about your post and your response was that you could say whatever you wanted and that there’s nothing I do about it. You can’t, and there is something. There are limits. I was checking to see if you understood that.

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This is the rule you use you have used: " h. Threads that consist of repetitive posting of the same comments, information, or links without meaningful development or responsive discussion will be considered a form of spamming or trolling and may be locked or deleted at the Moderators’ discretion." which is displaced in this topic because the topic is not repetitive because quotes used a a foundation of different contents of reply to the topic cannot be considered the “same comment, information, or links.”

Should anyone take notice, from the beginning of this thread, to the second and third reply, there are different flavors, contents, and subject matters which can be discussed contextually alone from the original opening. E.g.,
Opening topic tells when entering the forest at the darkest point there must be a shedding of all the memories of a mirage which seem real.

The 1st reply speaks of the greatest challenge in this life is ourselves. And **if we have not discovered who we are, and what we would do in all states of affairs, then, we cannot know who we are until we know who we are not.

And the 3rd reply says Grace is your only path. That **when an individual realizes to live in Grace is to live without a personal definition, they understand Grace has the only definition of Being the Eyes of God’s Soul looking through their eyes unconditionally.

Each of the three carry their own weight and are not repetitive comments, information.

Now, the issue here is you Sir are the main contributor to this topic, and at no time have you dealt with the contents on the platform of dialogue with none of what I have posted. Your 1st reply to the opening topic was not a push and pull communication, just a sarcastic “really?” and you’re talking about J. Campbell’s. which I ignored in the manner of who cares about him, and the comments you made concerning him. The topic was not about J. Campbell, he was dead, and I was alive, which was saying deal with what is before you and let the dead bury the dead.

Regarding the 2nd post, you came with " Excellent, but why do you feel the need to share this with others? What do you expect in return?" You did not deal with the contents of this reply. Instead you, as you can see, gpt off topic and asked personal questions of my intent, which was out of line. There was no need to reply to you about my intent and why I do what I post as I post. So my reply was, this is what I do. and left it there,

You took exception and this is what prompted your attitude and the rule thing. I have not been disrepectful, profane, and any of that ill stuff to you or anyone else. I give curt replies because I will not be baited to change the direction of my post and intent, and should this go against the rules, then you and I must interpret them better to communicate with one another. I am at your mercy.

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I think I was pretty clear that I wasn’t giving you any of kind of warning. But you are arguing with me anyway, so, IF I was to cite another rule, it would be.

e. “Trolling” is not allowed. This includes posting derogatory or inflammatory messages with the intent to bait an overheated response, as well as behavior that in the Moderators’ judgement is gratuitously argumentative, combative, or inflammatory with the apparent intent to prolong debate for its own sake rather than promote, defend, or critique a particular idea or point of view.

The point is not the rules, since you are just doing this thread off on your own and not really hurting anyone. The point is, there are rules.

You said:

That’s the opposite of engaging in inquiry. I haven’t said anything like “either engage or leave”. I didn’t even imply it. I merely pointed out that is the point of having this forum. Inquiry. And you threw a fit.

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He didn’t ask me to read the rules. He asked you to read the rules. I just let you know there is more than one mod on this forum. Lausten and I are both mods. Surely you aren’t that ignorant of the English language.

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He’s not baiting you. He’s telling you the rules because of redundancy in your posts. It seems to me you are asking for a warning and possibly eventual banning since you are refusing to abide by the rules.

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26

Jufa, sometimes it is hard to communicate. For example, “light of his glory,” is Egyptian thinking. Solomon was king in Israel. Had 1,000 wives. Built temples of religion for his wives that had different religions. What the Jewish temple wanted done was to have only one god worshiped. Their god. Today we have Christians reading the text and making other viewpoints from the text. Light means knowledge. The “Knowledge of his glory”. Darkness is without knowledge. Olives do not grow well in Egypt. The hills in Israel were growing the olive oil for Egypt at the time this was written and there was a lot of interfacing going on. In Egypt, you got knowledge entering the body by light. Knowledge was stored in t the heart, not the brain.

I don’t know Joseph Campbell. But isn’t he saying that you should use your own pathway. Whereas King OT is saying to follow god’s pathway?

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Can you define your concept of Grace in more detail? AFAIK, this is your main point.

One must acquire Grace to be able to experience life to its fullest, no?

“Sometimes, in order to see the light, you have to risk the dark.”

Minority Report (2002)

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Grace is the activity of Christ in man’s life demonstrating and living in the knowledge, protection, and power that there are no conditions, or outside powers, principalities or laws, in the cosmic human world of matter which can ever oppose the Word of God.

Grace, therefore, as Melchizedek, as Christ, are just names which represent an activity in consciousness, and an activity in consciousness is reflective of the degree of faith one lives by according to the knowledge There is no need for Spirit to wait.

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And what is the “Word of God” ? Do you have knowledge of the Word of God aside from what Scripture tells you?

And why is it impossible to have Grace without Christ? Does that not sound a little vain? Just like Muslims say there is no Grace without Muhammad. Do Muslims have Grace?

Does a tribesman in the deep forest have no Grace because he has never heard of Christ? Careful now, here we are entering the forest of hypocrisy and prejudice.

Come to think of it, the label of “apostate” is a graceless hypocritical prejudicial statement.

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I do not adhere to hearsay, or what J.Campbell asserted, this is as looking in the dark to find light when all one has to do is flick the switch of the light of His glory of I in the midst of thee, and the darkness is no more. I am that path, for I am the consciousness of the I in the midst of me, yet, that I is the source of Consciousness.

Regardless of what religion, philosophers, psychologists, science, or the psychic medium says, there is only One Life. That life, for man comes in the invisible form as breath, and is the law of the Spirit of life which awakens the awareness of Something governing life beyond assumptions, and second handed intellectual interpretations of psychological indoctrination which has the human sense consciousness groping to find a anthropomorphic god.

It is the Spirit of life which moves over the face of all dimensions, levels, and nths of consciousness everywhere, and sets infinities standards of Itself, second by second within the breath one breath. This is why we are told, to “honor the Lord with all thy substance,” for " Son, thou art ever with me, and all that I have is thine."

Never give power to anything a person believes is their source of strength - jufa

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You are the word of God, the Word of His glory, IChrist. it is impossible for you to leave out of you, and you are the Breath of life you breathe. Is there anyother you displaying the Spirit of life you are living?

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Yes, that path lies within only you. But all your mind can do is make a best guess of what is consciousness to begin with.

The source of all life and evolved consciousness is abiogenesis. Dynamic chemistry and natural selection over long periods of time for self-organizing pattern formation adapted for efficient function in a specific environment.

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When one steps into the "I’ of Being they comprehend worldwide people are the same. Their basic needs: seeing, hearing, touching, tasting, smelling, thinking rationally, and analyzing thoughts they have received as well as those already set upon the rotunda of living between the arc of birth and death.

For all mankind these are normal tendencies. And every action and event people indulge in are branch-shoots with multiple experiences which increase knowledge, desires, goals, and lust tolerable and intolerable. The reality of the moment of depth realization is ideas a human mind has set in motion are not the reality of oneself, and cannot be denied or ‘take back’. Once the ship has sailed consciously in our minds, it has moved from the dock of the bay and set sails upon rivers, seas, and oceans of inevitability.

From the moment of sail, man’s realization of depth has been touched, and automatically the winds of thoughts for him have changed drastically. Whether this difference is analyzed from a position of rejection or acceptance, man will not be able to deny that which has come upon him is his, and he has now come to know the dual probing of his ego is his stagnation. Consequently, there has been a reality shift.

Never give power to anything a person believes is their source of strength - jufa

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I agree. But religion does not teach this, quite the contrary. Religion is fundamentally prejudicial.

Only secular all-inclusive philosophy can grasp and respect the natural order imposed by inherent fundamental values and mathematical deterministic processes.

The problem is not a lack of knowledge of religion (+3500 years ), it is a lack of knowledge of science.

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35

The source of all life and evolved consciousness is abiogenesis. Dynamic chemistry and natural selection

You were none of the above before you came by way of lust. You began when two thoughts collided in two different individual minds, and then physical union, which initiated the Law of the Spirit of Life to activate. Had not that Spirit entered the life which developed from the life Spirit of two individuals, you would have been stillborn, and none of the above which you claim is the source of life would have matter. You see, there can be no subject where there is no cause. What is the cause of the of cause?

Are you going to answer the question I ask you which is: Is there anyother you displaying the Spirit of life you are living?

Never give power to anything a person believes is their source of strength - jufa

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[quote=“jufa, post:35, topic:8935”]
You were none of the above before you came by way of lust. You began when two thoughts collided in two different individual minds, and then physical union, which initiated the Law of the Spirit of Life to activate.

The beginning of the universe was an act of “lust”?

Had not that Spirit entered the life which developed from the life Spirit of two individuals, you would have been stillborn, and none of the above which you claim is the source of life would have matter.

That is a narrow perspective of nature. Does a virus possess a Spirit ? It enters its life cycle via the mitotic (electro-chemical) process of a host cell.

You see, there can be no subject where there is no cause. What is the cause of the of cause?

Oh, there can be a cause without “intent”. Mineral chemistry is unintentional cause and effect. It is a purely mathematical process based on mathematical permissions and restrictions. All that is required is a dynamic environment that allows for stochastic interaction of relational values, via logically ordered (mathematical) processes.

Are you going to answer the question I ask you which is: Is there anyother you displaying the Spirit of life you are living?

From what I understand, science suggests that consciousness is an emergent property from certain complex processing patterns of sensory observation and recognition of the data being processes.

All interactive processes are a form of mathematical equations and functions that allows for rudimentary recognition of common denominators (values) in sensory experiences.

Example: The eye began as a light-sensitive chemical patch and over billions of years evolved in what may be called the most advanced eyes in nature as found in predatory birds like the eagle.

Large quantities of H and O can produce H2O in 3 different emergent states; solid (ice), liquid (water), or gaseous (vapor), depending on the temperature and density of the molecular pattern.

A young Sunflower tracks the sun’s trajectory in the sky (heliotropism). Why ? To receive maximum solar energy.

While these are not conscious processes, they are chemically cognitive processes.
Evolution has given almost all living organisms different levels of cognitive powers from chemical attraction and repulsion to the highly evolved conscious cognitive sensory observational powers in complex life forms. Humans are but one species with extraordinary mental acuity and experiential responses to sensory input.

The “mirror neural network” in many animals is but one evolved shared observational experience and IMO is the foundation for "empathy " and by extension for “compassion” as the seat of morality.

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Great answer. I can’t improve on that.

Questioners like jufa might not like it though. I would add that we are, within these processes and equations, each unique, an expression of millions of possible combinations of those equations that appears as something new, something not yet expressed.

If we had a billion years of perception across a trillion light years of space, maybe we’d see the repetition. Maybe we’d feel a little less unique. That’s the wonder of chaos theory and our tiny place in that vast expanse. Maybe these thoughts aren’t original, but they seem so to me. That’s fine.

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Yes and I would venture to add that we see repetition of many processes everyday in our shared reality.

As Anil Seth posits; " We 're all hallucinating all the time, including right now. It’s just that when we agree about our hallucinations, we call that reality .

“Agreement” is an indication of shared experiential brain processes based on “recognition” of the same data and compared to data in our memories.

As Seth demonstrates, new data is seldom agreed on initially . Eye witnesses of an event can have several interpretations made from their individual perspective (hence Relativity).

Case in point: “Reality” is constructed by your brain. Here’s what that means, and why it matters.

Fix your gaze on the black dot on the left side of this image. But wait! Finish reading this paragraph first. As you gaze at the left dot, try to answer this question: In what direction is the object on the right moving? Is it drifting diagonally, or is it moving up and down?

Remember, focus on the dot on the left.

Courtesy of Patrick Cavanagh

It appears as though the object on the right is moving diagonally, up to the right and then back down to the left. Right? Right?! Actually, it’s not. It’s moving up and down in a straight, vertical line.

See for yourself. Trace it with your finger.

This is a visual illusion. That alternating black-white patch inside the object suggests diagonal motion and confuses our senses. Like all misperceptions, it teaches us that our experience of reality is not perfect. But this particular illusion has recently reinforced scientists’ understanding of deeper, almost philosophical truths about the nature of our consciousness.

“It’s really important to understand we’re not seeing reality,” says neuroscientist Patrick Cavanagh, a research professor at Dartmouth College and a senior fellow at Glendon College in Canada. “We’re seeing a story that’s being created for us.”

More …

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It’s moving diagonally (back and forth from the lower left corner to the upper right corner, but touching neither, of course), not left to right or up and down. Then again, I often saw both with most games of optical illusions. This is just another version of both, I guess.

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Actually it does not move diagonally but straight up and down. The diagonal effect is already illusionary.

To see the dot move horizontally focus on the sentence " Remember, focus on the dot left" above the picture. It is more effective than the left dot.

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