I'm done trying to discuss anything with people who have bought into the Trump delusion, it's a pointless exercise in trying to reason with the completely irrational.
But Stardusty said he doesn't believe Trump's lies. Isn't that good enough for you?
Notice I stopped addressing him when he said that.
But Stardusty said he doesn't believe Trump's lies. Isn't that good enough for you?
Notice I stopped addressing him when he said that.
I missed that unfortunately, if I had seen it would have saved me a bit of time and effort.
Anyone who argues for and with Trump on anything is going down a very dark and dishonest road in my opinion...or they already live on it.
DougC - it’s impossible to even perfectly secure something
Yes, perfection is not a practical expectation. Slowing to a trickle is a practical expectation if the money were to be spent. But I doubt the expense is worthwhile.
It would require billions of dollars to build the massive wall,
Yes, obviously, who are you arguing against. I put the cost at many tens of billions of dollars.
billions more spent in maintenance and support.
Yes, again, who are you arguing against? This is obvious. I have stated so multiple times.
even with modern technology the challenge in keeping all that under observation and manned is massive.
Actually with modern networking of sensor data, motion detection software, and the low cost of cameras these days the supervision aspect would be quite manageable as a technical effort.
Worth the money? I doubt it.
John Oliver didn’t miss any of that
If he or anybody else thinks large numbers of people are going to be going over a such a modern barrier system at will he simply does not understand how difficult that would be in practice.
The Berlin Wall was just one tiny section of a fortified border that separated Western and Eastern Europe starting in the late 1940s. It was intended to do exactly what Trump and you seem to think is so crucial, completely control the flow of people and material across a border
There is no moral equivalence between the Berlin wall and an American protective wall.
But the Berlin wall did in fact keep the flow of people to a very low level. Walls work.
They have nothing to do with free and open societies, they’re actually anathema to them
Controlling our borders does not detract from our freedom or openness as a society.
We have never had open immigration and we have always had a border patrol force and a deportation force. If we didn't we would be swamped with illegals in no time and our society would face collapse under the weight of massive illegal immigration.
You really want to just open up our Southern Border?
Right, based on the idiotic claims of Trump that most Mexicans are drug dealers, murders or rapists.
Every illegal immigrant is a criminal. The first word in the term is "illegal". It is against the law. It is a crime. That is our law plain and simple.
Go ahead and compare it to other borders between open and free states
Ok, USA/Canada
Not a problem because our two countries are equivalent in economic status. Same with the nearly open borders of Western Europe.
Where there is a large economic disparity we need border controls to prevent large scale illegal immigration.
What part of that is controversial to you?
the US is in very serious trouble if he does in fact get elected to office.
Indeed, it would be a calamity of bad leadership that would make Bush and Nixon look like really great guys.
DarrronS - But Stardusty said he doesn’t believe Trump’s lies. Isn’t that good enough for you?
Notice I stopped addressing him when he said that.
So, if I had said I do believe Trump's lies you would still be speaking with me?
Well, as much as I enjoy our little chats that would be a price too high to pay, sorry, I am going to continue to disbelieve Trump's lies even if it costs me the conversational engagement of the good folks here.
I saw that. As I recall, Oliver also said that over or after 7 years, there would be another 25 billion in maintenance costs. And all of this estimate does not include other costs such as those incurred in land rights.
Exactly, so much for Trump as a sound businessman.
Yes, indeed. It's Trump's and his followers' biggest mistake to think a government can be run like a business.
Lois
DarrronS - But Stardusty said he doesn’t believe Trump’s lies. Isn’t that good enough for you?
Notice I stopped addressing him when he said that.
So, if I had said I do believe Trump's lies you would still be speaking with me?
Well, as much as I enjoy our little chats that would be a price too high to pay, sorry, I am going to continue to disbelieve Trump's lies even if it costs me the conversational engagement of the good folks here.