Why are Conservatives like that?

How can you define liberal vs conservative and ask how people can choose to be one or the other, and not accept some definition of the word “choice”? Or if that word doesn’t work for you, what word should we use? If the answer is always, “you don’t have free will”, how can we discuss anything about what we might do in the future at all? How can you answer a question about how someone came to be who they are now? And just to put the fine point on it, how do you suggest we raise our children so they don’t become mass murderers?
The “no free will” argument does not release you from making choices about how to shape our environment.

Can we please not make this another thread about free will. I realize the conservative view of free will has some relevancy, but whether or not someone freely chooses to be conservative is not.
Here here. I just had to say that one thing though, and didn't mean it as a serious tangent into free will. That's definitely a dead end discussion. Well, it really isn't. Belief in libertarian free will has a big influence on people. This is particularly relevant to conservatives who tend to justify inequality on it being deserved.
How can you define liberal vs conservative and ask how people can choose to be one or the other, and not accept some definition of the word "choice"?
This is going off on quite a tangent. The question I was answering is why are conservatives hateful and selfish? I think belief in Libertarian free will has a lot to do with it. I was careful to define libertarian free will so you could see what I was talking about. I think we make choices, just not libertarian free will choices.
And just to put the fine point on it, how do you suggest we raise our children so they don't become mass murderers?
By bringing them up in an environment which tends not to produce mass murders.
The "no free will" argument does not release you from making choices about how to shape our environment.
Quite right. But our choices are negatively influenced by belief in Libertarian free will. It Tends to make us comfortable with more inequality as we tend to think those worse off than us deserve their suffering. It makes us less compassionate, and more hateful and selfish. (Which probably produces more mass murderers b.t.w)

Not really arguing with that, but just trying to keep this on track of actually answering the question. I agree, but I don’t think it means much to say “belief in FW”, you have to explain that. You’ve explained one side of it, that the belief puts a burden of responsibility on people and ignores the burden of society’s role. That’s a classic right/left divide. I just don’t want this to further devolve into statements about people not having any choices.
To me, the lack of free will actually puts a larger burden on us to understand factors that lead apathy, laziness, anti-social, drug addiction and other behaviors that are destructive to a free and healthy society. The knee jerk reaction that the individual should just stop doing those things is no more helpful than the thoughtful idea that we can nurture anyone into being a highly functioning upstanding citizen. A conservative might say that any obstacle can be overcome, but then you gotta ask, where do those obstacles come from and what can we do to remove them?

Not really arguing with that, but just trying to keep this on track of actually answering the question.
And me.
I agree, but I don't think it means much to say "belief in FW", you have to explain that. You've explained one side of it, that the belief puts a burden of responsibility on people and ignores the burden of society's role.
Right.
author I just don't want this to further devolve into statements about people not having any choices.
People have choices.
To me, the lack of free will actually puts a larger burden on us to understand factors that lead apathy, laziness, anti-social, drug addiction and other behaviors that are destructive to a free and healthy society.
Right.
A conservative might say that any obstacle can be overcome, but then you gotta ask, where do those obstacles come from and what can we do to remove them?
The believer in Libertarian free will thinks obstacles can be overcome. If you don't overcome you *deserve* to suffer as a consequence. What the believer will not accept is "can overcome" means "will if you're lucky enough to be determined to by circumstances not chosen by you". This is nasty stuff. Those better off tell those worse off that we all have magic powers, it's not the luck of the draw and so they deserve hatred, they deserve to suffer e.t.c.

Let’s forget libertarian free will or any kind of free will. Conservatives lack compassion and that influences every position they take. Why they lack compassion I don’t know, but it is apparently related to sociopathy and sadism.
Lois

Let's forget libertarian free will or any kind of free will. Conservatives lack compassion and that influences every position they take. Why they lack compassion I don't know, but it is apparently related to sociopathy and sadism. Lois
Lois you say let's forget libertarian free will but since belief in it is likely to lead to less compassion and more hatred it doesn't seem sensible to forget it.

All this leaves out the deliberate brainwashing that “conservatives” have been subjected to.
For background you can turn to http://www.merchantsofdoubt.org
and http://www.waronscience.com/home.php
or http://www.theocracywatch.org
oh, and here’s something fresh I’ll have to read after signing off
http://www.dailykos.com/story/2015/09/29/1425968/-Roots-of-the-Republican-Right-in-Tocqueville-s-Elite-Manipulated-Democracy#
Not sure how much free will or lack of it has to do with pumping people with a deliberately manipulative message
and seeing what comes out the other end.

Let's forget libertarian free will or any kind of free will. Conservatives lack compassion and that influences every position they take. Why they lack compassion I don't know, but it is apparently related to sociopathy and sadism.
Yipes, and I though I though poorly of the sheople. egomania, sociopathy, fear, inability to cope, no understanding of the natural world, apathy, infantilism, etc. etc., . . .
Let's forget libertarian free will or any kind of free will. Conservatives lack compassion and that influences every position they take. Why they lack compassion I don't know, but it is apparently related to sociopathy and sadism. Lois
Lois you say let's forget libertarian free will but since belief in it is likely to lead to less compassion and more hatred it doesn't seem sensible to forget it. We won't forget it if we're not detemined to forget it, so it doesn't matter what I suggested. Lois
Can we please not make this another thread about free will. I realize the conservative view of free will has some relevancy, but whether or not someone freely chooses to be conservative is not.
The problem is, just as all roads lead to Rome, all arguments lead to discussions of free will. It's inevitable. Lois
All this leaves out the deliberate brainwashing that "conservatives" have been subjected to. For background you can turn to http://www.merchantsofdoubt.org and http://www.waronscience.com/home.php or http://www.theocracywatch.org oh, and here's something fresh I'll have to read after signing off http://www.dailykos.com/story/2015/09/29/1425968/-Roots-of-the-Republican-Right-in-Tocqueville-s-Elite-Manipulated-Democracy# Not sure how much free will or lack of it has to do with pumping people with a deliberately manipulative message and seeing what comes out the other end.
I'm sure there is more than one cause. But when conservatives don't care and hate because they think it's *deserved* there is a strong tie with belief in Libertarian free will. This is because that people made poor choices is blown up to be something it isn't, since they deny it's the luck of the draw who gets to make those choices.
Let's forget libertarian free will or any kind of free will. Conservatives lack compassion and that influences every position they take. Why they lack compassion I don't know, but it is apparently related to sociopathy and sadism. Lois
Lois you say let's forget libertarian free will but since belief in it is likely to lead to less compassion and more hatred it doesn't seem sensible to forget it. We won't forget it if we're not detemined to forget it, so it doesn't matter what I suggested. Lois This is a reoccurring mistake. What you suggest is a determining factor so it does matter.
Can we please not make this another thread about free will. I realize the conservative view of free will has some relevancy, but whether or not someone freely chooses to be conservative is not.
The problem is, just as all roads lead to Rome, all arguments lead to discussions of free will. It's inevitable. Lois Nope. This was specifically about hatred and lack of compassion. There is a link here between that and belief in Libertarian free will. We shouldn't help certain people, we shouldn't care, it's even OK to hate them because of the choices they made, they could have done otherwise but chose not to.
How can you define liberal vs conservative and ask how people can choose to be one or the other, and not accept some definition of the word "choice"? Or if that word doesn't work for you, what word should we use? If the answer is always, "you don't have free will", how can we discuss anything about what we might do in the future at all? How can you answer a question about how someone came to be who they are now? And just to put the fine point on it, how do you suggest we raise our children so they don't become mass murderers? The "no free will" argument does not release you from making choices about how to shape our environment.
Which is a perfect example of an oxymoron. Something like this: I am a solipsist and I can't understand why everyone else isn't one. Lois