CONSPIRACY THEORIES: LEFT vs RIGHT

Politics and Social Issues
1

Am I correct here, regarding current “conspiracy theories?” …

It seems like Left-Wing conspiracy theories about the evils on the Right are limited to human entities – foreign governments, political groups and the like.

As deep as our distrust and even hatred of Trump and his minions may go, our suspicions are limited to the tangible sphere. We are alarmed about Evangelical influence because of policy decisions they may make, not because we imagine a god may literally answer their prayers.

Some of us refer to Trump as “The Antichrist,” but metaphorically. Our worries are, at least, plausible.

Right-Wing conspiracy theories about evils on the Left, OTOH, have Obama and the Clintons participating in ritual sex abuse of small children and drinking their blood to capture their life-force.

Qanon doesn’t see Trump as “a god,” but does believe he is involved in the cosmic battle between Good and Evil.

I once discussed Hillary with a woman who absolutely believed Hillary is a witch, “because she levitates. I saw the video. It’s true. You really should research these things for yourself.”

It seems pretty obvious which side the real lunatics are on.

 

2

It is standard operating procedure with Russian propaganda to create and support the spread of convenient (for them) narratives even tho those narratives may be outlandish in their deceitfulness. Our current alt-rightish govt seems to pick up tactics from the Russians.

What I don’t get, is what is up with Hillary claiming Tulsi Gappart is a Russian asset? If Tulsi is, then Hillary should present clear evidence if she is going to assert it. If she is doing it as a propaganda deceit, that has no basis in reality, then still, “why?”, because Gappert is hardly registering so far in the polls.

Anyway, if we progressives stoop to that tactic of making up and promoting conspiracy theories as truth, then we are becoming like our adversaries in one of the most despicable ways. It’s like Frodo putting on the ring of power. Sure it makes him invisible, but it also makes him vulnerable to the decadent and evil power of the ring.

So I repeat, what’s up with this Hillary v Tulsi dust up? I don’t get it.

3

Hillary should put forth with evidence or she should just shut up and go back to long walks in the forest.

Or if Tulsi is a Russian asset, we have to realize how effective the Russians are at these games.

4

I don’t think it actually has anything to do with left vs right so much as the mindset of the individual. The right is just far more likely to indulge in cult-like thinking, but I have seen it on the left. Particularly with Bernie Sanders supporters. I have seen even otherwise intelligent far-left atheists buy into and repeat Hillary conspiracy theories. I have seen the Huff Post go down the rabbit hole on Republican legislation to vilify completely benign bills the same way the right does with all bills dealing with guns. And I have been attacked viciously (I hate Bernie supporters!) for attempting to correct misinformation. I literally started a post out with, “I’m no Hillary supporter. She definitely has her flaws” and then went on to list some very serious flaws before correcting a bit of misinformation and was immediately attacked as being an ardent Hillary supporter and, thus, the devil for not supporting Bernie.

So it definitely happens on both sides. It’s not about the side you’re on, it’s about “how” you are on that side. If your “side” is your cult, you entertain conspiracy theories. The more cultish the mindset the crazier the conspiracies you will accept. It’s just far more common on the right, and there’s a very good reason for that. The right has spent decades courting the fringe to prop up their falling numbers as the populous becomes more liberal. Many of these fringe groups already engage in cultish behavior. White supremacists and evangelicals, for instance, are already prone to believe crazy conspiracy theories outside of their political preferences. If the only way you can win elections is to bring in as many crazies as you can find you’re going to get a party full of crazies who believe crazy shit.

5

Just to clarify my OP:

I should not have ended it by saying “It seems pretty obvious which side the real lunatics are on.”

I absolutely agree there are insane conspiracy theories on both sides.

The point of my OP was about supernatural elements in conspiracy.

While the Right is strongly Evangelical Christian, not all the supernatural ideas there are Christian per se. So it’s wider than just them.

It seems to me that Lefty conspiracies about Russian assets, etc. are fundamentally different from Righty conspiracies about child sex abuse rituals, drinking blood of children and Hillary literally being a witch who casts spells.

6

Righty conspiracies are no doubt often more egregiously divorced from reality than what the lefties promote.

But I am still confused re: wtf is going on with this Hillary v Tulsi accusation. What purpose is served?

7

That’s because the right tends to fear imaginary stuff like a one world government while the left tends to fear reality, like climate change.

8
But I am still confused re: wtf is going on with this Hillary v Tulsi accusation. What purpose is served?
@Timb

I don’t know, but I think this was stupid to say. If it’s a real thing, then offer actual proof. We need to be beyond reproach.

 

It really ticks me off TBH.

9

Could a kernel of truth, in Hillary’s accusation, be that the Russians are grooming a 3rd party candidate to undermine the Dem nominee in the general election? That seems well within Russia’s motivation and means and typical strategies. Idk, but it seems to be reason for concern.

But Hillary, show the evidence or go away.

10

 

@Timb

Could a kernel of truth...
Certainly.

 

But Hillary, show the evidence or go away.
Exactly

 

11

So you guys think that Russia meddling with the last election was a conspiracy theory?

12
So you guys think that Russia meddling with the last election was a conspiracy theory?
Yes, and a very lame one at that.
13
Right-Wing conspiracy theories about evils on the Left, OTOH, have Obama and the Clintons participating in ritual sex abuse of small children and drinking their blood to capture their life-force.
When did this happen? Only thing even remotely like that was the “pizzagate” bullshit which stemmed from John Podesta’s relationship with a gay restaurant owner who posted weird pics of children and pizza on social media. Some on the right immediately thought this was proof of a pedophile ring in DC, but I never heard about “blood rituals” etc.

 

 

14

I think that the big conspiracy in that regard is the massive propaganda that has been conducted for years now, to portray the Russian interference as a conspiracy theory. Way more ppl, than should have, have come to believe that the Russians did nothing, or at least nothing significant. They have come to believe that it is a left wing conspiracy to spread the accusations of Russian interference. (Like Oneguy, they believe it is a lame conspiracy theory, when in actuality they are victim to the propaganda that promotes that.)

Never mind that the true story of Russian interference has been supported by the Mueller report, by various intelligence depts., and everyday observations. The POTUS that the Russians helped get elected has been the greatest POTUS ever for Vladimir Putin. Our POTUS has most recently demonstrated his loyalty to Putin by casually betraying our brothers-in-arms, the Kurds, and giving Syria over to Assad (and Putin) and the Turks.

The fact that the question even comes up, shows how remarkably effective the propaganda has been to portray Russian interference as a conspiracy theory. Even some smart people (like Oneguy) have bought in and don’t even realize they are pawns.

15

 

@mriana

So you guys think that Russia meddling with the last election was a conspiracy theory?
Not all "conspiracy theories" are false; there are, of course, actual conspiracies. And there are theories about them, until (if and when) they are proven true.

To clarify: Do I think the theory that Russia meddled with the 2016 election is FALSE? – Absolutely not. It’s been proven that there WAS meddling. And “cooperation” between the Trump campaign and Russia appears evident, even if evidence did not rise to the level of what Mueller apparently felt he needed…but with each passing day, we see more and more evidence Mueller, oddly, did NOT bother to seek out. (IMHO, in time, there WILL be proof.)

The Trump-Russia conspiracy story that I think is false, and have always believed is false, is that Trump is an actual spy-- that is, an agent.

I believe Trump is an asset, not an agent (I typed the wrong word above). He is a “useful fool.” And because he is an actual fool, and Putin isn’t, I can’t imagine anyone expecting him to memorize things or follow some sort of script. He is also too bullheaded to follow instructions. So the idea he’s a spy is ludicrous to me.

Connected to this, I also think it’s silly that:

:heavy_check_mark: Trump does what Putin wants because Putin “has something” on Trump, that he is being threatened financially or with physical harm. Such threats are unnecessary because Trump has a huge crush on Russian-style oligarchy and control of dissent, and on Putin particularly. He crushes on Putin the way a homely 13-year-old crushes on the Prom king. She will let him fuck her in the back seat, because she thinks the feeling is mutual.

:heavy_check_mark: Trump is terrified a “pee tape” will come out. If there is one, I’d be surprised he hasn’t tweeted it. He knows his base would love it.

:heavy_check_mark: Trump knows there was collusion that led to his election. Nope. When he says “no collusion,” he means it. To believe this would mean he didn’t win because he was clearly superior to Hillary.

So those are the “conspiracy theories” I believe are false.

 

16

@Timb

(Above, and … yes to yours.)

17

I was going to say how could one not believe that evidence has been found for Russia meddling in our elections. However, you’re right, the dotard is not a spy. He’s more of a puppet. Russia pulls his strings and he’s intelligence is only as good as what they give him. Charlie McCarthy was much smarter… for a dummy.

18

@thatoneguy

Um … where have you been?

You honestly are unaware of QAnon??

If you're unfamiliar with the conspiracy cult of QAnon, here's a quick primer. The lore according to its followers is that one brave security services insider, known only as Q, is blowing the whistle on evildoers in the 'deep state' and Democratic party via more than 3,500 posts on 4chan and the now-defunct 8chan. His 'revelations' center on the Clintons and their friends' tastes for coups d'état, Satan-worship, and drinking pints of children's blood. At the centre of it all, inevitably, is Donald Trump. According to Q he's the vanquishing hero, saviour of not just the United States but all that's moral and holy.
Make Paul Dano's Riddler In 'The Batman' Gotham City's QAnon, You Cowards

 

QAnon is like the final evolution of all the far-right pro-Trump online conspiracy movements. The nonsensical evidence-free mega-conspiracy theory was finally something vague enough to incorporate every bit of violent and paranoid fan fiction communities like 4chan and Reddit had been crowdsourcing since 2014.
Here's How Donald Trump Ended Up Referencing A Russian-Promoted 4chan Conspiracy Theory In His Call To The Ukrainian President

 

QAnon supporters regularly appear at Trump’s rallies, and the FBI has warned that the movement could inspire domestic terrorists.
Inside the War to Kill Off 8chan – and Crush QAnon

 

 

19

@Mriana

Charlie McCarthy was much smarter… for a dummy.
No shit.

 

 

20

lol Sorry, that was just too easy, but it shows just how much I think of the orange creature that I didn’t vote for.