The conversation was between you and I
This thread is 500 posts long.
Ah ha …
I confess I haven’t read this entire thread, and I apologize if this discusssion already covered these details.
I’m not even sure if I can post a link here, but:
Most importantly, I do not vouch for the integrity of this site that I’ve linked to.
The one thing that I do understand is that history can be revisionist, but still the truth can be found, especially in recent history. The narratives presented in the Western media are all coherent and limit or obfuscate the inconvenient details of who is running Ukraine, and who got them into power, and on and on it seems the lies go. That this new set of lies has been piled on an older pile of lies to reignite the cold war with Russia is the choice of the deep state. Russiagate is largely falsified now, but it built the foundation for this next stage. Really, attempting to zoom out and question the times that we are in can lead to some extraordinary levels of theorizing. In some regards the ranking of the lies exposes the ranking of the desperation. One day soon the director of the CIA will get up to the mic and start quacking like a duck and we’ll see all the media people with their microphones and cameras quacking like ducks. This is how absurd the narrative has become. Meanwhile there are stories of Russians being skinned alive. Complicity…
Yes, poor Russians, bad Ukrainians.
You were doing so good until you started blaming the US for misrepresenting facts.
Have a look at this if you can see some parallels with Hitler’s start of WWII.
In early 1938, under increasing pressure from pro-unification activists, Austrian chancellor Kurt Schuschnigg announced that there would be a referendum on a possible union with Germany versus maintaining Austria’s sovereignty to be held on 13 March.
Portraying this as defying the popular will in Austria and Germany, Hitler threatened an invasion and secretly pressured Schuschnigg to resign.
A day before the planned referendum, on 12 March, the German Heer crossed the border into Austria, unopposed by the Austrian military. A plebiscite was held on 10 April, in which the ballot was not secret, and threats and coercion were employed to manipulate the vote, resulting in 99.7% approval for the Anschluss.
Of course Hitler didn’t stop there, just as Putin will not stop trying to restore the old boundaries of the USSR.
What is your source on this?
What is your source here please??
Vladimir Putin’s Russia: Trying to Rebuild the Soviet Era?
For Vladimir Putin, the Soviet Union’s fall was “the greatest geopolitical tragedy of the 20th century.” Russian foreign policy has sought to re-impose control over former Soviet countries.
Apr 28, 2022 • By Tsira Shvangiradze, MA Diplomacy and Int’l Politics, BA Int’l Relations
Vladimir Putin has been in office as a president or prime minister of the Russian Federation since August 9, 1999, for more than 20 years. During the years of his presidency and premiership, he has pursued the goals of uniting the Russian Federation into a strong, independent nation and restoring Russia’s supremacy on an international scene as a great power.
However, on his way to achieving these goals, the evolution of Russian foreign policy has been viewed by other nations as Russia trying to gain influence over post-Soviet countries and deterring the expansion of Western institutes, particularly the North Atlantic Treaty Organization (NATO).
more…
Vladimir Putin’s Russia: Trying to Rebuild the Soviet Era?
I dont see anywhere here that his aim is to restore the USSR. Can you throw some light on this?
Here’s my prediction, I can prove it using all of the data in the entire world. Putin won’t specifically say that his goal is to restore the Soviet Union, and that he won’t stop trying. You can prove me wrong with one quote.
Hell just look at his posters, or that endless march down the halls, when he has some great state event with him winding up standing there in the middle of some endless palace reception room -at a great distance from everyone else.
I googled, “Russians being skinned alive?? - Google Search” there was the Russian soldier, oh but that was before the war, and though it was probably a Ukrainian bear.
[### Video: Russian soldier ‘skinned alive’ by mother bear …
Daily Mail
https://www.dailymail.co.uk › news › video-2035924]Oct 26, 2019 — Video: Russian soldier, 36, dies in hospital nine days after being ‘skinned alive’ by mother bear protecting two cubs as he collected crabs …
Oh, but let’s see what’s more recent, there’s this near the top
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Now thats a word salad
You realize the absurdity of what you’re asking, right? Explain how your request to prove what Putin is thinking is rational and worthy of this of this forum?
No, that’s the domain of a lonely dictator. Paranoia and fear…
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Do you have the source for your USSR comment?
Here’s a view from a Ukrainian on the east side:
Indeed, the idea that we might prove anything on this forum, especially given the propaganda state in which we live, is dubious. In hindsight, I’m pretty sure it is accepted fact that Nazis did have lampshades made of Jewish human skin. But in this moment of that time such a claim would be seen as blasphemy, I’m sure.
It would be ideal if we all took a pledge to seek the truth, but this is rarely the human way. Especially in this setting of a reignited cold war; something, again, from the past. Now it isn’t even cold. CIA agents dumping concrete powder in the milk truck headed for a grade school in Cuba… this was cold war tactics. Now it seems for some the deep state does not exist, while torture in Guantanamo bay can be put aside really as a thing of the past, given the present slate. As you can see I, as an American( a misnomer, really), will continue to focus on my own country’s wrong doings in these situations. That we are in bed with Nazis in Ukraine is finally surfacing as fact, but it has taken some time, hasn’t it? What was going on in the interim? Was it sheer propaganda that you fell for in your Russia hating frenzy? The lack of integrity is entirely on the West’s side, and you can ultimately I believe point the finger over the Atlantic Ocean to find its true source on the playing field. How they’ve managed to gain control over so many media sources is a great puzzle to me, and the stupendous nature of what we witness, with so few truth tellers coming forward, is nearly unbelievable. That this thing as an organism or as a machine has been built can be proven, and I suppose it must sometimes be one small detail at a time, and really just a few of these small details can provide the sort of accountability that is needed.
As we develop our beliefs in our living rooms from these dubious sources, what right does any of us have to claim that we have the truth on our side? It obviously takes more than a big name source spouting lies along with every other big name source. We’ve seen that plenty now. They can all be dismissed. Independent journalists now lead the way in the pursuit of the truth, while all others may be safely deposited in the garbage can.
Here’s a recent study; not a balanced playing field, but a counterpoise to the Western narrative:
Basically sounds like they think Russian has a right to own Ukraine, and that Ukraine wanting to remain independent is the problem
As for this democratically elected, then ousted President Viktor Yanukovych, he was a Russian puppet - don’t make him out to be a Ukrainian hero.
That sounds pretty naive.
“Independent” in who’s eye’s?
“all others” lordie that’s a big tent!
This may not seem related, but it is:
https://www.cnn.com/2022/03/26/politics/trump-putin-ukraine/index.html
Yet another knee jerk predictable response unable to even make an attempt to confront the points made in the maidan video discussion Timb posted.
If its not related -dont post it oh lordie!!!
What “study”? 15:00 what a pretentious Russian-centric just-so-story.
17:00 Counter-point given (Dr. Steven Hall), (this guy made it interesting and kept me from turning off the interview)
24:45 - it was telling that after he was done, announcer said: “Well don’t say we don’t give everyone a fair say …” as if dismissing everything that just got said.
Rebuttel - all about Russian interests
Okay so Ukraine has always suffered from it’s strategic location.
Doesn’t justify what Putin has/is done/doing in Ukraine.
32:00 interesting comment that makes me think of DeSantis - “if I win 51% of the vote I still have the right to 100% of the power”. I’m being told NATO wanted 100% of Ukraine - but that’s total BS, a presence heck yes. Why not?
But that’s the reasoning why Russian started the war, they want Ukraine 100%.
33:00 it gets even worse. NATO & west had no right to assume any interest in Ukraine - and Putin had every right to feel that Ukraine flirting with the West was unacceptable because he wanted all of Ukraines attentions. It’s a psycho-killer’s rational.
There’s no sense of fair play among this crowd.
Russia = Free Pass
West/NATO = demon, the melodramatic total villain.
Ignoring that NATO is interested in building connections with Ukraine because it is the buffer with Russian and it feels that Russian wants 100% influence over Ukraine, and that would make the world an uglier, unsafer place. NATO doesn’t want 100% of Ukraine, they do want partnerships. But Putin is like the bully lover, if I can’t have you all to myself, no one can and I will destroy you.
timbandtech, why do you seem to sympathize and support Putin even after all this. I mean I kinda admired Putin, a dictator, but it seemed he did have the interests of his people in mind - then the bully con-man and ultra narcissist trump got into power and he simply couldn’t contain his man-crush for the Russian strong-man dictator Vladimir Putin.
Putin played Trump like a puppet, unfortunately the trumpkin worship got into Putin’s head like a cancer, it started poisoning what rationality (and humanity) his supremacist mind still possessed. MacBeth, Hamlet come to mind, though I don’t know my Shakespeare well enough to recall which hits closer to the mark.
Seems like a lot of partisan hair splitting, all intend to distract from the War Putin initiated. Nothing that happened in Madain justifies the kind of killing and bloodshed and destruction and waste of precious resources for humanity, that Putin has initiated and sustains the last year+.
All this hairsplitting is distractions …
For those tuning into the Al Mayadeen show, it might help to have another tab or two open to some historical narrative for a healthy counter point. The talk is interesting, but quite blind-sided, it’s just more dribbling the ball around.
What a distract this has been for me and a nice Sunday. I usually sidestep this topic, too helpless and hopeless to allow it too much of my attention. Still sometimes I do think about the horror and it’s not a place I want to visit too much.
There’s nothing good about this war and seems like all parties have guilt and blood on their hands, still in the end it’s Putin demanding Ukraine belongs to him.
That Al Mayadeen discussion does nothing to alter that - it simply highlights our collective failure, . . .
This is Putin’s war of choice, and it’s worth condemning,
just like the Cheney/Bush Administration’s idiotic excursion into SHOCK’n HORROR for the adrenaline rush, opportunistic political power grab, and good ol war-profiteering on the side, is worth condemning.
We’re all guilt. Wait a minute, most of us are sheople, so the moral question is: Are we blind, deft and disinterested innocent victims - or does the collective apathy make the ‘we’ architects of our own destiny, so do we deserve it as much as our ego-blinded leaders?
We The People did wield a lot of power once, but we’ve let it slip away, hell, we’ve let it be stripped away, so now all bets are off.
But no need to worry too much, the die has been cast, it’ll be catching up with all of us soon enough. As the era of winners and loser transitions into a future when our sins, disregard and omissions unfold into . . .
Enjoy today the best you can.