The mind and something

I haven’t read this yet but I will. Another theory of mind. Trigger warning, Descartes gets mentioned.

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This is the model current GPT AI uses, but “words” are replaced with “tokens”

I’d like to get to know Schrodinger better too

A century later and half a millennium after Descartes cleaved Western consciousness into its disembodied dualism, we are only just beginning to reckon with the growing understanding that consciousness is a full-body phenomenon, perhaps even a beyond-body phenomenon.

Dang, getting pretty close to “consciousness being an interaction”

See, my personal philosophy grows out of the science,
as opposed to so much of philosophy which grows out of very smart people’s competing thoughts trying to outdo each other.

Of course substantive science is relatively recent, so it’s no wonder philosophy hasn’t caught up to stone cold sober science, since philosophy is about humans defending their thoughts & dreams & egos - as opposed to the rule bound observations and drawing conclusions and retesting that science is all about.

This is Penrose’s perspective.
Instead of observation creating quantum collapse, quantum collapse is causal to observation, or a moment of cognition, what Hameroff calls a “Bing”.
IOW, there can be wave collapse without an conscious observer.

Even if the term observer is used as any sentient organism, the result of physical interaction is collapse of the wavefunction, but the wave collapse itself is only “experienced” (cognized) by the observers after the interactive event.

It’s hard for me to comprehend the concept of conscious observer at Planck Scales.

Sure an atom smashers can “observe” Planck Scale events. But for crying out loud, there are around 100,000,000,000,000,000,000 (10^20) atoms in a grain of sand.

Consciousness is about creature bodies interacting with environments and each other.

Consciousness is complex and ever changing, far beyond the Planck realm.

That’s nice to know.

Physical interaction?
Don’t you mean subatomic physical interaction?
There are no biological ‘creatures’ down at the Planck Scale.

The observers cognized the wave function collapse?
What “observes” are you referring to? Mind experiment observers? Right?

Aren’t you talking about the world of metaphor, and mathematics?

Oh and these cognized wave function collapse happen in Femtoseconds, one right after another. How does that convert to consciousness at biological speeds.

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Yes, but in physics an observer is defined as:

Observer (quantum physics)

Some interpretations of quantum mechanics posit a central role for an observer of a quantum phenomenon.[1] The quantum mechanical observer is tied to the issue of observer effect, where a measurement necessarily requires interacting with the physical object being measured, affecting its properties through the interaction. The term “observable” has gained a technical meaning, denoting a Hermitian operator that represents a measurement.[2]: 55

The Copenhagen interpretation, which is the most widely accepted interpretation of quantum mechanics among physicists,[1][3]: 248 posits that an “observer” or a “measurement” is merely a physical process. One of the founders of the Copenhagen interpretation, Werner Heisenberg, wrote:

Of course the introduction of the observer must not be misunderstood to imply that some kind of subjective features are to be brought into the description of nature. The observer has, rather, only the function of registering decisions, i.e., processes in space and time, and it does not matter whether the observer is an apparatus or a human being; but the registration, i.e., the transition from the “possible” to the “actual,” is absolutely necessary here and cannot be omitted from the interpretation of quantum theory.[4]

more… Observer (quantum physics) - Wikipedia

Registering decisions is not consciousness. That’s what this says.

From the wiki link

The prominence of seemingly subjective or anthropocentric ideas like “observer” in the early development of the theory has been a continuing source of disquiet and philosophical dispute.

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The Observer = the hypothetical = echo’s of a longing for a god. :wink:

Or simply a bunch of manmade mischief?