Thank you for your concern and I know that you are trying to help me. But right now, I feel like I am not some human being who just needs some stern talking to. I feel like I am not a human being. I feel like I am an organism such as a plant that is solely meant for survival. That is, to live forever and be happy. Hopefully this feeling will pass and my life will change. I feel like I am supposed to be treated as such (that is, with compassion). To treat me with scorn like some others have here is to treat me as though I am a human being. I am not a human being. I am like a plant that needs water and sunlight. Me living forever and being happy is like the water and sunlight a plant needs to grow, thrive, and flourish. To have scorn towards me (such as how the user DarronS did) is no different than expecting a withered plant without water and sunlight to grow and thrive. That is how I feel right now. But like I said, I hope my life can change. I will try other ways of living and I hope it works out for me.Mozart, you're like a perpetual child who just learned there is no Santa Claus, and he's going o hold his breath, kick his feet and run in circles until someone tells hm there is one, after all. You are looking for a fairy tale and you won't come out from under the bed until someone produces one. Grow up!
Thank you for your concern and I know that you are trying to help me. But right now, I feel like I am not some human being who just needs some stern talking to. I feel like I am not a human being. I feel like I am an organism such as a plant that is solely meant for survival. That is, to live forever and be happy. Hopefully this feeling will pass and my life will change. I feel like I am supposed to be treated as such (that is, with compassion). To treat me with scorn like some others have here is to treat me as though I am a human being. I am not a human being. I am like a plant that needs water and sunlight. Me living forever and being happy is like the water and sunlight a plant needs to grow, thrive, and flourish. To have scorn towards me (such as how the user DarronS did) is no different than expecting a withered plant without water and sunlight to grow and thrive. That is how I feel right now. But like I said, I hope my life can change. I will try other ways of living and I hope it works out for me.Mozart, you're like a perpetual child who just learned there is no Santa Claus, and he's going o hold his breath, kick his feet and run in circles until someone tells hm there is one, after all. You are looking for a fairy tale and you won't come out from under the bed until someone produces one. Grow up! Read my recent posts here. I said I was willing to try another way of life and hope it works out for me. Also, take note of my mature discussions with the types of people who are compassionate towards me and don't call me names. Please show me the same treatment. Your attitude is not helping me at all. The only attitude that will help me is the attitude displayed by the kind moderator here and other such kind forms of treatment.
Thank you for your concern and I know that you are trying to help me. But right now, I feel like I am not some human being who just needs some stern talking to. I feel like I am not a human being. I feel like I am an organism such as a plant that is solely meant for survival. That is, to live forever and be happy. Hopefully this feeling will pass and my life will change. I feel like I am supposed to be treated as such (that is, with compassion). To treat me with scorn like some others have here is to treat me as though I am a human being. I am not a human being. I am like a plant that needs water and sunlight. Me living forever and being happy is like the water and sunlight a plant needs to grow, thrive, and flourish. To have scorn towards me (such as how the user DarronS did) is no different than expecting a withered plant without water and sunlight to grow and thrive. That is how I feel right now. But like I said, I hope my life can change. I will try other ways of living and I hope it works out for me.You're welcome and I do try to help others when needed, if I can. Talking is always good and using Doug's link to call others to talk to also, would be good too. You're more than a plant, but part of being human is survival. As a human being, you need clean water, food, health care, shelter, clothing, education and freedom. As for the need to believe in an afterlife, that's up to you, but I think it would be good to explore other philosophies and listen to what others have to say. Finding out that there is no Santa Claus (or god) isn't the end of the world though, if that is what you're thinking.
Thank you for your concern and I know that you are trying to help me. But right now, I feel like I am not some human being who just needs some stern talking to. I feel like I am not a human being. I feel like I am an organism such as a plant that is solely meant for survival. That is, to live forever and be happy. Hopefully this feeling will pass and my life will change. I feel like I am supposed to be treated as such (that is, with compassion). To treat me with scorn like some others have here is to treat me as though I am a human being. I am not a human being. I am like a plant that needs water and sunlight. Me living forever and being happy is like the water and sunlight a plant needs to grow, thrive, and flourish. To have scorn towards me (such as how the user DarronS did) is no different than expecting a withered plant without water and sunlight to grow and thrive. That is how I feel right now. But like I said, I hope my life can change. I will try other ways of living and I hope it works out for me.You're welcome and I do try to help others when needed, if I can. Talking is always good and using Doug's link to call others to talk to also, would be good too. You're more than a plant, but part of being human is survival. As a human being, you need clean water, food, health care, shelter, clothing, education and freedom. As for the need to believe in an afterlife, that's up to you, but I think it would be good to explore other philosophies and listen to what others have to say. Finding out that there is no Santa Claus (or god) isn't the end of the world though, if that is what you're thinking. Now I've been harped upon by others here that my situation is no different than complaining because I no longer believe in Santa Claus. The belief in the afterlife is not comparable to the situation of believing in Santa Claus or some other fairy tale. The difference here between those things is that we as human beings are hardwired for survival just as how we are hardwired to be social animals. The afterlife is all about survival (living on after we die) and to take that away is no different than taking away all social interaction from someone and leaving them all alone. Both situations would render one's life completely miserable since the hardwiring's needs aren't met in both situations. So the afterlife is not just some fairy tale. It is something that some people need just as how some people need to socialize since they are hardwired that way.
Thank you for your concern and I know that you are trying to help me. But right now, I feel like I am not some human being who just needs some stern talking to. I feel like I am not a human being. I feel like I am an organism such as a plant that is solely meant for survival. That is, to live forever and be happy. Hopefully this feeling will pass and my life will change. I feel like I am supposed to be treated as such (that is, with compassion). To treat me with scorn like some others have here is to treat me as though I am a human being. I am not a human being. I am like a plant that needs water and sunlight. Me living forever and being happy is like the water and sunlight a plant needs to grow, thrive, and flourish. To have scorn towards me (such as how the user DarronS did) is no different than expecting a withered plant without water and sunlight to grow and thrive. That is how I feel right now. But like I said, I hope my life can change. I will try other ways of living and I hope it works out for me.You're welcome and I do try to help others when needed, if I can. Talking is always good and using Doug's link to call others to talk to also, would be good too. You're more than a plant, but part of being human is survival. As a human being, you need clean water, food, health care, shelter, clothing, education and freedom. As for the need to believe in an afterlife, that's up to you, but I think it would be good to explore other philosophies and listen to what others have to say. Finding out that there is no Santa Claus (or god) isn't the end of the world though, if that is what you're thinking. Now I've been harped upon by others here that my situation is no different than complaining because I no longer believe in Santa Claus. The belief in the afterlife is not comparable to the situation of believing in Santa Claus or some other fairy tale. The difference here between those things is that we as human beings are hardwired for survival just as how we are hardwired to be social animals. The afterlife is all about survival (living on after we die) and to take that away is no different than taking away all social interaction from someone and leaving them all alone. Both situations would render one's life completely miserable since the hardwiring's needs aren't met in both situations. So the afterlife is not just some fairy tale. It is something that some people need just as how some people need to socialize since they are hardwired that way. Actually, no it doesn't make one utterly miserable to know that there is no afterlife. I think you are thinking about it strictly in religious terms, but I would like to know how do you know there is an afterlife? What if you're wrong and our life after death is just like what it is before we even existed (before birth)? Or for that matter, let's put a different spin on it. What if the Xian belief of an afterlife is all wrong and the Hindu philosophy of reincarnation is correct? Or what if trying to describe it just like trying to describe the Tao, in which to describe it is to not describe it at all? Or what if your ancestors, as some Native Americans believe- other animals or the trees? Which philosophy is actually the right one (besides the standard answer that the Bible tells you it is right, which many other books, including some of the ancient Egyptian stories. These questions are something to seriously consider, before one becomes so sure that there is an afterlife or maybe just maybe such concepts are only human concepts and nothing more than that. IMHO, any definition or description of an afterlife is only a human concept and science gives us better information as to what happens after we die.
Thank you for your concern and I know that you are trying to help me. But right now, I feel like I am not some human being who just needs some stern talking to. I feel like I am not a human being. I feel like I am an organism such as a plant that is solely meant for survival. That is, to live forever and be happy. Hopefully this feeling will pass and my life will change. I feel like I am supposed to be treated as such (that is, with compassion). To treat me with scorn like some others have here is to treat me as though I am a human being. I am not a human being. I am like a plant that needs water and sunlight. Me living forever and being happy is like the water and sunlight a plant needs to grow, thrive, and flourish. To have scorn towards me (such as how the user DarronS did) is no different than expecting a withered plant without water and sunlight to grow and thrive. That is how I feel right now. But like I said, I hope my life can change. I will try other ways of living and I hope it works out for me.You're welcome and I do try to help others when needed, if I can. Talking is always good and using Doug's link to call others to talk to also, would be good too. You're more than a plant, but part of being human is survival. As a human being, you need clean water, food, health care, shelter, clothing, education and freedom. As for the need to believe in an afterlife, that's up to you, but I think it would be good to explore other philosophies and listen to what others have to say. Finding out that there is no Santa Claus (or god) isn't the end of the world though, if that is what you're thinking. Now I've been harped upon by others here that my situation is no different than complaining because I no longer believe in Santa Claus. The belief in the afterlife is not comparable to the situation of believing in Santa Claus or some other fairy tale. The difference here between those things is that we as human beings are hardwired for survival just as how we are hardwired to be social animals. The afterlife is all about survival (living on after we die) and to take that away is no different than taking away all social interaction from someone and leaving them all alone. Both situations would render one's life completely miserable since the hardwiring's needs aren't met in both situations. So the afterlife is not just some fairy tale. It is something that some people need just as how some people need to socialize since they are hardwired that way. Actually, no it doesn't make one utterly miserable to know that there is no afterlife. I think you are thinking about it strictly in religious terms, but I would like to know how do you know there is an afterlife? What if you're wrong and our life after death is just like what it is before we even existed (before birth)? Or for that matter, let's put a different spin on it. What if the Xian belief of an afterlife is all wrong and the Hindu philosophy of reincarnation is correct? Or what if trying to describe it just like trying to describe the Tao, in which to describe it is to not describe it at all? Or what if your ancestors, as some Native Americans believe- other animals or the trees? Which philosophy is actually the right one (besides the standard answer that the Bible tells you it is right, which many other books, including some of the ancient Egyptian stories. These questions are something to seriously consider, before one becomes so sure that there is an afterlife or maybe just maybe such concepts are only human concepts and nothing more than that. IMHO, any definition or description of an afterlife is only a human concept and science gives us better information as to what happens after we die. I don't believe in the afterlife. I am trying to get that belief back. But at the same time, I am willing to try any other way of living in the meantime and hopefully my life can change and become meaningful even without my belief in the afterlife. But as I said before, we as human beings really are hardwired to want to always live, be happy, and seek pleasure/avoid pain. It is completely natural. It is what some people are hardwired for and, like I said, to take away the belief in the afterlife is to deny what this hardwiring absolutely needs. Some people are not hardwired that way. So these are the types of people you are talking about who wouldn't be miserable without belief in the afterlife.
I don't believe in the afterlife. I am trying to get that belief back. But at the same time, I am willing to try any other way of living in the meantime and hopefully my life can change and become meaningful even without my belief in the afterlife. But as I said before, we as human beings really are hardwired to want to always live, be happy, and seek pleasure/avoid pain. It is completely natural. It is what some people are hardwired for and, like I said, to take away the belief in the afterlife is to deny what this hardwiring absolutely needs. Some people are not hardwired that way. So these are the types of people you are talking about who wouldn't be miserable without belief in the afterlife.As a human being, you have to make meaning- for some nature, other animals, and family give life meaning. For other people, it's other things, but we each have to find meaning in life for ourselves, others can't give it to us.
I don't believe in the afterlife. I am trying to get that belief back. But at the same time, I am willing to try any other way of living in the meantime and hopefully my life can change and become meaningful even without my belief in the afterlife. But as I said before, we as human beings really are hardwired to want to always live, be happy, and seek pleasure/avoid pain. It is completely natural. It is what some people are hardwired for and, like I said, to take away the belief in the afterlife is to deny what this hardwiring absolutely needs. Some people are not hardwired that way. So these are the types of people you are talking about who wouldn't be miserable without belief in the afterlife.As a human being, you have to make meaning- for some nature, other animals, and family give life meaning. For other people, it's other things, but we each have to find meaning in life for ourselves, others can't give it to us. I am aware of that. Now it all comes down to trying to change my life. I just hope it works. I worry that all my efforts will fail and that I will never have a new sense of meaning in my life no matter how hard I try. I fear that this is who I am and the only thing that can ever bring my life meaning is a belief in the afterlife and my feelings of enjoyment. I really hope I am wrong on that because if I am right on that, then I will always be miserable. I fear that since I have brain disorders, that I can't change. Your mental states reflect your brain states. In other words, if there is something physically wrong with my brain in which the areas of the brain responsible for growth, development, and the perception of a new sense of meaning are not working properly and can't change, then this means that I can't develop and change as a person either and means that I as a person cannot have any new meaning in my life.
I don't believe in the afterlife. I am trying to get that belief back. But at the same time, I am willing to try any other way of living in the meantime and hopefully my life can change and become meaningful even without my belief in the afterlife. But as I said before, we as human beings really are hardwired to want to always live, be happy, and seek pleasure/avoid pain. It is completely natural. It is what some people are hardwired for and, like I said, to take away the belief in the afterlife is to deny what this hardwiring absolutely needs. Some people are not hardwired that way. So these are the types of people you are talking about who wouldn't be miserable without belief in the afterlife.As a human being, you have to make meaning- for some nature, other animals, and family give life meaning. For other people, it's other things, but we each have to find meaning in life for ourselves, others can't give it to us. I am aware of that. Now it all comes down to trying to change my life. I just hope it works. I worry that all my efforts will fail and that I will never have a new sense of meaning in my life no matter how hard I try. I fear that this is who I am and the only thing that can ever bring my life meaning is a belief in the afterlife and my feelings of enjoyment. I really hope I am wrong on that because if I am right on that, then I will always be miserable. I fear that since I have brain disorders, that I can't change. Your mental states reflect your brain states. In other words, if there is something physically wrong with my brain in which I can't change, can't develop as an individual and develop a new sense of meaning in my life, then this means that I can't develop as a person either and means that I as a person cannot have any new meaning in my life. As an ex-Christian (over 10 years) myself, I can say you can find meaning, if you want. There are many groups that can help you with that- exchristian.net, Marlene Winell's Release and Reclaim group, Darrel Ray's Recovery from Religion to name three good ones. I encourage you to check out those group. Marlene is affiliated with exchristian.net, but you can also contact for the Release and Reclaim group at http://journeyfree.org/ Release and Reclaim is her private online group so I can't give you the link to that due to it being password protected. Regardless, I can assure you these groups are really good and I highly recommend Marlene. Check her out, even send her a message, and I'm sure she can hook you up with her online support group (Release and Reclaim) and other things that are highly beneficial. Her book, especially if you do the exercises therein is very helpful and she will encourage you to buy it when you join. This isn't a sales pitch for Marlene, it's a response from experience and how she helped me, as well as others. However, if before you contact her and get hooked up with her group, if you still feel suicidal, do contact that suicide hotline. You can also do her group, exchristian.net, and Darrel Ray's too. You aren't limited to just Marlene as you go through your journey to find meaning in life without religion/belief. Depression, Bipolar, or whatever your brain disorder maybe shouldn't hinder from developing a life without a belief in an afterlife.
First, awesomely succinct post. I wish Occam were alive to see that. Second. I was excited by those first few sentences, I thought you had really started seeing where happiness comes from, then came that second paragraph. Happiness doesn't come from an external goal, especially one that requires being dead to realize. One does not find happiness by saying they will be happy in the future, after some criteria is met. What was it about the belief in the afterlife that you think brought you happiness? Whether or not there is an afterlife of eternal bliss is a separate question. If you were actually experiencing eternal bliss, we wouldn't be having this conversation. And we don't know anyone who is actually experiencing that, so we can't know how to get there. We know some people who say they know, but we have doubts about them. So, the question is, what was it about that belief that you lost? Was it that you shared that belief with others? Was it that it gave you something to hope for? Was it just fun to believe? All of those things can be had without the actual belief. You can find something else to hope for, share it with others and just enjoy hoping for it for its own sake. Hope all is well otherwise.I became a materialistic skeptic. So I no longer am able to look forward to this eternal blissful afterlife I used to believe in. The brain is all about survival. It always wants to live and be happy. So I can choose to consciously focus on this life all I want, but I won't find any meaning in doing so. My subconscious will always still be focused on the notion of life after death which will always render my life completely empty. I am unable to enjoy my life and hobbies not only because I no longer believe in the afterlife anymore, but also because I no longer have my feelings of enjoyment due to a chronic mental condition known as anhedonia. This way of life just doesn't work for me. I need my old way of life back to me. Those two things I need in my life are my only source of meaning and happiness. I find no value whatsoever in any other way of living others might suggest to me. So go back to church and pray for a return to belief. It seems to be your only hope. Pray and pray some more. Ask a pastor to help you. I'm sure he or she has some techiques to get you back into the fold. You'll never get better until you believe again. I wouldn't waste another minute. It's been done by many people. There is no reason you can't do it--unless, of course, you have a secret wish to remain depressed--a way of punishing yourself for transgressing. A death wish. The death of your soul. You're almost there. I am willing to try anything, but I doubt there is any way to get my belief in the afterlife back to me. I am in the mindset of a serious hardcore skeptic. So I think it will be impossible to convince me. If you were a true skeptic you wouldn't be pining after belief. You are not a skeptic, you are a fraud who is defrauding himself. No true skeptic would have the thoughts you have about an afterlife. Intelligent skeptics accept the inevitable. You are a deliberate malcontent. I see no hope for you. You are ruining your life with your ridiculous whining about the impossible It's time you grew up.
Mozart Link, you need to understand that life is what you make it. You can't sit around and wait for meaning to be poured all over you and then feel good about it. You get out of life more than you put into it, and since it sounds like you are currently putting nothing into it, you're getting nothing out of it. Unfortunately for you, you have described an impossible situation and then asked for help escaping it. Unless you change your situation using the help and advice provided by many others on here, you will inevitably remain where you are. But it is totally possible to change your situation, no matter how hopeless things feel. One happy moment is worth an infinite number of unhappy ones, so even if it takes time and effort, it will all be worth it when you come out the other end. If you have even the smallest amount of empathy for other people, then you can do nothing more rewarding than helping those in need. Your consolation, if you somehow don't feel emotionally uplifted by helping someone in need, is that you will have your name and face out there as a good person - even a selfish, narcissistic person can appreciate that. And go on the internet and search for deconversion stories from ex-Christians. They are almost universally ecstatically happy that they outgrew their old, life-deadening beliefs and embraced the life-affirming concepts of humanism. (I say 'almost universal', because of you. Every one I heard of was ecstatically happy until this thread.) I sincerely wish you all the strength you need to grow out of your problem.Like I said, I am willing to at least try any other way of living. But I can't guarantee this is going to work out for me and bring meaning to my life. When, for example, I help someone out in life, I find myself doing nothing more than just simply acknowledging that this was a good thing for that person. But that doesn't bring meaning to my life. After I help that person, I acknowledge that very fact, and then move on to my personal life I have always found meaning in which would be enjoying my life and hobbies through my feelings of enjoyment and through my belief in the afterlife. I am not happy any other way and I can't enjoy my life any other way. The reward system of our brains is what gives us the experience of happiness, enjoyment, and is what drives us, inspires us, and fills our lives with complete joy. This system of my brain is not active due to not only my anhedonia, but also my lack of belief in the afterlife (the biggest rewarding incentive in my mind that I have lost). Your biggest loss is not belief in an afterlife, it's your loss of common sense, if you ever had it. That's what you should be working on.
First, awesomely succinct post. I wish Occam were alive to see that. Second. I was excited by those first few sentences, I thought you had really started seeing where happiness comes from, then came that second paragraph. Happiness doesn't come from an external goal, especially one that requires being dead to realize. One does not find happiness by saying they will be happy in the future, after some criteria is met. What was it about the belief in the afterlife that you think brought you happiness? Whether or not there is an afterlife of eternal bliss is a separate question. If you were actually experiencing eternal bliss, we wouldn't be having this conversation. And we don't know anyone who is actually experiencing that, so we can't know how to get there. We know some people who say they know, but we have doubts about them. So, the question is, what was it about that belief that you lost? Was it that you shared that belief with others? Was it that it gave you something to hope for? Was it just fun to believe? All of those things can be had without the actual belief. You can find something else to hope for, share it with others and just enjoy hoping for it for its own sake. Hope all is well otherwise.I became a materialistic skeptic. So I no longer am able to look forward to this eternal blissful afterlife I used to believe in. The brain is all about survival. It always wants to live and be happy. So I can choose to consciously focus on this life all I want, but I won't find any meaning in doing so. My subconscious will always still be focused on the notion of life after death which will always render my life completely empty. I am unable to enjoy my life and hobbies not only because I no longer believe in the afterlife anymore, but also because I no longer have my feelings of enjoyment due to a chronic mental condition known as anhedonia. This way of life just doesn't work for me. I need my old way of life back to me. Those two things I need in my life are my only source of meaning and happiness. I find no value whatsoever in any other way of living others might suggest to me. So go back to church and pray for a return to belief. It seems to be your only hope. Pray and pray some more. Ask a pastor to help you. I'm sure he or she has some techiques to get you back into the fold. You'll never get better until you believe again. I wouldn't waste another minute. It's been done by many people. There is no reason you can't do it--unless, of course, you have a secret wish to remain depressed--a way of punishing yourself for transgressing. A death wish. The death of your soul. You're almost there. I am willing to try anything, but I doubt there is any way to get my belief in the afterlife back to me. I am in the mindset of a serious hardcore skeptic. So I think it will be impossible to convince me. If you were a true skeptic you wouldn't be pining after belief. You are not a skeptic, you are a fraud who is defrauding himself. No true skeptic would have the thoughts you have about an afterlife. Intelligent skeptics accept the inevitable. You are a deliberate malcontent. I see no hope for you. You are ruining your life with your ridiculous whining about the impossible It's time you grew up. I have an open mind to the afterlife and it's this open mindedness that seeks to regain belief in the afterlife. Also, I am sorry. I can no longer engage with someone like you. You are of no help and are cruel to me unlike the moderator here who is nice to me. The moderator is the type of person I need to engage with. So I am completely ignoring you and your comments here on in. You call me childish. But ignoring you here and now is the mature thing to do.
I have an open mind to the afterlife and it's this open mindedness that seeks to regain belief in the afterlife. Also, I am sorry. I can no longer engage with someone like you. You are of no help and are cruel to me unlike the moderator here who is nice to me. The moderator is the type of person I need to engage with. So I am completely ignoring you and your comments here on in. You call me childish. But ignoring you here and now is the mature thing to do.We tried being polite when you started posting here about a couple of years ago. Several of us recommended professional help, but you refuse. Complaining without seeking a solution is whining. I'm glad Mriana has the patience to deal with you but most of the rest of us are tired of your whining. The mature thing to do is look at the universe, realize it doesn't even know you exist, then make the best of it You are stuck in the childish "woe is me because life isn't perfect" way of thinking. Either strap on a pair of balls and deal with it or find a psychiatrist who can help. I'm not going to engage you further unless you come here and tell us you're actually following through on the advice and help we've offered. As it is you're wasting your time and ours.
I have an open mind to the afterlife and it's this open mindedness that seeks to regain belief in the afterlife. Also, I am sorry. I can no longer engage with someone like you. You are of no help and are cruel to me unlike the moderator here who is nice to me. The moderator is the type of person I need to engage with. So I am completely ignoring you and your comments here on in. You call me childish. But ignoring you here and now is the mature thing to do.We tried being polite when you started posting here about a couple of years ago. Several of us recommended professional help, but you refuse. Complaining without seeking a solution is whining. I'm glad Mriana has the patience to deal with you but most of the rest of us are tired of your whining. The mature thing to do is look at the universe, realize it doesn't even know you exist, then make the best of it You are stuck in the childish "woe is me because life isn't perfect" way of thinking. Either strap on a pair of balls and deal with it or find a psychiatrist who can help. I'm not going to engage you further unless you come here and tell us you're actually following through on the advice and help we've offered. As it is you're wasting your time and ours. This is all subjective. You think I am childish and that my issue of an afterlife is so trivial and that I just need to grow up. I don't see it that way. So I am not going to engage with you either since your views are not in harmony and relevance with mine. I am having a successful conversation and am getting somewhere for once with my talk with the moderator. Before, it was just a matter of me going into an obsessive explanation of things that were on my mind and it didn't really get anywhere. I have offered up to try two things to try at the same time. I will not only try to find a new meaningful way of life, but to also try and regain those things that are so necessary to me as well. Before saying any further, take a look at my other post below. It is a revelation. You've been looking at things the wrong way this whole entire time. You were looking at my situation from a stigmatizing position rather than from the perspective I explain below in regards to the brain, how it works, and how survival is the #1 thing.
I don't believe in the afterlife. I am trying to get that belief back. But at the same time, I am willing to try any other way of living in the meantime and hopefully my life can change and become meaningful even without my belief in the afterlife. But as I said before, we as human beings really are hardwired to want to always live, be happy, and seek pleasure/avoid pain. It is completely natural. It is what some people are hardwired for and, like I said, to take away the belief in the afterlife is to deny what this hardwiring absolutely needs. Some people are not hardwired that way. So these are the types of people you are talking about who wouldn't be miserable without belief in the afterlife.As a human being, you have to make meaning- for some nature, other animals, and family give life meaning. For other people, it's other things, but we each have to find meaning in life for ourselves, others can't give it to us. I am aware of that. Now it all comes down to trying to change my life. I just hope it works. I worry that all my efforts will fail and that I will never have a new sense of meaning in my life no matter how hard I try. I fear that this is who I am and the only thing that can ever bring my life meaning is a belief in the afterlife and my feelings of enjoyment. I really hope I am wrong on that because if I am right on that, then I will always be miserable. I fear that since I have brain disorders, that I can't change. Your mental states reflect your brain states. In other words, if there is something physically wrong with my brain in which I can't change, can't develop as an individual and develop a new sense of meaning in my life, then this means that I can't develop as a person either and means that I as a person cannot have any new meaning in my life. As an ex-Christian (over 10 years) myself, I can say you can find meaning, if you want. There are many groups that can help you with that- exchristian.net, Marlene Winell's Release and Reclaim group, Darrel Ray's Recovery from Religion to name three good ones. I encourage you to check out those group. Marlene is affiliated with exchristian.net, but you can also contact for the Release and Reclaim group at http://journeyfree.org/ Release and Reclaim is her private online group so I can't give you the link to that due to it being password protected. Regardless, I can assure you these groups are really good and I highly recommend Marlene. Check her out, even send her a message, and I'm sure she can hook you up with her online support group (Release and Reclaim) and other things that are highly beneficial. Her book, especially if you do the exercises therein is very helpful and she will encourage you to buy it when you join. This isn't a sales pitch for Marlene, it's a response from experience and how she helped me, as well as others. However, if before you contact her and get hooked up with her group, if you still feel suicidal, do contact that suicide hotline. You can also do her group, exchristian.net, and Darrel Ray's too. You aren't limited to just Marlene as you go through your journey to find meaning in life without religion/belief. Depression, Bipolar, or whatever your brain disorder maybe shouldn't hinder from developing a life without a belief in an afterlife. Now I am trying all I can to rationalize with my misery to try and dispel it so that I can be at peace. I tried telling myself things such as that if there is no afterlife, then it is inevitable and there is just no reason to worry about it. When I die, I die. But this isn't helping. It is not bringing me peace. No matter how much I try to rationalize, I can't bring myself at peace. This is because we have the rational mechanisms of our brains and then we have the irrational mechanisms of our brains which ensure our survival. It is for this very reason why I can't rationalize myself at peace. I worry that those irrational survival mechanisms will always render my life empty and miserable. I can't rationalize with them. My life is overtaken and consumed by them. I'm not allowed to enjoy my life and have meaning in my life. These irrational survival mechanisms also are responsible for things such as complaining, only caring about living forever and being happy, etc. The brain is an organ that ensures our survival. It doesn't let up. Survival is very important. Hence the reason why my misery isn't letting up and is the reason why my complaining isn't letting up either. But for whatever reason, the brains of other people don't ensure their survival. These are people who are completely fine with forever remaining dead, they have no need to live forever and feel happy, etc. When it comes to the brain, survival is the #1 thing. So I think it is quite obvious why the #1 thing to me in my life is living forever and feeling happy. This is something I fear can't change because the brain always ensures our survival. Survival will always be something important. We live in a world today where we hold much stigma. We tell depressed people to just stop feeling sorry for themselves, "you are selfish," etc. But I am someone much more considerate. I am able to see past this stigma. I look at the brain and what is going on with it. It's just as I've explained, we shouldn't have stigma towards these types of people such as myself. You must understand here that survival is the #1 thing for many people. So instead of living in a world where we hold stigma, we should live in a much more "considerate" and "educated" world where we consider the brain and its workings. It is from that perspective that we will have much more consideration towards people such as myself. You don't understand just how powerful survival is. It is everything. It is the most powerful thing. It is the #1 thing. All other things are weak in comparison. They don't compare at all.
Thought we were making progress there for a minute. I’ll try to keep this short.
There is no inherent function of the brain’s survival mechanism that “ensures survival" by living forever or by even just believing it. That’s unique to you. It’s not bringing you happiness or peace and it’s why you need professional help.
Yes, people who don’t understand mental illness say horrible things. It’s like trying to teach someone with asthma how to breathe, you can’t do it. You need a doctor who understands that particular disease. Telling people who don’t understand mental illness that they are wrong or stigmatizers or whatever is almost as bad and just as fruitless. Maybe someday you will be able to better explain what you’re going through, and you will help people understand mental illness. But you gotta work on you right now.
Thought we were making progress there for a minute. I’ll try to keep this short. There is no inherent function of the brain’s survival mechanism that “ensures survival" by living forever or by even just believing it. That’s unique to you. It’s not bringing you happiness or peace and it’s why you need professional help. Yes, people who don’t understand mental illness say horrible things. It’s like trying to teach someone with asthma how to breathe, you can’t do it. You need a doctor who understands that particular disease. Telling people who don’t understand mental illness that they are wrong or stigmatizers or whatever is almost as bad and just as fruitless. Maybe someday you will be able to better explain what you’re going through, and you will help people understand mental illness. But you gotta work on you right now.Now go ask a neurologist or evolutionary biologist and they will, in fact, tell you that the afterlife is vital to many people because we are hardwired for survival. The brain always wants us to survive and this is a fact. It wants us to live forever. So when someone such as myself doesn't believe in the afterlife, those mechanisms of the brain that make you feel miserable become always active since these are mechanisms that are trying to ensure your survival. This is a fact. When our survival is hindered or taken away, that is when the mechanisms of our brain that make us feel miserable, fearful, etc. become active. And if survival is always being hindered or taken away, those said mechanisms will continue to remain active since the brain is trying to ensure your survival.
Mozart Link, you need to get it into your head that having no afterlife makes this life infinitely more precious and valuable and worth enjoying. It’s not like you’re scheduled to die tomorrow or next week, so grab the time you have and expend the effort necessary to make it as great as you can.
I know you can’t will yourself into a new mindset, but you can work at thinking about some things more often and consequently some other things less often. It’s been suggested a few times that you see what other exChristians say about their lives after escaping religious thought, and I can’t over-emphasize how good of an idea that is. Spend an entire evening watching videos or reading personal stories from exChristians and see how you can learn from them. Don’t expect a miracle though, changing how you think isn’t a small chore (it’s a worthwhile one!)
Mozart Link, you need to get it into your head that having no afterlife makes this life infinitely more precious and valuable and worth enjoying. It's not like you're scheduled to die tomorrow or next week, so grab the time you have and expend the effort necessary to make it as great as you can. I know you can't will yourself into a new mindset, but you can work at thinking about some things more often and consequently some other things less often. It's been suggested a few times that you see what other exChristians say about their lives after escaping religious thought, and I can't over-emphasize how good of an idea that is. Spend an entire evening watching videos or reading personal stories from exChristians and see how you can learn from them. Don't expect a miracle though, changing how you think isn't a small chore (it's a worthwhile one!)Please read my previous recent posts. This is not just some issue in which I just need to grow up or anything like this. This is a hardwiring issue with the brain. The brain always wants us to survive. That is the problem. No rationalization such as telling myself just to enjoy this life I have can bring my life peace and meaning since the brain is always making me miserable which is a mechanism to always try to ensure my survival. But you are acting as though this is something that can somehow be changed. I know other people have changed their lives for the better. But I don't think these types of people had this hardwiring issue. They just simply had a certain outlook on life that they needed to change. But with me, this is not just some simple outlook. It is something my brain is hardwired for. This is just how my brain works. I don't know if this is something that can be changed.