I used to be "normal"

Politics and Social Issues
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I have been thinking a lot lately about how much sexuality had changed since I got into the game in the '80s or so. It used to be that my sexuality was “normal”. Today, it’s “boring”. I’m a straight, white man who’s not into butt stuff (as in never tried it, refuse to try it), married to a straight, white woman who feels the same way about butt stuff. That used to be de facto “normal”. Butt stuff and bondage were kinky. The kind of thing you didn’t want people knowing about.

And then came the second sexual revolution, where people once thought to be on the fringe stood up in droves and said, “There is nothing wrong with me!” And now, it seems, I’m the weirdo. I guess butt stuff is “standard” these days. And there’s a whole lot more to people than “straight, gay or bi”. There is a whole, if I may borrow the term, rainbow of people out there with thoughts and feelings and desires my limited understanding never imagined.

Being the weirdo these days doesn’t bother me one bit, but it does make me a little sad. Not because I don’t have as much company as once thought I did, but because I imagine what it must have been like for all of those people to go through their entire lives thinking that they were the weirdos, that there was something wrong with them. By the time I became the weirdo there was no longer anything wrong with being different. I will never know their suffering. Not that the religious reich (did I misspell that? Oops!) yet accepts the reality of what is actually “normal” yet, so it’s not like anything has changed for me in any real way.

There was no point to this other than to get people to think about what our friends, our family, our neighbors and the loudest anti-gay Republicans must have gone through, and many are still going through. It’s a long road to actual social acceptance, made longer by intolerant leaders, and longer still by intolerant leaders who hate themselves for being one of the people they hate so much. Many of them, I’m sure, had a very hard time just accepting themselves because of the lies society told them, never mind gaining acceptance from others. I can only imagine, but I would guess that “coming out” to one’s self was, for some people, as hard as coming out to friends and family. Society told them that they were weird, even without knowing who they were. It must have been frustrating and confusing to hear personal praise for being a good human beings while being told that people like their secret selves couldn’t be good people. And so, so lonely.

I think that’s one thing we forget when we’re talking about or to non-straight people; that they went through a whole lot of messed up shit, often with no support, that shaped their emotional state today. Today we think, “Gay means happy!”, but we must not forget what society did to these people our entire lives before they could get to “happy”. I know I’m guilty of reacting to something a non-straight person says without considering the journey they took to get to where they are, the anger, depression and anguish many of them suffered that helped to shape their current world view. I only think of “the now”, when they are generally accepted, and don’t consider “back then”, which is part of what made them who they are, and the extremes, which they often still suffer today, especially with so much hate emanating from the White House.

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I suggest that you and your wife try a little butt stuff. As T rump is perpetually trying to f___ us in the a__, it might not be as big a shock if you are already broken in.

 

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You’re still normal. Sometimes being online too much makes one think the deviants are more numerous than they really are.

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First, not butt stuff. Ever. Never going to happen. It grosses me out.

Second, people aren’t deviants for being “not like me”. Yes, I am still technically “normal”. But so is everyone else.

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1/2

I’m boringly “normal.” But I am moved by the personal experiences of those who “aren’t.”

I support LGBQT rights, not because I’m LGBQT myself – in fact, I have a visceral “ickiness” around the topic – but because I’ve read so many PERSONAL ACCOUNTS of their lives and their experiences.

One thing that bugs me about Conservatives in general: They ignore and invalidate the personal, lived experiences of the majority of those in the minority groups who are different from themselves. Yes, they have tokens: Kanye West, Candace Owens, Diamond and Silk, Milo Yiannopoulos… but “exceptions to the rule” still prove the rule. When the VAST majority of a group opposes certain people or policies, it seems you ought to listen to them to find out WHY. But Right-Wingers won’t, especially if the topic makes them uncomfortable.

Evangelicals have their token “ex-gays,” like First Stone Ministries and based on those exceptions (most of which turn out to be BS), they proclaim that being LGBTQ is a “personal choice,” and that LGBTQ and pedophilia are the same. The actual experiences of these people don’t impact them.

Take trans issues: Evangelicals claim that parents manipulate their kids to be trans, or that it’s a phase, or they confuse it with cross dressing. A million trans people can present their personal experiences to the contrary, but it doesn’t matter to them. They all “know” what LGBTQ people (and liberals and nonbelievers) “really” think.

(Con’t)

 

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2/2

A couple years ago, I found out my stepson & his girlfriend’s roommate was trans. I thought, “ew.” The whole bathroom rights thing creeped me out too.
But I was interested in THEIR experiences. So I discovered Nicole Maines. Reading her family’s story TRANSFORMED my views on this issue.

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For those not familiar: Identical twins Wyatt and Jonas were born in 1997 and adopted by Wayne and Kelly Maines, who were THRILLED to have 2 little boys.

As many adoptive parents do, they documented their children’s lives very closely in journals and videos. It’s that documentatation that makes this case extraordinary.

AS AN INFANT, Wyatt was displaying behaviors typical of female infants (such as certain patterns of eye contact).

By the age of 3, Wyatt was identifying as female – AND his twin brother Jonas perceived Wyatt as his sister.

The father, Wayne, was a hunter, a sports buff, and a Conservative Republican in the Air Force. He CLEARLY did not want Wyatt to be a girl. While he wasn’t harsh or punitive, the journals and videos reveal that for years, he tried to discourage Wyatt’s feminine behavior.

The mom, Kelly, was more willing to let the child be what the child was, and eventually Wayne moved out of the house. But over time he began to understand. Eventually, he helped HIS DAUGHTER NICOLE claim her rights, all the way to the Supreme Court:

Nicole Amber Maines is was the anonymous plaintiff, Susan Doe, in the Maine Supreme Judicial Court case Doe v. Regional School Unit 26 regarding gender identity and bathroom use in schools. Maines, who is transgender, was barred from using the female bathroom after a complaint; however, the court ruled denying a transgender student access to the bathroom consistent with their gender identity is unlawful.
https://time.com/4096479/houston-equal-rights-ordinance-wayne-maines/

Reading “Becoming Nicole” helped me understand how trans people think of themselves, based on their own personal experiences…and it helped me understand WHY it’s so important that trans children be able to use the bathroom of their gender identity.

The author, Amy Ellis Nutt, is a Pulitzer-Prize winning journalist who specializes in neuroscience. She explains the new and quickly advancing science of gender.

Conservatives and Evangelicals may scoff, GOD MADE THEM MALE AND FEMALE! PERIOD!! IT’S IN THE BIBLE!!!*

But scientifically, it ISN’T so simple. The fact that these are genetically identical actually makes an excellent study. The author explains the MANY factors that can affect one fetus in utero.

Christian media totally misinterpreted the issue:

Nicole Maines is now Dreamer on CW’s “Supergirl.”

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Her whole family is super supportive and close.

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I’m sure this bugs some people.

I still get ikked out by the idea of LGBTQ folks having sex – I’m very, very hetero. But I don’t have to have sex with them!!

Just:

LISTEN TO WHAT PEOPLE TELL YOU ABOUT THEMSELVES.

*I didn’t even know this till I read the book, but the Evangelicals are wrong about this, too!

 

 

Judaism recognized not two, but as many as eight genders... The Mishnah describes half a dozen categories that are between male and female, such as saris or ailonit — the terms refer to an non-reproductive version of the male or female body, respectively — and categories that refer to ambiguous or indeterminate gender.
https://www.jta.org/jewniverse/2015/the-6-genders-of-the-talmud
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Oh wow. 8 genders in the Talmud. Talk about lost knowledge. I never knew that.

Anyway, I am not bothered by people’s sexuality. Whatever it is, it is between them and whatever adult consenting partners that they have in sexual relationships. I do admit to being a bit irked by gay guys who act super-prissy, but that’s about it.

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Evangelicals have their token “ex-gays,” like First Stone Ministries and based on those exceptions (most of which turn out to be BS), they proclaim that being LGBTQ is a “personal choice,” and that LGBTQ and pedophilia are the same. The actual experiences of these people don’t impact them.
That last one is actually a very Catholic thing as well, so it's not just the stuffy, closed minded evangelicals who think that being gay and being a pedophile are exactly the same.

Let each person be who they are, and nobody can better tell you who that is than they can. Growing up, my friends would call each other “fag” in jest and such things. We would say things like, “That’s gay!” On one level, nothing was meant by it. But on another, it was meant to be an insult. So I, personally, helped contribute to the isolation these people grew up with, if not directly, then indirectly by perpetuating the discriminatory culture. And for that, I am truly sorry. I didn’t understand. But now I do. At least a little.

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@widdershins

And for that, I am truly sorry. I didn’t understand. But now I do. At least a little.
Most of us are in the same boat.
That last one is actually a very Catholic thing as well, so it’s not just the stuffy, closed minded evangelicals who think that being gay and being a pedophile are exactly the same.
Yes. This is definitely true.

BTW to clarify the Evangelical “purity culture” … Every form of Christianity has demonized even normal sexuality, and Catholics have been particularly horrible on premarital sex, masturbation and abortion.

But in recent decades the Evangelicals got even creepier with it. The “Purity Movement” turns out to be even more damaging. They hold “purity balls:”

One widely used pledge for fathers reads: “I, (daughter's name)'s father, choose before God to cover my daughter as her authority and protection in the area of purity."

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(Coincidentally, these have been quite popular in Patriarchal families where daughters are already being controlled and abused…hmm)

The movement doesn’t just condemn sexual activity, but any sexual feelings whatsoever… and it expressly places 100% of the responsibility for controlling sexuality on the girl, amazingly more blatantly than Catholics have for a long time.

The movement is resulting in PTSD and divorce.

SICK.

 

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BTW to clarify the Evangelical “purity culture” … Every form of Christianity has demonized even normal sexuality, and Catholics have been particularly horrible on premarital sex, masturbation and abortion.

But in recent decades the Evangelicals got even creepier with it. The “Purity Movement” turns out to be even more damaging. They hold “purity balls:”


Catholics have been particularly horrible with premarital sex? I have literally heard unmarried, pregnant, teenage girls say, “I can’t use birth control. I’m Catholic.” My head about explodes when I hear that as I try to process the irony and figure out a way I can explain said irony to someone so ignorant as to utter those words as an unmarried, pregnant, teenage girl.

Yes, the whole “purity movement” really was creepy as hell. Of course it is when you see it for what it truly is, a way for men to control young women by teaching them that their natural biological urges were disgusting and they were vile people for having those urges. Then you throw in what, symbolically, looks a hell of a lot like a wedding between father and daughter and, yeah, ahead creep factor 16, captain.

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We do have a strange society. Girls grow up being conditioned to make themselves appear sexually attractive. This is ingrained so deeply, that most women will not go out in public without carefully applied makeup. The girls in the pictures above, who are being told they must have zero sexuality, all appear to be wearing make up. And have their hair done attractively, and are wearing dresses with no covering down to just over the tops of their breasts. How do the girls process the contradiction? They are compelled to be sexually attractive but must not even think about sex? Maybe the Evangelicals should go the burka route.

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Judaism recognized not two, but as many as eight genders… The Mishnah describes half a dozen categories that are between male and female, such as saris or ailonit — the terms refer to an non-reproductive version of the male or female body, respectively — and categories that refer to ambiguous or indeterminate gender.
Haha, Jews have always suffered high rates of mental illness. No wonder they invented psychotherapy.
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Reading “Becoming Nicole” helped me understand how trans people think of themselves, based on their own personal experiences…and it helped me understand WHY it’s so important that trans children be able to use the bathroom of their gender identity.
I think it’s unfair to make society accommodate trans people as they’re an extremely small segment of the population.
The author, Amy Ellis Nutt, is a Pulitzer-Prize winning journalist who specializes in neuroscience. She explains the new and quickly advancing science of gender.

Conservatives and Evangelicals may scoff, GOD MADE THEM MALE AND FEMALE! PERIOD!! IT’S IN THE BIBLE!!!*

But scientifically, it ISN’T so simple. The fact that these are genetically identical actually makes an excellent study. The author explains the MANY factors that can affect one fetus in utero.


Good point. The fetus is fucked up.

That reminds me of something I read a few years ago from a scientist named Greg Cochran which might help anybody who wants to understand this; it went something like the basic rule is heterosexuality is how the species propagates itself, so it is necessarily the norm everywhere, all the time. Anything which deviates from that is evolutionary maladaptive (meaning reproductive fitness is impeded) and therefore cannot be phenotypical. This means things like homosexuality, transgenderism, asexuality, pedophilia are best understood as developmental disorders. Nobody is born gay or trans or pedo, but research seems to show that some people seem to be born with a potential to become those orientations if the right (or wrong) environment is present.

Today we live in a society that accepts the first three as examples of human diversity, but we are also a society that is dying out.

Food for thought.

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I think it’s unfair to make society accommodate trans people as they’re an extremely small segment of the population.
Accommodating people is not hard when all you have to do is let them live.

We accommodate people with long hair and people who drive unnecessarily large pick-up trucks and people who like steampunk, so how is it unfair to also accommodate trans people?

Maybe you wish it was unfair so you wouldn’t have to do it.

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I did a search for Greg Cochran. OOF! A few of the sites that promote his ideas are pure racist garbage.

His views make me think he might soon be appointed by Trump to head something to do with health.

Thatoneguy, feel free to push prejudiced, ignorant, conspiracy theories, but don’t expect anyone with more than a dozen brain cells to fall for them.

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I think it’s unfair to make society accommodate trans people as they’re an extremely small segment of the population.
"All men are created equal." While that didn't mean shit when it was written, it means something now. Minorities have the same rights as us. All you have to do when you see a trans person is keep walking. And since, as you say, they're such a small percentage of the population, most of the time you never even need to think about them. I'm not sure to which "accommodations" you're referring.
Haha, Jews have always suffered high rates of mental illness. No wonder they invented psychotherapy.
That is a blatantly untrue and very racist stereotype.

https://www.myjewishlearning.com/article/judaism-and-mental-illness/

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@thatoneguy

 

I think it’s unfair to make society accommodate trans people as they’re an extremely small segment of the population.
How, specifically, is society "accommodating" them, other than allowing them to pee or poop in the bathroom of their own gender, just as the rest of us can do?

The point you’re missing is that they feel about their own gender the same as you feel about your own gender. Your gender is male, right? Imagine if you were prohibited by law from using the men’s room.

If your problem with the restroom issue is that you think trans rights are impacting your own rights (or your child’s rights), please read my very short & simple response on that:

 

Are you okay with a transgender woman walking into the bathroom with your child?

 

As for professional sports, etc., I realize the issue is more complex. But a small percentage of the population is still many many people, and they can’t just be ignored.

 

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@widdershins

Catholics have been particularly horrible with premarital sex?
 

I mean Catholicism. Its rules and dogma. I mean Catholicism has been very rigid, as a religion, against premarital sex.

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@timb

The girls in the pictures above, who are being told they must have zero sexuality, all appear to be wearing make up. And have their hair done attractively, and are wearing dresses with no covering down to just over the tops of their breasts. How do the girls process the contradiction? They are compelled to be sexually attractive but must not even think about sex?
EXACTLY.
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@thatoneguy

we are also a society that is dying out.
Um, what society is dying out?