The reality of those great American years

Politics and Social Issues
41

As you know, I read most of what Richard Carrier writes. In his most recent blog post he is discussing how to argue against Plantiga. He starts by discussing why it helps to have a strategy,

Because human beings are universally irrational and often delusional, the truth is not inherently persuasive. It is easy to escape admitting the truth or its consequences. Indeed it gets easier the more copious or complicated that truth is, because there is “so much of it” that it is easy to just lazily dismiss it all, or straw man it, or “choose your adventure” and nitpick one thing and ignore the rest, and every other strategy people use to avoid any causal effect of learning the truth. Critical thinking is hard; and requires genuine commitment. People are lazy. And disinclined to commit to anything they find uncomfortable.

42

Yeah, so there’s the answer.
Doesn’t offer much hope does it?

It’s also why I’m so grateful for my parents, who had their faults, but steadfastly loved us, even as they dished out consequences for bad behavior.

Parents matter.

Here’s another taste of what the 50’s felt like.
This one is close to my heart since I know the San Francisco Peninsula section of that road quite well.
The 16, 17 year old fledging, #cruising El Camino Real two decades after this film was made.

#purchased used $500. It was a boat, ancient soft springs and heavy weight, so it swayed constantly. True to the era when we could drive beaters till they died, it needed quart of oil with every fill up, along with regular tinkering, but you could do it with those old cars. That started changing somewhere in 70/80s.

ALONG EL CAMINO REAL 1950s CALIFORNIA

Jun 18, 2015
Created by the California Mission Trails Association, “Along El Camino Real” is a 1950s travelogue showing off California and its missions. Images include San Diego and Coronado Bay, Los Angeles and Hollywood, Santa Barbara, the “Ghost Town” tourist attraction, Mission San Fernando, San Francisco, and much more.
…

El Camino Real (Spanish for The Royal Road, also known as The King’s Highway) and sometimes associated with Calle Real usually refers to the historic 600-mile (966-kilometer), connecting the former Alta California’s 21 missions (along with a number of sub-missions), 4 presidios, and 3 pueblos, stretching from Mission San Diego de Alcalá in San Diego in the south to Mission San Francisco Solano in Sonoma north.
… Today, many streets throughout California that either follow or run parallel to this historic route still bear the “El Camino Real” name. (as does the Main Street spine of the SF Peninsula)

Motion picture films don’t last forever; many have already been lost or destroyed. We collect, scan and preserve 35mm, 16mm and 8mm movies – including home movies, industrial films, and other non-fiction. …

Had we only been willing to move a little slower, be a little more caution, less gluttonous, and a lot more appreciative of what we had - learning to understand the need to nurture all these awesome resources we had at hand.

Learn to share with more than simply one’s own tribe. To appreciate Earth’s biosphere and the animal kingdom as more than a resource to plunder - to consume and discard at will.

To figure out that Earth was a partner for modern humanity,
and like with any partnership, it requires give and take and seeking a common goal.
As a whole our leaders and common people showed no resistance as Earth and Environment became increasingly villainized. I mean wtf.

Things could have been different.

Instead we choose a path that promised our society’s self destruction. (Big fire consumes itself and burns out in a hurry. Moderate fire that is tended burns much, much longer.)

Lausten you have to understand I had those realizations back in high school based on science and current events. Since then I’ve been watching us making way too many counter productive mistakes, and too much destruction and bad decisions, that lead into more self-destructive decisions, over a half century worth of them, as hope for a healthy future kept sinking. I’ve been getting told all my life I was crazy, we’d be just fine. I don’t see it. I am not the crazy one in this game. Now over past 5 some years, I’ve nailed the Consciousness, God thing, Physical Reality ~ Human Mind appreciate. I do know what I’m talking about, that’s why I keep trying to develop and share my thoughts as clearly as I can. And to seek dialogue.

Now we have entered that inevitable downward part of our trajectory.

These are no longer things I can talk about with people, too much of a downer at this point. So I will write about it from my perspective, because it matters, for a few.

I’m not the only one that needs to process what is happening in front of us, to make some sense of it and build up the emotional fortifications to deal with the inevitable bad times racing at us.

To do so from within a solid fact based foundation, one that does exist via Earth Science and Biology - (Not from today’s media focused talking head philosophers, who have trapped themselves within their own mindscapes and meta-physical musings.

Any contemporary philosophical discourse that doesn’t incorporate the reality of our Evolution, and Earth’s biosphere into its reasoning, especially the biological fact that all living creatures create their own awareness, and with humans, our own thoughts/consciousness, as well as all the Gods we choose to believe in - is wasting time.

These talking heads have nothing of value to help today’s people, facing today’s challenges, as experienced through our living breathing physical bodies.

“Provocative” may have been great for the party years, but now time are going to start get gritty and philosophers are going to become more irrelevant unless they actually come up with more than rehashing what the ancient masters taught us.

I know others care about understanding themselves within a fact based framework, and that they are struggling to make some sense out of that, something that will make a difference to understanding themselves and their emotional battles and how they perceive themselves against a backdrop of a diminishing planet.

Key thought: Our relationship with the information we possess.

I suggest, based on personal experience, that arriving at a point where one can deeply profoundly appreciate themselves as being a filament in Earth’s Pageant of Evolution - really goes a long way to put a foundation under one’s feet.

I’ve yet to hear of anyone suggest a better meta-physical spiritual humanistic plan, beyond that rehashing old masters.

Won’t solve anything, but it can be tremendously helpful to an individual and help them with what they choose to be present to. The beauty is, no meta-physics required - it’s all within the frame work of modern materialist, science, biology, and natural laws.

Although having said that, in the past couple years my meta-physical outlook has expanded tremendously. Because science doesn’t actually rule out “God”.

Simply that God is a product of our, individual and collective human mind and is a meta-physical entity.

I say this because looking into today’s amazing microscopic world of teaming racing chaotic complexity, that isn’t chaotic after all because otherwise creatures and plants couldn’t exist. It boggles the mind, and my mind can’t help but wonder about an underlying something. But I also appreciate that those ideas belong to my imaginative mindscape, and it would be silly to presume they go further than that.

Which brings me to wondering why people can’t accept the admonish of Holy books throughout history, including the Bible, that God is simply beyond human understanding. (read no personal God) The Bible is tradition and ritual and most people love and even need that. Which is okay, what’s wrong with accepting that it’s tradition and valuable but that the God itself is unique to every person, because it created from within.

What’s wrong with religion being all about how we live our own lives, and how we behave and respect our own ethical codes? (just some rhetorical questions L, not implying anything,…)

Why not add another belief to our understanding?
Earth as our physical biological mother, (which she scientifically is!) an intimidate part of our family, worth respect and nurturing. Recognize that God’s rule our meta-physical space, and that Earth’s physical realm, is a different matter.

It’s too late, I know, but dang we could have done so much better. But We The People never took the future seriously enough, and our leaders did everything they could to make sure we remained as distracted as possible.

Dang and I was only going to add a couple line below the video. Guess I’m still processing.

43

I’ll read the rest of your post later, but this is the crux of the differences in our worldviews. No, the stupidity and laziness that I see in people does not give me hope, but I have hope because I see what we have overcome, succinctly; I see the light in the darkness. I don’t have the religious brand of hope that Jesus will return and fix everything, I have real evidence that in the worst circumstances, compassion and caring show up. I don’t read Richard Carrier for his rants about idiocracy. I read him for the rest of that blog about how to structure what I say so I can break through it. One of my most effective hacks is to remember that I am one of the idiots. I don’t expect a massive shift in attitude because attitudes don’t suddenly shift. I know, because I have one.

We’ve been discussing how I think the progress of scientific methods gives me some hope for our future. Those methods developed over thousands of years, and more rapidly in the last few hundred. Changes in attitudes toward women, sexual orientation, political boundaries, and religion have accelerated in the last few decades. But, none of that is good enough for you.

Whatever is left undone is evidence to you, CC, that nothing can be done. It doesn’t matter what I say about how something is better than it once was, or how an organization here or a person there is making progress and improving some corner of the world. There is always something wrong, something that proves to you that the end is near. And that’s life, you’re right, the end is always near. Every generation has its challenges and we got some big ones. Life is precious because we know it will end but joy in life doesn’t come from hastening that end or from despairing that it will or complaining that it won’t get better.

Alright, I’m running out of anything but cliche. Hopefully, you get the point.

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That is correct because none of that explains what happened with MAGA. I don’t see women’s or human rights expanding very much. Where was the overwhelming rejection of MAGA madness?

How about a little understanding and compassion for why refugees are refugees? The list could go on and on. I’m not imagining these things, they are eating away at real lives. Shooting the messenger doesn’t change the facts.

You can over look that, I can’t and the tl:dr tried to explain why I’m built this way.

If I believed that why would I waste so much time trying to put my finger on our human key failings? Recognizing a dysfunction is the first step to dealing with it constructively.

It’s not that “nothing can be done” - it’s that nothing will be done unless we change in more ways than our wordplay. We need a fundamental change in our world outlook capable of encompassing the entire world, not just our human expectations and needs.

You say people can’t fundamentally change their thinking, doesn’t that take us right back to “nothing can be done”?

And if we can’t change the world, that leaves only oneself to change. Constructive inner change would require truly deeply profoundly recognizing how Earth literally created us; that our body creates our consciousness and mind; and our that our mind creates our Gods. Everything else (humanity wise) works out from those fundamentals.

Guess something I like about having gone through that process is how it has help me understand my life within the bigger context and it has prepared me for my own death, so I’ve found something that is correct and important - and worth sharing.

Plus it’s given me the tools to mentally/spiritually deal with the horror of MAGA and fears of the destruction these next four years will be witness to.

Well yeah, today’s world … , it is pretty are screwed, and getting darker by the day - which is demonstrated in the increasing random insane viciousness of people in general, happy new year New Orleans. Also in the MAGA wave, where lawlessness is embraced and contempt for other humans and government reigns.

Complaining, is it? Still, it is our Physical Reality, plenty of solid reporting out there.

You make it sound like we have an option, that it may turn out okay if we think positive thoughts and that this super tanker we’re strapped into just might turn on a dime, without a huge real world (as opposed to talking about it) effort on our part.

Oh, and besides, if life were so precious to others, why is so much of this society focused on distracting away from the real things in life, and dreaming of escaping reality, or even Earth for that matter?
Just have to look at what we spend our money.
You call that complaining, I call that important clues to who we have chosen to be.

True joy can’t be build out of a frivolous throw away life style. It requires some serious intellectual, spiritual, and physical work.

45

Lausten, I know, you already know that.

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Boy, nice summary. Much easier to respond to this than your longer posts. You’re doing the thing I’m trying to explain. It doesn’t make you a bad person. It sure would be nice if you would reflect on what I’m saying, examine what you do here, and respond to it. Instead of what you keep doing it.

Something I didn’t mention, from the list of a zillion things I don’t mention in every post. Instead of recognizing me as someone who engages with you on these issues over a long period, you point out something that I didn’t say a couple hours ago.

Yep. It’s never enough for you. That’s what I said.

And let’s just add another thing I didn’t address in my latest post that I’ve addressed in the past.

Yes I know. That’s what I just said in the post you are responding to.

Never accused you of imagining things. I point out that you prioritize differently, and you accuse me of that being a crime. You can prioritize however you want, but let someone else have a different priority that is based on mutual morality, ethics, and rationality.

I don’t “shoot” you for caring about the things you do. I get annoyed at you wanting me to have the same priorities as you and to believe in your worldview and believe it will change all of these things.

Thank you for not repeating the tl:dr this time. I know you try to explain it. What I’m trying to tell you is other people have a different tl:dr, they developed their view in a different way. I look for how all of those different views converge. As I listed here, you keep pointing out the differences.

If I thought you were trying to put your finger on key failings, and deal with them constructively, then I would hear other things you say differently. But your message about the failings and the dysfunctions is the one that comes through the loudest.

And there it is, the louder message. The one that something about words needs to change, some outlook that will spread across the globe in some short time. That’s what you should be developing, not just repeating words about it.

I didn’t say people can’t change their thinking. I say the opposite all the time. I hate when people say “those MAGAs won’t ever change”, because I’ve seen it happen.

And now you’re in your circular words again. Yes, we all need to “work” on ourselves. There are many ways to do that. And individuals changing adds up to global change.

I just got to the TL:DR
(edited some typos)

47

And how often to I need to explain, it’s not about you, not actually directed at you, beyond the fact that you are presenting and representing that “other collective state of mind” that I take issue with.

There’s absolutely nothing that will change “all these things” - there was a time we could have slowed down “all these things” and had time to figure out how to rationally intelligently constructively work with Earth’s systems that our society was driving into a more energized, hotter, hostile conditions.

But we wasted that.

All these things?

The only thing I hope for is to introduce an alternative way of framing our human condition and raising our awareness of who and what we really are: evolved biological creatures, born of Earth’s processes and each of our body/brain producing our individual consciousness.

To help some overcome and see beyond that “god is dead emptiness” that permeates today’s society, hoping to help a few individuals open their eye’s to their own individual connection to Evolutional and this Earth that created us.

It’s what intelligent adventurous old people have always none, process their memories and work at making sense of the pageant we’ve just been through.

Then try to share a distillation of their own life’s experiences and lessons for others to do with as they please.

You’re just reducing this to a joke, shame on you.

Then you voice shock if I suggest you are angry at me.

Where have I talked about people - It’s the MAGA ideals I rail against and that won’t change. We’re on the same page there, if you want to believe it or not. Remember I have a big extended family, gotta live with all sorts.

It’s another example of what I see as you distracting away from what I’m actually writing and would love to talk about in more detail.

I’m railing against society, not you, not you. Stop taking it so personal.

48

Who else are you conversing with? You are addressing me. You immediately contradict yourself with:

Back on the merry-go-round. Sometimes you say there’s nothing that can be done, sometimes you say you’re doing what you do with some intention of making a difference. Like:

I’m not sure we share a common language. If you are talking about ideals, you are talking about the people who hold them and express them.

Telling you that you are not engaging, that you are not talking in more detail, that you rail and that’s it, that is not me “taking it personal”, that’s me describing what I see you doing. I’m a participant here. If someone posts, the expectation is that others will comment on it. That’s what I’m doing.

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Please just because I’m conversing with you doesn’t mean it’s about You.

Look at society, tell me we aren’t on a merry-go-round?

That’s pretty touchy, and unfair. An example of Ego holding centerstage.
I am talking about the human being, the collective we.

Then I write about the inner biological human.

Which is different from the mental ego side of how we are thinking and how fluid our conviction are.

People are who they are,
though note that
individuals are markedly different from a collective mass of people.

So it seems.

Hmmm, and I’m not?

See 41

If you don’t like it, please explain why those words are wrong.

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The 1950s in the United States were a time of economic prosperity, social well-being, and technological advancements:

  • Economic growth

The economy grew by 37% during the 1950s, and the gross national product more than doubled.

  • Low unemployment

Unemployment was low, at around 4.5%.

  • High wages

Wages were high, and the median American family had 30% more purchasing power by the end of the decade.

  • Low inflation

Inflation was minimal, in part due to Eisenhower’s efforts to balance the federal budget.

  • Increased home ownership

Higher family incomes led to increased home ownership and the rise of suburban living.

  • Technological advancements

The 1950s were the atomic age of science and technology, with many new inventions, including the polio vaccine, the MOSFET, and the solar battery.

  • Popular culture

Television became more mature during the 1950s, and most American households owned a TV set by the end of the decade. Hollywood also tried new techniques, like CinemaScope and Cinerama, to show movies on large screens and in 3-D.

  • Positive outlook

A polling company found that between 1955 and 1960, about 40% of people questioned were very happy.

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Saw good stuff Lausten The Camino rela highking movie. Nice ;D.

Herea good movie that influence America and is great.

Citizen Kane reccomend you look for it.

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p1485_p_v8_aa960×1440 332 KB

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You repeat this a lot, but do you look for anyone who is incorporating this reality into their philosophy?

Here’s volume 1 of a 5 volume set.

From the blurb

Since the 1990s, however, many philosophers have drawn on recent advances in cognitive psychology, brain science, and evolutionary psychology to inform their work. This collaborative trend is especially strong in moral philosophy, and these volumes bring together some of the most innovative work by both philosophers and psychologists in this emerging interdisciplinary field.

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