What are UFOs to you?

[quote=“citizenschallengev4, post:60, topic:9368, full:true”]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qMybbu_1hAY

How’s that?
There’s very little tangible evidence for establishing the parameters of many of those factors, so how can we hope for any solution?

I like this guy’s take on it, plus besides being way smarter, he’s way more interesting to listen to than I would be. Give it a gander.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zcInt58juL4

I have some objections to this mode of argument.

First, why is he using humans as the minimum standard of life.

What this guy overlooks completely is how easily life can begin, how few biochemicals are needed for life to emerge, and the abundance of those chemicals on other planets in the universe.

Note that earth alone has produced some 9 million different species

To use humans as the average is misleading. Evolution starts very simply , that’s why it can start quickly.

It may be true that human intelligence is rare .

But according to Robert Hazen the earth is just an average planet sharing the same necessary biochemicals with many other planets throughout the universe.

Hazen is confident that life (not necessarily human) exists on other planets given the relatively few basics biochemicals it takes.

I also disagree with Kipping’s conclusion about extremophiles being highly evolved.
Extremophiles are very simple and adapted to a very narrow range of extreme conditions. Tardigrades are not true extremophiles in that they can adapt to almost every environment, whereas extremophiles can only live in extreme environments and die in a temperate environment.
This is home to a thermophile species of extremophile.

There’s another fly in the ointment.
Life is on a continuum, are we talking about slime, bugs, fish, dinosaurs, mammals, primates, or complex culture creating introspective humans.

I would disagree, about the professor overlooking that.

But it took four thousand, million years for complex creatures to emerge. The diversification is easy after that, given the cornucopia conditions on this Earth, which had to evolve and refine themselves before complex life would have its building block. Though it took another half billion years of just so happenings to bring about the past 10,000 years, and it took the past ten thousand years to bring about the past couple centuries. And only a few more decades to take us back to more primative days, how far, no body knows, but it won’t be the least bit pretty.

But I agree simpler forms of life are probably quite abundant.

You’ll get no dissent from me on that.

DRAKE EQUATION

Someone ought to be able to work out the probability of stage3; Ne

That is the mathematical probability of planets capable of bearing the kinda life we have on Earth.

If you had a v powerful computer you could have a virtual 3D space the size of a galaxy, and have digital atoms and molecules programmed to behave as they do. Then scatter across the 3D space.

Theoretically, you ought to be able to have a virtual galaxy appear. I guess you’d need to have a rough idea of the chemical composition of the Milky Way. It could then show you the number of suitable planets.

No one can go further than that as (I believe) no one has worked out how life initiated here on Earth

Cheerz

DECLAN🙂

Theoretically we’re the children of God and this Earth was placed here for us to consume as we see fit.

Theoretically I’m told anything is possible so long as I wish for it hard enough.

Sorry, don’t mean to be testy, don’t mean any offense. Guess I was hoping for a different kind of discussion.

I’ve personally never heard of a theory which says anything can happen if you wish for it lol

I once saw a scientist make a digital model of what will happen when the Andromeda Galaxy and the Milky Way collide (which I believe they will in about a zillion years.)

They bumped into each other like 2 eggs in a frying pan and then merged.

The video was about 1 minute long, but the calculations took him 2 years.

So there ought to be a way of simulating our galaxy’s structure in a similar way.
:slightly_smiling_face:

Okay, I was being a little hyperbolic, but kids are fed the line all the time, “can be anything you want to be.” And philosophers, lordie won’t even get into that.

Sorry, I’m a very materialist kind of guy, materialist in the scientific respect. I’m into evolution and biology more than those lofty musing that are philosophy more than anything. Don’t get me wrong, all that is great fun in it’s time, but at 69 and it has all gotten too repetitive to hold much interest any more. It’s also distracted us from taking care of business here at home, and I feel less and less causal about that.

I’m way more into working on a better understanding my own being
especially in light of appreciating that my body is the product of a half billion years worth of one specific bloodline evolving in step with the changing environments it had to deal with. Appreciating my body contains hundreds of millions of years worth of innate knowledge and awareness way beyond anything my self-reflecting conscious mind can imagine or understand.
That my being is a duality between my physical body/brain producing my thinking mind.

My conscious mind in turn is the reflection of my body/brain communicating with itself, while interacting with its constantly changing environment. It’s a different sort of theory of mind: Body/brain + interacting with its environment = consciousness. But one totally supported by modern scientific understanding.

This begs the observation that our God’s are the product of our human thoughts and heart, and not of something outside of our biological realm.

The Drake equation is a thing of philosophy and intellectual entertainment because that’s what we people, with our fantastical minds, do. Seems to me it you would require a computer as big as the universe for the mathematical rigor it sounds like you’re wondering about.

Galactic collision, that one’s easier to calculate

Why do so many find our home planet so uninteresting that we need to constantly strain our minds to look beyond the sky, and physical reality behind, for the joys intellectualizing?

Simulating digitally and “making a virtual galaxy appear” are two very different things.

Modeling the forces of a galaxy on a large scale and knowing what’s going on on each of its planets, also very different.

Being interested in astronomy and planetary science is a perfectly worthy pursuit and does not mean astronomers don’t appreciate their own world.

Space exploration is important because sooner or later we’re going to have to colonize other planets

:slightly_smiling_face::slightly_smiling_face::slightly_smiling_face:

So is it possible to come up with a computer simulation of our galaxy?

Why are asking? It’s in the video.

Ok I’ll take a look at it🙂

2.4 billion years ago, one type of bacteria started to release oxygen, creating the atmosphere as we know it. And shortly after that – on planetary timescales at least – bacteria created the complex cells required for all plant and animal life to evolve . Bacteria built the world we live in today.
https://www.oum.ox.ac.uk/bacterialworld/#

You must read Robert Hazen, the world’s eminent authority on abiogenesis.

How are we going to do that?

Where are the resources going to come from?

Three cheers for Robert Hazen, lots of talk by him on YouTube. Mineral evolution, who’da thought it.

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I am not sure it is possible, and i will deeply regret it if it is not.