I thought this was an interesting discussion. I wasn’t sure if it should go here or in the Corona thread, but it’s an interesting listen.
@Sree you give in and die if you want, but plan on making every effort to live at least as long as my grandmother did. She lived to be 94 years and still remembered her Latin she took in high school.Your set of teeth is not going to last 94 years. What about your eyes? Cataracts will cloud your vision long before that. And your shock absorbers, timing chain, and God knows what else are not designed to last that long. It is foolish to live like a pilot who flies a plane till it breaks up at 35,000 feet. We have got to decommission the body while it is fully operational. My recommendation for system shutdown is when you are 75.
No not all go on to die, Sree. You have a misconception about what happens to all people on ventilators and they do get taken off to go on to live their lives outside the hospital. Not all people die when placed on a ventilator and some do get off it and leave the hospital alive. You really don’t have a clue about them and it has nothing to do with demonizing the dotard. He’s already done that himself, to himself.I anticipated your above response and saved this link below for you.
ROFL! @Sree, my grandmother had her own teeth, not falsies, until the day she died. Dentist are right. Take care of your teeth and they will last you a lifetime.
Again, you don’t have a clue as to what you are talking about and I’m done. You’re just not worth responding to anymore.
So your point sree, is that since the majority of folks who go on ventilators with C-19 don’t survive, we should just let them go without trying? If it is their only choice to try the ventilator or die, what decision would you make?
Don’t answer unless you know what T rump would do in that circumstance.
Oh, wait, T rump would no doubt just OD on hydrochloroquin in that circumstance.
So your point sree, is that since the majority of folks who go on ventilators with C-19 don’t survive, we should just let them go without trying? If it is their only choice to try the ventilator or die, what decision would you make?I was not prescribing what other people should do. I was merely explaining why Trump was telling folks to try a cure and not go for the ventilator touted by Cuomo and the media as a life saver that the federal government isn't shipping to the states as fast as they want.
Don’t answer unless you know what T rump would do in that circumstance.I will answer. Trump would try for a cure. Being a businessman, he knows the risks and downside to using the ventilator. He doesn't want to survive at all costs because he needs to come back fighting fit. But that is Trump. Me? I don't want a cure or the ventilator. If it's time to go, I just want to sip my whisky nice and slow.
Ok, you’ve decided you’re on your way out. You may want to be sober before you assert that on a DNR order. Or, at least, drink a finer brand of Scotch.
As far as cures, our dingbat DOTUS is STILL opening his daily Pandemic Propaganda and T rump Re-Election Panel, touting hydroxyfukkinquinolin. He makes me laugh (a despairing gallows laugh, but still). The only cure that we have, right now, for those with the worst case of C-19 is VENTILATORS. It is not a greatly successful treatment for the most part, with C-17, but it saves some. You want those people to die, because their chance of recovery is low?
I tout a potential helpful treatment: plasma rich in antibodies from recovered former C-19 carriers. But I am not the “leader” of a great nation, promoting this treatment that is not yet proven to work. And, also I am not a dumbass on par with the likes of T rump.
Good grief. I am listening to the dingbat in the background. He is back on his hydroxycloroquin spiel. He started out with touting it, and he’s back on it. He says “We have had some unbelievable results.”
The guy desperately needs a miracle to come along soon, so that the economy can get going again for his re-election.
So if T rump were in the position of choosing EITHER hydroxychloroquine OR a ventilator in late stages of C-19, you think he would choose the hydroxychloroquine because, as you say, he is a business man thus “he knows the risks and downside to using the ventilator.”
I say, he doesn’t know the risks and downside OR the potential benefits of hydroxychloroquine. Yet he is prompting the rubes who haven’t figured out what a LIAR and scam-man he is to ALSO make a choice based on IGNORANCE.
Today, T rump wouldn’t let a reporter ask Fauci what his take is on the hydroxychloroquine that T rump kept praising in the daily propaganda broadcast. T rump just wouldn’t allow it.
OH, there’s that little dictator coming out! Block the main medical scientist on your “informative” panel from speaking a semblance of the truth about your ludicrous opinion. (an opinion BTW that has life and death implications, potentially for many). Yes our fat little baby dictator is learning to dictate. We need to keep pictures of this in his baby dictator development scrapbook.
I say, he doesn’t know the risks and downside OR the potential benefits of hydroxychloroquine.So, why is he selling this to the American people? Is there some crooked deal behind this?
Who knows what goes on inside the great Jack-o-Lantern head? But my guess is that it is not so much one of his typical “business” scams, but rather, it has to do with T rump’s constant obsession over the past 4 years - getting elected.
I think that he is doing what he always does when he portrays what he wants to be true as reality. I think he is very scared that the economy is going to be shut down for too long for him to get re-elected. And I think that he has a fundamental NEED to keep his ego boosted by being POTUS (or DOTUS as I say).
I think his NEED is so strong that he can even convince himself that Hydroxychloroquin (OR SOMETHING) will happen to save him. He HAS always been lucky, and has often been saved from the downsides of his own actions.
He has a FLAWED CHARACTER, if you haven’t noticed. He is probably diagnosable with Narcistic Personality Disorder. He might even have a wee bit of early onset dementia. IDK.
(See how I did something deceptive there that T rump does a LOT?) I made a bold assertion as if its insinuation is fact, and then I added “IDK” so that I can, now, pretend that I said whichever is more convenient in any future circumstance. If I am speaking to non-Trumpers, I can present myself as knowing that T rump has psychiatric issues. If I am speaking to T rumpers, I could highlight that I said “IDK”.
I am not the LIAR that T rump is. So I won’t do that. I’m just suggesting that his pattern of deception should be coming in to focus by now for anyone not consumed into his cult of personality.
Another way that T rump’s unfettered mouth is doing damage, is that he is bigtime motivating hoarding of hydroxyquinoline, which makes it less available to people who actually need hydroxychloroquine for its approved usages.
Well, I recall from an earlier pandemic propaganda session, he also bragged about having gotten a large amount of the medicine for the federal govt to have in their stockpile. Great. If we are going to follow T rump’s uneducated hunches, like sheep going to slaughter… Well, it’s just another cloud of darkness in this Dark April.
Oh, our fat little baby developing Dicktator has taken another step in his dicktatorial development.
Now he can dictate to the FDA to get his own personal medical hunches approved and into the healthcare system.
And yet the toddler is not a certified medical professional nor does he have any medical education.
Yes, baby dicktator is not a doctor, but he blocks the actual doctor on his daily Pandemic Propaganda and T rump re-election Panel from contradicting his belief in hydroxychloroquine.
T rump acknowledges that he (T rump) is not a doctor himself, but quickly follows that up with asserting that he has “common sense” as if his “common sense” should be considered superior (about an experimental medicine) to the data-based-observations of an actual epidemiologist.
I do want to clear up some misinformation that Sree threw out and that is, not everyone who is ventilated with COVID-19 dies. It is important to clear the misinformation so that people don’t think it’s a death sentence. Here’s an article, which Sree probably won’t understand, because it is scientifically oriented. I’ve also read other articles stating that those who survive ventilation and recover are released from the hospital and go into rehabilitation. From there, it still all depends on the therapy and the patient concerning continued recovery. I don’t think anyone should think it is 100% certainty that if they are ventilated they will die. That’s simply not true. There are lot of numbers in this research and a lot of Scientific Method, for which I apologize if it’s over some people’s head, but the bottom line is this:
Discussion In this case series of critically ill patients admitted to ICUs in Lombardy, Italy, with laboratory-confirmed COVID-19 from February 20 to March 18, 2020, the majority were older men, a large proportion required mechanical ventilation and high levels of PEEP, and ICU mortality was 26%.
Again, I will repeat that quote, just as the article did:
Conclusions In this case series of critically ill patients with laboratory-confirmed COVID-19 admitted to ICUs in Lombardy, Italy, the majority were older men, a large proportion required mechanical ventilation and high levels of PEEP, and ICU mortality was 26%.
Bottom line, not everyone who has to be sedated and be ventilated dies. People do survive it.
Of course some survive, or they would abandon it as a treatment.
Fewer survive than in more typical cases of pneumonia, because the pneumonia with C-19 persists much much longer, hence the lungs tend to fail the longer they are dependent on the ventilators. But still some survive.
I am hopeful that potential treatments like, perhaps, antibodies from C-19 recovered donors will be shown to help shorten the time one is infected with the virus, in the not too distant future.
I am worried about Prime Minister of the UK, Boris Johnson, as I heard he may be being considered for a ventilator. I sort of like the guy, even tho he has pathetic right wing tendencies. And it is only consistent with karma that he gets his ass kicked by C-19, since he had the hubris, earlier in the crisis, to brag about continuing to shake hands with anyone, including C-19 patients.
There is one line of thinking that since C-19 tends to cause serious blood clotting in later stages, that this is a key factor in the sudden cascading of the illness toward more likely death, that happens in the worst cases.
Maybe blood thinners should be considered to be studied with C-19 patients. I mean, something like fish oil is pretty benign in most circumstances, and is a blood thinner.
In some people, it does cause heart damage too. It’s another thing they are researching too. It maybe the clotting that is causing it. Anyway, this could be an interesting read.
Here’s another idea in regards to blood clotting as an issue in C-19 fatalities:
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/23306381
This shows that zinc is a candidate for zinc serving as a ubiquitous modulator of haemostasis and thrombosis.
https://abc7news.com/coronavirus-drug-covid-19-malaria-hydroxychloroquine/6079864/
And this link is about an L.A. doctor who is convinced that from his practice saving people with severe C-19, can be saved by giving hydroxychloroquine, but only in conjunction with zinc. If this is true, I will have to eat crow from talking about what a dumbass T rump is for going on and on about hydroxychloroquine. Damn that part sucks, but, otherwise it will be great if it is found to be the successful treatment that this doctor is claiming.