I can’t believe this conversation has gone for 4 pages because Antifa is not real. It’s just an idea, but if it did exist, what is so bad about being Anti-fascist? Shouldn’t we be anti-fascists, just as our forefathers were?
We all know what “Antifa” means when spewed by the right. It means “black people with voices”. It’s the word they’re using because the word they want to use is off limits these days. But it means absolutely the same thing.
I don’t know if you mean me specifically but Antifa and black activism are 2 very different things.
The biggest difference is Antifa is extremely White.
btw I have no qualms about using the “other word”. The fact that it’s off limits makes it more powerful.
btw I have no qualms about using the “other word”. The fact that it’s off limits makes it more powerful.
Yeah, in that it gives me the power to give one an immediate ban. You’ve been around for what seems like years, don’t ruin it over one word.
I don’t know if you mean me specifically...I did not.
That you have no problems using the other word and, in fact, love that it’s “forbidden” because it make it more powerful does speak volumes about your character though, and not in a good way. That you would love the power to hurt a group of people based on nothing more than their race, men, women, even innocent children, indiscriminately with a word…that’s just messed up.
To be fair I wasn’t always where I am now. I used to buy the argument, “If they can use it why can’t I? THAT is the racist thing!” Until I thought about it for 30 seconds. I definitely used to have a lot of the same thoughts and beliefs that people who I consider to be racist have today. I am no innocent angel guilty of no sin. I wasn’t quite one of those, “I’m not racist, BUT…<insert EXTREMELY racist thought>”, but I thought it was okay to use that word (just not to a black person’s face. That, at least, was off limits), I thought Affirmative Action was racist, I thought reverse racism was a thing, I thought that it was ME who was being discriminated against, etcetera, etcetera. I would LOVE to just forget about it because it’s in the past, to pretend it never happened. But as I often say, with me it’s “truth first”, always. And the truth is I used to be a bit of a piece of shit when it came to race. I was never overtly racist, didn’t think I was racist and certainly didn’t intend to be racist. I would have been shocked and disgusted even then to realize that I was racist. But I was racist. I can’t gloss that over. I can’t pretend it never was. I don’t get to decide when it’s time to forgive me for it.
The point is that I don’t want to throw stones without admitting that a few should be chucked my way too. I don’t want to condemn you for something I, myself, am guilty of (though I don’t think to the same apparent extent) without admitting my own fault in the process. I want to be fair and honest, always, so I can’t attack you from a perspective of being beyond reproach myself. The difference is, though, that past me disgusts current me. I’ve grown. I’ve become a better person. And the word is different today than it was then precisely because people like me, who never intended to use it to convey hate, have stopped using it. I thought it was just a word as long as you didn’t use it in “that way”, but I know better now. So now the vast majority of times it is used by a white person it is used to convey hatred, to hurt another person as much as is possible verbally. It conveys more concentrated hatred because people like past me aren’t diluting the intention any more. To be happy that it more succinctly conveys a hatred of another person, that is messed up.
Every black family in America at some point has to have “the talk” with their children, usually at a very early age. They have to teach their children, little frigging KIDS, how not to get killed by the police. If it doesn’t bother you that this shit has to be dumped on kids as a necessity for survival, if that doesn’t bother you one bit, then I don’t think we’ll ever find common ground on this issue. I don’t care what color a person’s skin is, children are children, they are innocent and they should not be burdened with something like that. It’s the frigging 21st century in the United States of America and black people still have to teach their 7 year olds frigging survival skills, which are essentially “Don’t give white people an excuse to kill you. Because there’s a very good chance they will.” No kid should be burdened with that shit.
To be fair I wasn’t always where I am now. I used to buy the argument, “If they can use it why can’t I? THAT is the racist thing!” Until I thought about it for 30 seconds. I definitely used to have a lot of the same thoughts and beliefs that people who I consider to be racist have today. I am no innocent angel guilty of no sin. I wasn’t quite one of those, “I’m not racist, BUT…<insert EXTREMELY racist thought>”, but I thought it was okay to use that word (just not to a black person’s face. That, at least, was off limits), I thought Affirmative Action was racist, I thought reverse racism was a thing, I thought that it was ME who was being discriminated against, etcetera, etcetera. I would LOVE to just forget about it because it’s in the past, to pretend it never happened. But as I often say, with me it’s “truth first”, always. And the truth is I used to be a bit of a piece of shit when it came to race. I was never overtly racist, didn’t think I was racist and certainly didn’t intend to be racist. I would have been shocked and disgusted even then to realize that I was racist. But I was racist. I can’t gloss that over. I can’t pretend it never was. I don’t get to decide when it’s time to forgive me for it.I never believed it was right to use the word because blacks do -- that mentality comes from dorky White suburbanites who want blacks to approve of them -- people like yourself.
I use it because I don’t like blacks.
Every black family in America at some point has to have “the talk” with their children, usually at a very early age. They have to teach their children, little frigging KIDS, how not to get killed by the police. If it doesn’t bother you that this shit has to be dumped on kids as a necessity for survival, if that doesn’t bother you one bit, then I don’t think we’ll ever find common ground on this issue. I don’t care what color a person’s skin is, children are children, they are innocent and they should not be burdened with something like that. It’s the frigging 21st century in the United States of America and black people still have to teach their 7 year olds frigging survival skills, which are essentially “Don’t give white people an excuse to kill you. Because there’s a very good chance they will.” No kid should be burdened with that shit.Very few blacks are killed by police, or Whites in general. A hell of a lot a blacks are killed by other blacks.
Very few blacks are killed by police, or Whites in general. A hell of a lot a blacks are killed by other blacks.
I really hate to say this, but you’re really naive on this matter.
I use it because I don’t like blacks.
What did Black people ever do to you?
What did Black people ever do to you? - mrianaThey don't have to do anything for me to not like them. I don't like other things too: collard greens, sauerkraut, green beans, catfish. None of these did anything to me. I just pass them by and pick other stuff from the food bar. It's the same deal with people.
I use it because I don’t like blacks.I can at least respect that you openly say that instead of hiding behind "I'm not racist, but..." bullshit. As long as you're not pretending to be something you're not, as long as the facts are the facts, there is room for dialog. I can't say, however, that my impression of you hasn't declined for it.
As for the little insult there, I am not as you believe. I said I bought into the arguments, not that the idea came from me. “Dorky” is a matter of personal perception which may or may not fit me, more so at some points of my life, less so at others. I haven’t been the same person my entire life. But “suburbanite” definitely does not fit me. I’m small-town redneck. The closest “big city” to me is about 35 miles away and has a population of about 60,000. But there are 4 cities about 40 miles away in the other direction which are frigging HUGE with a combined population of nearly 400,000! You should see the skyscrapers! There’s one bank that’s like 7 or 8 stories tall!
Very few blacks are killed by police, or Whites in general. -- oneguySo many things I could respond to here, but with oneguy it's best to just pick one, since he never completes a conversation once you start, like, using data and stuff. So,,
“few” compared to what? compared to the entire population, okay. compared to other industrial democracies, we are something like 10 times higher. compared to other skin colors, not a huge difference, but that’s what systemic racism is, that’s how it works. They got us hating “others” decades ago, stemming from centuries of it, now, they don’t have to “use the other word”, they just say things like “inner city” or “high crime areas” or “I’m protecting the women in the suburbs” and they can start shooting, choking and throwing people into unmarked vans and you will cheer it. They peppered sprayed some kids at a get-out-the-vote rally. There is a direct line from you saying “few blacks are killed” to that. And you or kids you know could be next.
It’s thatoneguy’s MO to make wild claims about the dangers of things which are so “rare” that they don’t actually exist while downplaying real dangers as themselves being “rare”. This very thread was started as an argument against evil unicorns which later turned into a defense of the actual, opposite of that as being “rare”. He just can’t overcome the partisan hackery in himself.
For the record, Antifa is definitely, absolutely a bad movement. What it is not is a terrorist organization as has been declared by the DoJ for purely political reasons. And Antifa has been purposely associated with black people by the right to drum racist fears. For example there is this article from a conservative blog with a post from a Twitter account saying that Antifa was coming to the “white hoods” in the suburbs. This account was later shut down by Twitter (per Fox “News”) when it was discovered to actually be run by the white nationalist group “Identity Evropa”. So even people who hold the same views about race as thatoneguy associated Antifa with “black people”, or at least try to push the narrative that “Antifa” means “black people”. To now come in and say, “I was talking about white people all along”, I’m not sure I entirely believe that from an admitted racist who is trying to drum up fear about Antifa just like white supremacists groups who are not talking about white people have been for months.