No it’s not, but you don’t want to believe that due to your God virus. There is no getting through to you because you have it very bad.
? Maybe get back to us at a more cohesive time of day?
For that last time, no baby dies. You are thinking it is a fully developed human, but it’s not.
I never said it was anything of the sort. It is a still an unborn baby in the womb. In some cases, apparently they still want to attack and kill the child if it mistakenly somehow survives and gets out! Vicious monsters. Of course murderers want to dehumanize their victims and call them some name that reflects that.
It is first a blastocyst, then a zygote, and eventually it is a fetus, but it is not a fully developed human until after it is born.
God says He forms us in the womb, He never says we are fully formed adults there! He knows us and forms us and is with us before we pop out.
Someone who survives a spontaneous abortion (aka miscarriage) is a human being and put in your language your God concept causes more spontaneous abortions than any woman does, but that’s OK with you because your God did it.
The sin ravaged sick world has all sorts of dangers and death and sickness and sorrows etc. God did not ‘do it’ Adam and Eve dunnit. God is fixing it and will make it paradise again. Thos who blame God for everything merely demonstrate they do not know Him.
Your God can murder what is human in your view and that’s OK with you.
Why the obsession and compulsion to lie and make stuff up? Where did I say to kill people? How vile.
The reality of your view is that it is a control thing in which to control women even if it kills them and sometimes forcing women to carry a pregnancy to term will kill them,
More filthy demon talk. Quote where I said all that?
Women are not allowed to have a choice concerning their health.
The issue is the health of the millions of innocent babies that are slaughtered each year. We have not even discussed any cases where there would be some actual death danger to a woman. We all know that if there was such a thing it would be such a small minority of the people involved. Don't try to hide behind that veil of hypocrisy!
Another scenario, force her to carry a dead “baby” in her womb, even if it means she becomes sepsis and dies. Can’t remove the dead fetus, because God insists it’s his will for both the fetus and the woman to die, even though it can be prevented by removing the dead fetus before mother gets sepsis.
How pathetic that you try to use scenarios like that to justify mass murder at will. It would not be murdering a child in the womb, obviously, if it was already dead. Talk about grasping at straws.
Yes believers must believe Jesus and His words. Especially leaders of flocks must do that. Otherwise you could end up with a pedophile ring with a ‘pope’ at the head or some denomination that supports baby murder or abuse or disbelief in creation or something.
God did not ‘do it’ Adam and Eve dunnit. God is fixing it and will make it paradise again. Those who blame God for everything merely demonstrate they do not know Him. -- dad1
This is the airtight (aka circular) logic of believers. Some religious people actually try to deal with the problems of their gods, dad1 takes the simplest route; If it's good according human standards then god did it. If it's bad according to human standards then it is due to the "fall of man", the events in the garden in Genesis 1, or "we live in a broken world. He can't see outside of that logic, so he comes up with things like, "those who blame God", that have no meaning to me.
It’s kind of a pretty narrative really if you see it as a story. In more scientific terms, to survive, our brains evolved to have a sense of goodness, a concept of perfection. When we work toward that, we flourish, but evolution is random and doesn’t have concepts or a sense of goodness, so our striving toward that is flawed. We don’t know all the details of where the physical universe came from, how it will end, and what is “outside” of it. We only have the one universe so we can’t hold it up against a perfect one. We don’t know how wrong or right we are. dad1 will say he knows these things, but he has no way to share that knowledge with us.
In more scientific terms, to survive, our brains evolved to have a sense of goodness, a concept of perfection. When we work toward that, we flourish, but evolution is random and doesn’t have concepts or a sense of goodness, so our striving toward that is flawed. We don’t know all the details of where the physical universe came from, how it will end, and what is “outside” of it. We only have the one universe so we can’t hold it up against a perfect one. We don’t know how wrong or right we are. dad1 will say he knows these things, but he has no way to share that knowledge with us.
You admit not having a way to know right and wrong then? OK. I have a way, Scripture has that all covered. Simple. Then you claim our brains evolved to have some sense of goodness. Hilarious. Proof? Stop offering so called science claims as if they had any support whatsoever.
When you insist the blastocyst, zygote, fetus is an unborn baby, you are saying it is a fully developed human being.
Maybe get back to us at a more cohesive time of day?
It was very cohesive. You have a serious case of the God Virus. For more on this, please refer to Darrel Ray’s (a psychologist) book called “The God Virus”.
You admit not having a way to know right and wrong then? OK. I have a way, Scripture has that all covered.
The Bile has the worst morality and contrary to what you may think, many of us on this forum do have a very good moral compass with some very good ethics. Here is a fine example of one of your many insults and if you keep going, either Lausten or I will be hitting the ban button very soon now.
1a : the act of insulting or showing contempt or lack of reverence for God accused of blasphemy
That’s still not your book of fairy tales you call the Bible. That said, how can one have contempt for something that doesn’t even exist? BTW, blasphemy is in the eye of the one defining it. What you call blasphemy we call freedom from religion (First Amendment of the Constitution, in which you cannot have freedom of religion without having freedom from religion, which in the U.S. we have thanks to that amendment). Blasphemy is different for every person who believes in a deity also. That said, you should have known you’d encounter this when you joined this forum. Did you think we’d all be religious? No you joined because you wanted to evangelize and see you could convert a few atheists to your religious beliefs. That’s the only reason you joined, but since it won’t happen, what don’t you leave so we don’t have to ban you? You know it will happen if you don’t find your way out the door.
How is it blasphemers get to say God and Christianity etc as long as it is hateful, and I get warned by the mods not to use the words. Hilarious hypocrisy. Looks like mostly the same few pagans post all the time here and a lot of that is from the mods pretending to debate while threatening and blaspheming and being vile hypocritical little tin pot dictators who could not moderate or debate their way out of a paper bag. What a farce, did you really think honest people would not see through that?
I think the best solution is to trust God when He sends a baby if at all possible. We cannot set a time limit on when a child in the womb becomes valuable and precious to God, and a person. Some may say the hour after coming out of the belly. Yet a half our before that the child was still the same child. Some may set some arbitrary time like you did, but what about twenty seconds before the 14th week? The issue is not when science of the mass murdering medical system is able to recognize the unborn person as a person. The issue is when the person starts to exist. Scripture shows us we are known to God and precious and His child even in the womb. In God’s eyes, to kill that child in the womb is a grievous crime.
One cannot claim that it is one person’s right to kill another. No one has any such right. The mother has a duty to love and protect that child. That is her right. I do not think believers should be trying to stop God from sending babies either. I believe in planned parenthood, that is if a child comes along God planned it! Now as far as unbelievers go, if they feel they must stop populating the earth and not have offspring, well, that seems to be out of my hands. Then there are those folks that say they want to limit the population and reduce how many people are alive. For those people I ask why they would not start with themselves rather than others? I do not think they should whack themselves, or others, but especially not others!
How is it blasphemers get to say God and Christianity etc as long as it is hateful, and I get warned by the mods not to use the words.
That is not what we warned you about. You can use the words God and Christianity, but you cannot force your views on others and that is what you are being warned about- attempting to impose your views on others, which is trolling.
There may be no rules against outright demonic talk and behaviour here, but one can still point it out. Like it or lump it.
This is an attempt to impose your will and your views on others. It’s not the fact you are pointing out there is no rule again speaking out against religion here, but that is OK. There is nothing right or wrong about not having such a rule. Here at CFI we won’t ever have such a rule. Only religious extremists, such as yourself, take issues with not having this rule. This isn’t an issue to like or lump. You’re the only one who has ever had an issue with it. You’re the one who walked into the lion’s den and you’re the one with the God Virus.
the mods pretending to debate while threatening and blaspheming and being vile hypocritical little tin pot dictators who could not moderate or debate their way out of a paper bag.
Sounds like you are talking about yourself concerning debates, because you have been demanding we believe what you do and threatening if we don’t. I even pointed out one of your threats and you know you’ve been threatening if we refuse to believe what you do. Looks like today’s the day you will be banned because you can’t face the reality of what you are doing, but instead project your behaviours on others. The only thing we’ve threatened you with is being banned.
I think that unborn children are not babies before the 14th week of pregnancy.
I think that abortion is a right of the woman who needs it.
But that’s becoming circular.
I will agree that abortion is not a miracle solution and that the best solution is to prevent pregnancy.
I agree with most of what you said. For me, personally, it’s a developing human at the moment of conception (I don’t think anyone can argue that), but once the woman knows she’s pregnant and decides she wants what is developing within her, then it’s a baby- her baby. If you kill her, you have a double homicide (double manslaughter, etc) because she wanted the developing fetus, possibly even nicknamed/named it, making it a person. Notice the difference here- she wants the developing human inside her. However, if for whatever reason (death to her, bad timing, death or health of child, rape, whatever reason), that is none of our business, she decides to terminate the pregnancy, then we have to refrain from putting any humanoid labels, except scientific ones, on it and keep emotions out of it. The main key is, it is not our business what she decides. That is between her and her doctor at any point of her pregnancy. If at 16 weeks she decides needs to terminate because of a genetic fetal deformative that could prevent her (and her husband) from living life as they dreamed and that don’t want that life, then it’s none of our damn business. If she (and her husband, if she has one) doesn’t want a child with Tay Sachs, for example, and chooses to terminate, then it’s none of our damn business. Maybe they know the longer they hang on they become more attached to the baby and don’t want to face the eventual death of the baby at six months, a year, or two. It’s still none of our business.
Also, abortion does not prevent pregnancy. It is a termination of a pregnancy. The woman is already pregnant, so nothing was prevented. The only thing that prevents pregnancy, for the most part, given human error and all, is contraception.
I think the best solution is to trust God when He sends a baby if at all possible.
You need sex education. God does not send a baby. Having sex cause conception of two cells. These two cells are blastocysts, that eventually divide and combine in the process of development causing the blastocyst to become a zygote, then a fetus, and eventually and hopefully, a fully develop human after it is born. God has nothing to do with it. This is a good reason to wait before having unprotected sex, besides STDs, because it often creates a pregnancy. This developing human is only precious to the person carrying it, not some human created deity with human created imposed beliefs. The Bible says nothing against abortion. In fact, it does promote the killing of unborn developing humans, of which I gave you the link to that, but you did not read it and/or refuse to believe anything except your god virus. According to the Bile, you deity doesn’t give a damn about human lives from conception to death. No male dominated religion or any other human has the right to control a woman, not even what she decides about pregnancy. It’s none of your damn business.
Now as far as unbelievers go, if they feel they must stop populating the earth and not have offspring, well, that seems to be out of my hands.
Exactly, you cannot control anyone, not even with your human created religious rules. Religion is nothing more than a human created means of controlling others. The idea of god is nothing more than a human concept. Call it blasphemy (another means for humans to control others) if you want, but that is the truth. Even the idea of hell is a human concept in which to control others. There is no such thing as hell or even heaven. It’s all right here and if you don’t enjoy/appreciate it now, then you will miss out on living life, because there is nothing after death, except decomposition.