Right wing talking points against socialized medicine:
– A Nation Must Be Tiny for Socialized Medicine to Work
Wrong. Japan and Germany are not considered ‘tiny.’
– A Nation Must Have Tons of Natural Resources
<b>Wrong.</b> (There is plenty of data) that shows that healthcare systems with a higher level of socialized medicine spend considerably less than America. Therefore, the wealth of the nation is not a determinant of whether socialized medicine will work.
– A Nation Must Be Homogeneous This is ‘dog whistle’ racism, Oneguy. This need for homogeneity follows the same line of reasoning as the argument that American life expectancies are lower than these other countries due to inner-city violence. Of course, if the extreme right wants to do something about inner-city violence, would they not be for responsible gun regulation? The article says that the homogeneous populations in the ‘Scandinavian paradises’ and Japan have a sense of shared obligation that America does not have. So we Americans do not work together toward the shared goal of a better America? Were we not able to work together to overcome the Great Depression and fight World War II? This is an extremely dystopian argument against the American way. America is and always has been a melting pot. We are very good at assimilating other cultures into the American way. We are the most heterogeneous country in the world and our diversity is our greatest strength, not a weakness.
– A Nation Must Have Super Strict Immigration Laws
Really? Now, I understand why Trump has adopted such an evil immigration position. Trump wants to give us socialized medicine! Do not get me wrong, a responsible immigration program along with border security is necessary for our nation. Trump is doing the worst possible job at implementing a responsible immigration program and has adopted a very weak border security policy. Elaboration on border security and immigration is for another story. This is a story about healthcare. The effect of immigration on healthcare is so infinitesimally small that it is beyond the scope of this story.
– America Is Paying for the Defense of the Socialist Countries Therefore America Cannot Afford to Pay for Socialized Medicine
Bull! The data throughout this story show that a higher degree of socialized medicine leads to lower healthcare costs.
Right wing talking points against socialized medicine:
— A Nation Must Be Tiny for Socialized Medicine to Work
Wrong. Japan and Germany are not considered ‘tiny.’
Strawman. There's a difference between being tiny like Luxembourg, midsize like Germany and Japan and massive like America. Smaller countries are simply more manageable.
— A Nation Must Have Tons of Natural Resources
<b>Wrong.</b> (There is plenty of data) that shows that healthcare systems with a higher level of socialized medicine spend considerably less than America. Therefore, the wealth of the nation is not a determinant of whether socialized medicine will work.
Fair Enough. America does have a lot of natural resources so this argument doesn't make sense anyway.
— A Nation Must Be Homogeneous This is ‘dog whistle’ racism, Oneguy. This need for homogeneity follows the same line of reasoning as the argument that American life expectancies are lower than these other countries due to inner-city violence. Of course, if the extreme right wants to do something about inner-city violence, would they not be for responsible gun regulation? The article says that the homogeneous populations in the ‘Scandinavian paradises’ and Japan have a sense of shared obligation that America does not have. So we Americans do not work together toward the shared goal of a better America? Were we not able to work together to overcome the Great Depression and fight World War II? This is an extremely dystopian argument against the American way. America is and always has been a melting pot. We are very good at assimilating other cultures into the American way. We are the most heterogeneous country in the world and our diversity is our greatest strength, not a weakness.
It’s racist to require homogeneity? Well that’s too bad because its absolutely true. All successful socialist nations are homogenous. Using the WW2 era as an example of American teamwork is a bad example because America was much Whiter then compared to today.
— A Nation Must Have Super Strict Immigration Laws
Really? Now, I understand why Trump has adopted such an evil immigration position. Trump wants to give us socialized medicine! Do not get me wrong, a responsible immigration program along with border security is necessary for our nation. Trump is doing the worst possible job at implementing a responsible immigration program and has adopted a very weak border security policy. Elaboration on border security and immigration is for another story. This is a story about healthcare. The effect of immigration on healthcare is so infinitesimally small that it is beyond the scope of this story.
This fits into the need for a homogenous society.
— America Is Paying for the Defense of the Socialist Countries Therefore America Cannot Afford to Pay for Socialized Medicine
Bull! The data throughout this story show that a higher degree of socialized medicine leads to lower healthcare costs.
Yes socialized medicine does cost less, but again -- it requires a smaller, homogenous society.
America does protect socialist Europe which does free up their budgets for welfare.
There would be a big tax increase for the shrinking middle class, but the bigger issue is the fact that many productive Americans don’t feel a responsibility to pay for someone else’s medical care.
It's amazing that people say this. Do you not understand how insurance works? Even Fox and Friends says it, and they still have a show, they weren't laughed out of existence. If you think it's fine paying a private company to hold your money, then give it back when you are in dire need, and put limits on how much it will give back, and skim off a whole bunch of it for their yachts and 3rd house, well, that's what you have.
the health of others doesn’t really affect your health, sree you really believe that?
If you mention Bill Gates because he is a billionaire , many graveyards are populated with people of royalty and riches and not as a result of death by infectious disease.
Of course, the health of others affects the health of particular individuals in our society. If too many people have poor health (and get treatment) due to whatever reason, that affects the affordability and efficient functionality of the healthcare system that is available to us individuals.
The very suggestion, that the health of many doesn’t effect the health of others, is based on an ignorant, wrong headed perspective. Get real.
Oneguy said, “It’s racist to require homogeneity? Well that’s too bad because its absolutely true. All successful socialist nations are homogenous. Using the WW2 era as an example of American teamwork is a bad example because America was much Whiter then compared to today.”
TimB replied: You want to require homo-geneity? Our hetero-geny is our greatest strength. Assimilation has always been a relative strength. Before WWII, blacks were not considered worthy to be a part of front line participation in our warfare. That only changed during and after the war. But change it did. If any nation can assimilate well enough to get past the falsely assumed differences of race, it is the USA. USA! USA!
TimB said: Right wing talking points against socialized medicine:
— A Nation Must Be Tiny for Socialized Medicine to Work Wrong. Japan and Germany are not considered ‘tiny.’
Oneguy said: “Strawman. There’s a difference between being tiny like Luxembourg, midsize like Germany and Japan and massive like America. Smaller countries are simply more manageable.”
TimB said: So you are changing the assertion to A Nation Must Be Tiny OR Midsize for Socialized Medicine to Work. Well, what country of over 300 million people has failed in trying to institute socialized medicine? What is the LARGEST country by 5 x’s the US? They have had socialized medicine for a LONG time. In fact, China’s rush to privatize in 2009 left hundreds of millions without healthcare. https://foreignpolicy.com/2009/06/11/chinas-de-socialized-medicine/
But, of course, now you will bring up your other right wing talking point that CHI-nah is more homogenous than the US. Well, CHI-nah has a bit of its own heterogeneity.
1,394,015,977 (July 2020 est.)
country comparison to the world: 1
Nationality:
This entry provides the identifying terms for citizens - noun and adjective.
noun: Chinese (singular and plural)
adjective: Chinese
Ethnic groups:
This entry provides an ordered listing of ethnic groups starting with the largest and normally includes the percent of total population.
Han Chinese 91.6%, Zhuang 1.3%, other (includes Hui, Manchu, Uighur, Miao, Yi, Tujia, Tibetan, Mongol, Dong, Buyei, Yao, Bai, Korean, Hani, Li, Kazakh, Dai, and other nationalities) 7.1% (2010 est.)
note: the Chinese Government officially recognizes 56 ethnic groups
TimB replied: You want to require homo-geneity? Our hetero-geny is our greatest strength. Assimilation has always been a relative strength. Before WWII, blacks were not considered worthy to be a part of front line participation in our warfare. That only changed during and after the war. But change it did. If any nation can assimilate well enough to get past the falsely assumed differences of race, it is the USA. USA! USA!
Fun fact -- WW2 was the last war America fought with a segregated military and also the last war we had decisive victory against an extremely powerful enemy.
The only other decisive victory since then was Operation Desert Storm but that was barely a war and it was against an extremely weak conventional military.
It’s amazing that people say this. Do you not understand how insurance works? Even Fox and Friends says it, and they still have a show, they weren’t laughed out of existence. If you think it’s fine paying a private company to hold your money, then give it back when you are in dire need, and put limits on how much it will give back, and skim off a whole bunch of it for their yachts and 3rd house, well, that’s what you have.
Insurance serves a reasonable purpose; you pay to be protected from bigger unexpected costs.
@halster: If you mention Bill Gates because he is a billionaire , many graveyards are populated with people of royalty and riches and not as a result of death by infectious disease.
You are talking about something else unrelated to what @thatoneguy was saying: his state of physical health which is unconnected to your diabetes or gout. He was not talking about getting killed by a mugger or a mob in a revolution of progressive liberals when Trump wins the election in November.
Of course, the health of others affects the health of particular individuals in our society. If too many people have poor health (and get treatment) due to whatever reason, that affects the affordability and efficient functionality of the healthcare system that is available to us individuals.
The very suggestion, that the health of many doesn’t effect the health of others, is based on an ignorant, wrong headed perspective. Get real.
You are presumptious. I am not in your healthcare system anymore than the squirrels in my garden are.
I don’t know where you get your healthcare. It doesn’t matter (in regards to the question of whether the healthcare for others can effect your health) if you are in my country.
If, as is the case in my country, many millions of citizens have no healthcare other than using the emergency rooms, the costs go up for all.
And in a pandemic, as we have now in my country, no healthcare for millions will help the infection succeed. While the resulting destruction to much of our economy, effects all of us.
We won Desert Storm because of the use of “overwhelming force” while also having the support of vast multi-national cooperation with allies.
Our WWII victory might have come sooner if we had had the benefit of having blacks being accepted as equal members of the Armed Forces. Consider the performance of all black units that were allowed on the front lines.
Here are some Ethnic (aka “black”) units in the US Army in WWII
92nd Infantry Division
366th Infantry Regiment
93rd Infantry Division
369th Infantry Regiment
371st Infantry Regiment
2nd Cavalry Division
4th Cavalry Brigade
9th Cavalry Regiment
10th Cavalry Regiment
5th Cavalry Brigade
27th Cavalry Regiment
28th Cavalry Regiment Air Corps Units
332d Fighter Group (Tuskegee Airmen)
Non Divisional Units
Infantry Units
555th Parachute Infantry Battalion
Cavalry/Armor Units
US Military Academy Cavalry Squadron
5th Reconnaissance Squadron
758th Tank Battalion
761st Tank Battalion
784th Tank Battalion Field Artillery Units
46th Field Artillery Brigade [15] .
184th Field Artillery Regiment, Illinois National Guard.
333rd Field Artillery Regiment [16] .
349th Field Artillery Regiment [17]
350th Field Artillery Regiment [18]
351st Field Artillery Regiment [19]
353rd Field Artillery Regiment [20]
578th Field Artillery Regiment [21]
333rd Field Artillery Battalion
349th Field Artillery Battalion
350th Field Artillery Battalion
351st Field Artillery Battalion
353rd Field Artillery Battalion
578th Field Artillery Battalion
593rd Field Artillery Battalion
594th Field Artillery Battalion
595th Field Artillery Battalion
596th Field Artillery Battalion
597th Field Artillery Battalion
598th Field Artillery Battalion
599th Field Artillery Battalion
600th Field Artillery Battalion
686th Field Artillery Battalion
777th Field Artillery Battalion
795th Field Artillery Battalion
930th Field Artillery Battalion, Illinois National Guard
931st Field Artillery Battalion, Illinois National Guard
969th Field Artillery Battalion
971st Field Artillery Battalion
973rd Field Artillery Battalion
993rd Field Artillery Battalion
999th Field Artillery Battlaion Tank Destroyer Units
614th Tank Destroyer Battalion
646th Tank Destroyer Battalion
649th Tank Destroyer Battalion
659th Tank Destroyer Battalion
669th Tank Destroyer Battalion
679th Tank Destroyer Battalion
795th Tank Destroyer Battalion
827th Tank Destroyer Battalion
828th Tank Destroyer Battalion
829th Tank Destroyer Battalion
846th Tank Destroyer Battalion Two segregated units were organized by the United States Marine Corps:
51st Defense Battalion. (Composite)
52nd Defense Battalion. (Composite)
The Americans of K-Company, mostly white men from the Jim Crow South, were dug in on the east bank of the Rhein, on 3/15/45. They were in danger of being overrun by the Germans who were also white men. They did not know if they would survive the night.
“In the late afternoon, however, the men heard a roar of gunfire, indicating that a sharp engagement was being fought on the wooded hillside below their position. When the firing finally died down, the Americans feared the worst, and the sound of men approaching only increased their apprehension. As a ragged line of soldiers began emerging from the woods, ducking under the low branches of the firs and hardwoods, the men of K Company hunkered down in their foxholes, gripping their weapons and straining to get a good look. To their relief, they could soon see that the advancing men were clad in olive drab and wore American pot-like helmets. However, as the approaching troops came closer, the GIs in K Company saw that their faces were brown and seemed to merge with the mud color of their helmets. Their relief was quickly displaced by shock.”