So you agree with me that he would be a socialist?
What would Jesus be when he returns?Ow, ow, I know, I know. But you won't like it.
sorry, sometimes I’m just sooo bad. Guess it was all those words,
Most people don't want to think, so they need religion, if society is to function.But then there's Jesus, and why we have such a hard time figuring out he's a lesson - I don't get.
Yeah, sure a Lesson, or a riddle if you like, the Passion of Jesus, isn’t that the core? But how many people actually discuss that? I hear a lot about him dying on the cross then resurrection and everyone’s saved who believes in him. Presto jesto. But that’s not the Passion of Jesus.
As with most important lessons in life you can get something out of it, or it can fly right past ya.
Jesus would have probably not have joined a political group other than his own and probably wouldn’t vote either. But ideologically, hands down, he was a socialist. In fact the only time he got REALLY pissed off and became physically violent was when he whipped and ran the money changers (capitalists) out of the Temple.
(CC: shh… I think Allah is a bit of a slave driver, too.)
(CC: shh… I think Allah is a bit of a slave driver, too.)
Well yeah, going by the Q’uran and more so by the Hadith…
However, it needs to be recognised that much of the Q’uran was lifted from the Torah. Sharia law about which everyone complains is nothing more than Mosaic law of which the are 613 commandments (collectively 'mitzvot) . The Jews moved on centuries ago; EG Jews no longer sell their daughters into slavery, or kill recalcitrant children and no longer stone people for adultery. Not sure where the hacking off of limbs came from.-----Possibly Hammurabi, whose laws we have only a few.
"Ex. Law #196: “If a man destroy the eye of another man, they shall destroy his eye. If one break a man’s bone, they shall break his bone. If one destroy the eye of a freeman or break the bone of a freeman he shall pay one gold mina. If one destroy the eye of a man’s slave or break a bone of a man’s slave he shall pay one-half his price.”[24] Heavy emphasis on compensation. A bit like the Egyptian law of Maat, which is about balance and order and includes justice.
Generally speaking, Muslims have also moved on. There are a small percentage of extremists, such as the Wahhabi sect found mainly in Saudi Arabia. They still like to hack off limbs and behead people publicly. Much of their extreme behaviour comes from the Hadith, commentaries and stories from the life of the prophet. They are not considered divine revelation and are not canonical.
Some of the more extreme treatment of women such as the burqa/niqab and female circumcision, are tribal customs and predate Islam by centuries
I keep in mind my own observation that without exception, religions reflect the culture which practices them. Like the Jews, the arabs are semitic tribal people , originally nomadic sheep and goat herders. A harsh life, with continuous fighting and blood feuds with other tribes. This has only stopped in the last hundred years or so.
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What about Jesus.?? Loved the idea of slaves. So much so he told them to obey their masters
“What about Jesus.?? Loved the idea of slaves. So much so he told them to obey their masters”
Not at all strange to me. I’m an atheist. Assuming Jesus actually existed, he was a pretty typical rabbi of his time and place.
New Testament comments about slavery become not only problematic, but downright embarrassing if one insists Jesus was god.
The Torah has plenty to say in support of slavery.
Perhaps the most important named slave in the Bible is " Hagar the Egyptian". She was ‘the handmaiden’ (slave) of Abraham. He "went to her’ (raped her).As a result, she bore a son, Ishmael, who is recognised by Jews, Christian and Muslims as the father of the Arab people.-Abraham’s son Isaac, with Abraham’s wife Sarah, was father of the Jews.
Old testament better than koran on slavery
Patrick D.
Perhaps the most important named slave in the Bible is ” Hagar the Egyptian”. She was ‘the handmaiden’ (slave) of Abraham. He “went to her’ (raped her).As a result, she bore a son, Ishmael, who is recognised by Jews, Christian and Muslims as the father of the Arab people.-Abraham’s son Isaac, with Abraham’s wife Sarah, was father of the Jews.
Abe must have had one hell of a set of genes.
I guess that if Hagar could have gotten an abortion based on being raped, we could have a lot fewer problems in the world, today.
TimB wrote:
<p style=“padding-left: 40px;”>I guess that if Hagar could have gotten an abortion based on being raped, we could have a lot fewer problems in the world, today.</p>
<p style=“padding-left: 40px;”>You said it! </p>
<p style=“padding-left: 40px;”></p>
Some of the more extreme treatment of women such as the burqa/niqab and female circumcision, are tribal customs and predate Islam by centuries.Yes. Female circumcision is more of an African practice; it's not found in most of the muslim world. And burkas stem from clothing needed as protection against the sand and sun.
I keep in mind my own observation that without exception, religions reflect the culture which practices them. Like the Jews, the arabs are semitic tribal people , originally nomadic sheep and goat herders. A harsh life, with continuous fighting and blood feuds with other tribes. This has only stopped in the last hundred years or so.Excellent point, though I'm not sure it has stopped...…..maybe slowed down a little. A big problem we had in Iraq was not being familiar with the different clans and how much they hate each other. Although it's not like we could've been that familiar with it.
You’re quite right of course. I guess I came over a bit ethnocentric. I forgot the Christian --Muslim hatred in the former Yugoslavia as well as the Shia-Sunni thing In Iraq, and I haven’t even started on the various terrorist groups.
An aside about Iraq; Saddam Hussein was born in the same town as the most famous muslim (in the West) who ever lived; A Kurd from Tikrit ; Sallah al Din .
Well, there must be something in the water in Tikrit.
Makes you wonder what Hussein thought of Saladin in light of the fact that he slaughtered hundreds of thousands of Kurds.
Nobody in that region likes Kurds for some reason.
“Nobody in that region likes Kurds for some reason.”
Don’t know about’ nobody’ ,but Saddam certainly hated them. Hatreds in that part of the world can span centuries.
A good example is ‘,mainstream’ Jews’ and the Samaritans. Jesus may have chose them for his ‘who is my neighbour’ parable because they were a hated minority. To outsiders, just another sect of Jews. To orthodox Jews, they were heretics, not strictly jews.
Today, Samaritans still exist. There seems to be about 3000 of them left, and they mostly live in Israel. Jews and Samaritans apparently still don’t play well together.
I think no one over there, other than the Kurds themselves want the Kurds to have their own homeland. Maybe because they are afraid of the Kurds who seem, relatively, to be badasses compared to any other fighting forces over there (even without the benefits of having their own state).
Yeah, I get that Kurds have a reputation for fierceness. I think I’d be pretty cranky too if people were always trying to wipeout me and mine. I’ve never quite grasped the often obsessive desire for ‘a homeland’. Certainly gives people a reason to kill other people. I don’t think I’d be willing to die for a political ideal. Would still be willing to fight if someone invaded my country. I’d belt 'em with my walking stick, and set Major, my Jack Russell ,on 'em!
There’s an interesting Aussie film, based on “Red Dawn”, called “Tomorrow ,When The War Began”. There’s also a pretty boring series.
Do you know the name of the Afghan fighters who have been fighting off invaders for centuries? Is it an elite group, or just ‘ordinary’ Afghans?
Do you know the name of the Afghan fighters who have been fighting off invaders for centuries? Is it an elite group, or just ‘ordinary’ Afghans?Pashtuns?
I think no one over there, other than the Kurds themselves want the Kurds to have their own homeland. Maybe because they are afraid of the Kurds who seem, relatively, to be badasses compared to any other fighting forces over there (even without the benefits of having their own state).Well the problem is not really that others are preventing Kurds from having a nation state, the Kurds themselves are too disorganized to establish one.
IDK if the Kurds have had much of a realistic chance to have their own state. They seem to be organized enuf to survive, surrounded by enemies, and organized enuf to kick butt in military actions.