This point is tertiary to my main thrust anyways. Why you singled this out is beyond me.(not really...)All of your points show a complete lack of understanding of how the world works. I'm not going to waste my time on all of them. Build better roads with what? Rocks and their bare hands? Fight corruption how? Your suggesting they act like they grew up in a middle class society with opportunity. You're blaming the victim. I'm not blaming anyone. I just don't want more illegal immigrants coming to this country. Why don't you build better walls. Get active in politics. Fight corruption. Work at it. That’s how it’s done.
Why don't you build better walls. Get active in politics. Fight corruption. Work at it. That’s how it’s done.I don't see corruption being a problem in this issue. A significant majority of Americans don't won't more illegal immigrants. We don't need walls. We need better enforcement of existing labor laws. That's the best "wall" we can build. The US and other countries are currently going through the throes of backlash against immigration-legal or illegal. It's quite easy to get active in politics in regards to these issues.
First, while many citizens are against illegal immigration, many businesses quietly promote it because they get good value for extremely low pay.
Second, a more pressing problem is legal immigration. Rather than subsidizing our own advanced education, companies go overseas to hire well trained people to come here for high paying jobs, thus keeping U.S. citizens out of them.
Occam
We don't need walls. We need better enforcement of existing labor laws.Yes, EMPLOYERS should be held to current laws and current laws should be strengthened. ] And here's what happens when you really get fought on immigrants] And apparently that kind of law has a negative affect on the economy, "HB 56 will reduce the Alabama economy by $40 million"]
First, while many citizens are against illegal immigration, many businesses quietly promote it because they get good value for extremely low pay. OccamOne Chamber of Commerce Board Member vote is equivalent to 50 regular citizens votes.
We don't need walls. We need better enforcement of existing labor laws.Yes, EMPLOYERS should be held to current laws and current laws should be strengthened. ] And here's what happens when you really get fought on immigrants] And apparently that kind of law has a negative affect on the economy, "HB 56 will reduce the Alabama economy by $40 million"] Whoopie do. Big companies want to continue a system of indentured servitude. Then let's show a picture of hard working man saying prayers at the dinner table. I don't care. Big companies-Poultry farms, vegetable farms, hog farms. All billion dollar industries. They could be paying people 45,000-60,000 dollars a year doing that stuff with full benefits etc. Or they could take advantage of an old system whereby shadow people sneak around and do the work for 1/3 or 1/2 the price. Great employees!! Can't complain. Can't file for workers comp. Can't redress grievances. Can be replaced at any time. Can be worked long hours. Can be worked temporarily. And American workers wonder why their wages are so low. Why they have no benefits that are worthwhile. Illegal immigrants are one of the factors that have eroded US Labor Power. Just like out-sourcing work to other countries. They either bring the work to foreigners or bring the foreigners to the work. And alot of it is jobs American will do...or used to do. That's the bottom line. Great, you get a warm fuzzy feeling sticking up for people you can relate to. That's your prerogative.
Why don't you build better walls. Get active in politics. Fight corruption. Work at it. That’s how it’s done.I don't see corruption being a problem in this issue. A significant majority of Americans don't won't more illegal immigrants. We don't need walls. We need better enforcement of existing labor laws. That's the best "wall" we can build. The US and other countries are currently going through the throes of backlash against immigration-legal or illegal. It's quite easy to get active in politics in regards to these issues. I agree, and have for some time thought, that effectively prohibiting employers from hiring illegal immigrants would be the most effective way of addressing the problem. And building walls? If you had ever been to Big Bend National Park, you would recognize the absolute absurdity of building and policing walls across our entire border.
I completely agree. This immigrant issue is the biggest Boondoggle the US Liberals and or Left has. "Oh, but we're a Nation of Immigrants!" Yeah, we are a nation of immigrants that came here legally!! At a time when the country was expanding exponentially. At a time when the US made quotas for legal immigrants based on economic needs and projections. I don't think the US or it's people are in any position to continue taking in "the tired, the poor, the huddled masses, yearning to breath free, The wretched refuse of your teeming shores".If we were to do that--and we never actually did, despite the overblown poetry--the United States would be overwhelmed with immigrants, the country would soon become unrecognizable and the economy would be devastated. Does anyone think that if everyone who wants to come here were allowed to come here that there would be jobs for even a small percentage of them, even if they do want to work? We ALREADY have an unemployment problem, a housing problem, an abandoned and neglected children problem, a fecundity problem, a homeless problem, a welfare problem, a medical care problem, an educational facilities problem, a corruption and crime problem, a terrorism problem, a unfair taxation problem--all with the people we have here NOW.. What are we going to do with all the world's huddled masses? They'll be huddled here, too, and jobless, hungry, unsheltered and barely clothed--and so will most of the rest of us. And who is going to pay for it? We can't get our present taxation system straightened out NOW. Anyone who thinks we should take the poem on the Statue of Liberty literally has absolutely no sense of planning for the future and no practical vision of what the future would look like under those circumstances. If that wouldn't kill the goose that laid the golden egg, I don't know what would. We'd be writing our own epitaph. And where would the world's huddled masses go then in order to breathe free? Lois
Is the US going to accept every country's excess children, give them amnesty, feed, clothe, shelter and educate as many as want to come here or whose parents send here or who represent a problem Mexico wants to get rid of? Reunite them with their parents who also crossed the border illegally? LoisIf they can be turned into potential voters, then probably yes. They won't be, though. They will be turned into poor, hungry, jobless and homeless people, most of whom don't vote or can't vote.
Is the US going to accept every country's excess children, give them amnesty, feed, clothe, shelter and educate as many as want to come here or whose parents send here or who represent a problem Mexico wants to get rid of? Reunite them with their parents who also crossed the border illegally? LoisIf they can be turned into potential voters, then probably yes. They won't be, though. They will be turned into poor, hungry, jobless and homeless people, most of whom don't vote or can't vote.You don't think they will be rescued by Liberals? Or simply wise business owners?
Keep in mind, illegal unskilled laborers will work for low pay, no benefits, endure s**thole conditions, show up anywhere, anytime you want them to, and have a cheerful attitude about it. That can’t be beat. It simply cannot be beat, for some business owners to go this route.
The Brown people have cornered the market on cheap unskilled labor.
If we want to keep American labor American… the ONLY SOLUTION is for business owners to not hire Meso-Americans, out of a sense of racial/nationalist pride…to be openly racist/xenophobic. They will lose money, and productivity, but racism has to be their motivation. Nothing else will work.
Is the US going to accept every country's excess children, give them amnesty, feed, clothe, shelter and educate as many as want to come here or whose parents send here or who represent a problem Mexico wants to get rid of? Reunite them with their parents who also crossed the border illegally? LoisIf they can be turned into potential voters, then probably yes. They won't be, though. They will be turned into poor, hungry, jobless and homeless people, most of whom don't vote or can't vote. Did you read the articles I linked? They only keep coming because we have jobs. We are one of the richest countries in the history of the world Lois and all you can do is list problems and claim that if you happen to be the most recent group of immigrants that lives here, it's your right to keep it. Simply because our ancestors killed millions of the natives who once lived here, that somehow makes the riches here ours. That is so ridiculous and completely racists.
We don't need walls. We need better enforcement of existing labor laws.Yes, EMPLOYERS should be held to current laws and current laws should be strengthened. ] And here's what happens when you really get fought on immigrants] And apparently that kind of law has a negative affect on the economy, "HB 56 will reduce the Alabama economy by $40 million"] Whoopie do. Big companies want to continue a system of indentured servitude. Then let's show a picture of hard working man saying prayers at the dinner table. I don't care. Big companies-Poultry farms, vegetable farms, hog farms. All billion dollar industries. They could be paying people 45,000-60,000 dollars a year doing that stuff with full benefits etc. Or they could take advantage of an old system whereby shadow people sneak around and do the work for 1/3 or 1/2 the price. Great employees!! Can't complain. Can't file for workers comp. Can't redress grievances. Can be replaced at any time. Can be worked long hours. Can be worked temporarily. And American workers wonder why their wages are so low. Why they have no benefits that are worthwhile. Illegal immigrants are one of the factors that have eroded US Labor Power. Just like out-sourcing work to other countries. They either bring the work to foreigners or bring the foreigners to the work. And alot of it is jobs American will do...or used to do. That's the bottom line. Great, you get a warm fuzzy feeling sticking up for people you can relate to. That's your prerogative. It seems we agree on the problem but not on the solution. The problem with your solution is, even if we keep other workers from coming into this country, we still have the same "job creators" treating us just as poorly as they always have. We still have people who think they own people. But turning on the Mexicans, you are helping those who want to exploit us. Economies are built by people doing all the work, not by people who own the buildings. We've let them make laws that favor them. Keeping this cheap source of labor is one of those laws. That's what needs to change.
The only Immigration Reform that’s going to happen are laws that incentivize more illegal aliens to come here.
This whole discussion is moot. The existing illegals are here to stay, and it’s likely millions more will be coming.
If we want to keep American labor American.... the ONLY SOLUTION is for business owners to not hire Meso-Americans, out of a sense of racial/nationalist pride.....to be openly racist/xenophobic. They will lose money, and productivity, but racism has to be their motivation. Nothing else will work.No it doesn't have to be racist!! The US has a widely diverse array of races which are US citizens. Nationalist motives are acceptable however. So you are partially correct. Please don't confuse Nationalism with racism! Quoting myself....This is nationalism:
I got that. It made sense to me. The citizens of that country had their own national identity and forged their infrastructure and economic heritage. They had a compact with the state for certain guarantees in return for a degree of loyalty and taxes. In return they were afforded protections against their livelihoods. It's pretty standard. The vast majority of Nations have immigration laws(and trade laws!!) and work rules and visas. That's why.
It seems we agree on the problem but not on the solution.No. I don't agree with anything you have.
The problem with your solution is, even if we keep other workers from coming into this country, we still have the same "job creators" treating us just as poorly as they always have.Wrong. The quality of life for the American Labor Force has been steadily declining. It used to be fairly good. The decline in Unions is just one example of this. Illegal immigrant labor is one of the factors in this declining quality of life and employment. They are watering down the general pool of labor. Increasing the amount of available workers allows "job creators" to be more selective in who they hire. It's that simple. It's supply and demand! But even if that weren't the case it doesn't matter. The illegal aliens shouldn't be here in the first place. It's a disintegration of law and order!
We still have people who think they own people. But turning on the Mexicans, you are helping those who want to exploit us.Did you just spin this out of thin air? Garbage!
Economies are built by people doing all the work, not by people who own the buildings. We've let them make laws that favor them. Keeping this cheap source of labor is one of those laws. That's what needs to change.Again more sentences from you that make zero sense. Stop trying to do the math, history or politics Lausten. You don't have a clue. Just profess that you are sympathetic to the plight of illegal immigrants. We'll be able to communicate much more effectively. No one will be able to begrudge you for your sympathies towards illegal immigrants.
No. It's the entire history of prejudice. Get people to hate other people who are just like them, except for their ethnicity. Get them to focus on fighting each other for the scraps you are throwing them. If I'm wrong, then you need to come up with a justification for why you get to have everything you have. You can't deny that America was built on war and slavery. If we somehow deserve this land and others don't, then you are saying all of that is just and right.We still have people who think they own people. But turning on the Mexicans, you are helping those who want to exploit us.Did you just spin this out of thin air? Garbage!
Keep in mind, illegal unskilled laborers will work for low pay, no benefits, endure s**thole conditions, show up anywhere, anytime you want them to, and have a cheerful attitude about it. That can't be beat. It simply cannot be beat, for some business owners to go this route. The Brown people have cornered the market on cheap unskilled labor. If we want to keep American labor American.... the ONLY SOLUTION is for business owners to not hire Meso-Americans, out of a sense of racial/nationalist pride.....to be openly racist/xenophobic. They will lose money, and productivity, but racism has to be their motivation. Nothing else will work.So much for code words for racism. Wow. You got the part about willingness to do s*** work right, but you need to ask yourself why? Someone would only do that if the alternative was worse; slavery, prostitution and starvation.
No. It's the entire history of prejudice. Get people to hate other people who are just like them, except for their ethnicity. Get them to focus on fighting each other for the scraps you are throwing them. If I'm wrong, then you need to come up with a justification for why you get to have everything you have. You can't deny that America was built on war and slavery. If we somehow deserve this land and others don't, then you are saying all of that is just and right.There we go. Why didn't you just spout this off at the beginning? We could have saved so much time. You're sympathetic to the plight of people from other nations and their ability to sneak into the US illegally and get work at any cost. At any cost to the fabric of the US society and it's economy and Labor Structure. Regretfully you are using words like hate and racism. Predictable. I was wondering when you were going to resort to that. As usual Mid-Atlantic's low-level posts opened the door right up for you. MidAtlantic speaks for MidAtlantic. Not for everybody. I'm a United States citizen. I'm vested in the prosperity of this nation and it's citizens. Not the citizens of other nations. I wish them well, but I'm plugged into this Nation and National Identity. I hope that the better it does, the better I do. I don't see how millions of illegal aliens coming here to work and live can improve our situation. I'm a proponent of decreasing population and poverty.
And what can we do about those damn Canadian immigrants (Ted Cruz) coming in and destroying the fabric of our society?