Education

Politics and Social Issues
1

Just read a piece in Huff Post US about two veterans, aged 95 and 82, who finally attended a high school graduation ceremony.

The idea of a high school graduation being a big deal (plus wearing cap and gown) Has always seemed odd to me. Am I right in thinking that a college diploma does not guarantee the holder a right to attend a college?

Here, the end of year 12 is sometimes marked by a formal dinner and dance.This is a relatively recent innovation.

Here, year 12 exams are ‘public’. IE state wide, same exam for everyone. The results determine IF you qualify for university, and in which faculties .EG lower marks are accepted to study for a Liberal arts degree than say medicine, law or some other profession. Generally speaking, Australia doe snot have preparatory schools. (They may exist for foreign students, I don’t know)

When you are accepted into an ordinary degree, you are qualified to wear a gown, no cap. A cap may only be worn with advanced post graduate degrees.

I’m not suggesting Australian education is superior, it’s just different.

Universities here are now user pays. This was not the case when I went; there were no tuition fees. One was obliged to join the student union at about $300 a subject. That meant a maximum of under $2000 a year. If one objected, a donation of equal value could be made to a charity of one’s choice. The student union was not political; it provided a range of free or subsidised services; Eg a tavern, book shop, cheap lunches, free creches an a bunch of clubs.

Today, if one is unable to fees pay up front, a debt accrues. It’s called HECS (Higher Education Contribution Scheme) and becomes payable, by instalments, once personal income reaches a set figure.

As I said, different.

2

Our higher education system has become dysfunctionally expensive. We need to change it.

3

That was my perception, but I was too polite to say.

A perhaps a simplistic view:

The US spends more on its armed forces than any other nation on earth, expressed as dollars.

As an outsider, I can’t help but speculate on what would happen if the US took say 30% of the money spent on defence, in the last decade, and spend it on health, education and welfare. This would include as a priority, care of the war veterans created by the pure hawk attitude. My country also has a record of treating our veterans shamefully. ( on all sides of politics)

 

*Projected defence spending 2014-2024 is about one thousand $billion. (is that an American trillion?) It is my understanding that the US has already spent over one $trillion on the continuing wars in the middle east.

4

We also spend way more on our “health” system, and don’t even cover all citizens and we have worse health outcomes than a lot of other countries and we spend more on prescription drugs.

We also spend way more on our prison system (I presume, since we imprison way more ppl than other countries do).

But we have a businessman as POTUS now, so we can assume that he will correct all of these misguided expenditures… NOT!

5
Patrick D: "As an outsider, I can’t help but speculate on what would happen if the US took say 30% of the money spent on defence, in the last decade, and spend it on health, education and welfare."
It really makes you wonder how good we could have it if the masses had different priorities. Those who are voted into positions of power are only there because enough of us want them there. It's as though more people want to live in a violent, unfair, ignorant, regressive society than those who want a safe, fair, educated, progressive one.

I know that those who are preventing us from improving are simply deluded and lied to, but it sure seems like more than a few are willfully ignorant.

6

“It’s as though more people want to live in a violent, unfair, ignorant, regressive society than those who want a safe, fair, educated, progressive one:”

 

Aahhh hello. Which party wants safer fair educated progressive society??

7
Player: "Which party wants safer fair educated progressive society??"
In the US it's the Democrats, and in Canada it's anyone other than the Conservatives.
8
Just read a piece in Huff Post US about two veterans, aged 95 and 82, who finally attended a high school graduation ceremony. The idea of a high school graduation being a big deal (plus wearing cap and gown) Has always seemed odd to me.
High school graduation is just considered an important coming of age milestone in America aside from the educational aspect. It happens around the age of legal adulthood (18) and you're expected to enter the "real world" then.
Am I right in thinking that a college diploma does not guarantee the holder a right to attend a college? Here, the end of year 12 is sometimes marked by a formal dinner and dance.This is a relatively recent innovation. Here, year 12 exams are ‘public’. IE state wide, same exam for everyone. The results determine IF you qualify for university, and in which faculties .EG lower marks are accepted to study for a Liberal arts degree than say medicine, law or some other profession.
Right, a high school diploma is just certification that you completed the mandatory schooling. America doesn't have a concept of the right to attend higher education. Students who want to attend college have to achieve a certain grade point average and take tests called SATs......then they apply to different colleges that might accept them.
When you are accepted into an ordinary degree, you are qualified to wear a gown, no cap. A cap may only be worn with advanced post graduate degrees.
Interesting. I don't know where the tradition of school caps and gowns comes from but we have them at all high schools in the USA, and even some elementary and middle schools have them. I think my schools cap and gown were black and red.
9
As an outsider, I can’t help but speculate on what would happen if the US took say 30% of the money spent on defence, in the last decade, and spend it on health, education and welfare.
I don't think America needs to spend much more on education, we need to overhaul the public education system -- which is very outdated.
10
thatoneguy: "I don’t think America needs to spend much more on education, we need to overhaul the public education system — which is very outdated."
The main point is that people put their money where their minds are, and the US spends WAAAAAY more on military than anything else. When health and education should be the top of any societies list of priorities, why is military easily outstripping both of those items combined?

And if you think you can overhaul any system, especially the education system, without mountains of money, you’re nuts. They may be able to do better with what they have, but that’s a drop in the bucket compared to what they need.

It’s little wonder so many kids don’t think getting an education are important- society screams that message every day by massively underfunding teachers and schools.

11

How do you know what American kids think?

My point is spending more on an outdated system is a waste of money. Especially my money.

12

Thatoneguy despises neoliberialism yet wants to privatise the public education system. Go figure

13

I don’t it privatized I want the current 12 year model replaced with a multi-track system like they have in some European countries.