How do you know that?
Trees use the Fibonacci Sequence in their vertical growth to combat gravity.
I knew you’d say that. I met this guy. So, yeah, it’s possible. He was very insightful. The green lady was a tree. Read the blog, then the book.
“My experience with the green lady raises an important issue, namely, the true identity of the elements of nature. What if they are not inanimate objects, as people in the West have been taught to believe, but rather living presences? How would we need to change if we granted to a tree the kind of life that we usually reserve for so-called intelligent beings? If you peek long enough into the natural world - the trees, the hills, the rivers, and all natural things - you start to realize that their spirit is much bigger than what can be seen, that the visible part of nature is only a small portion of what nature is.”
I believe there are ways of approaching nature and mystery that are not taught in Western public schools. We are waking up to how that may be detrimental. But, any progress in that direction is unlikely to enhance the scientific methods. There is no story of a shaman meditating on existence and having something like Calculus revealed to them.
What do you expect?
Yes , Shaman and calculus don’t go together well. Scientists and calculus do.
How do you think biology discovered the Fibonacci sequence in plants and trees?
Jeez, I post very informative biology about mother-trees and the subterranean communication among plants and trees, sharing resources.
Here it is again
and a more expansive video
I think I’ve answered that in a number of ways over the last few weeks.
I don’t know what that means. Biology is a field of study. It doesn’t discover things.
Knowing the biology doesn’t address the question of what science is.
And we’re 50 more posts and a week into addressing your “chasing the tail” comments.
Do you think that we know everything in the universe and only need to study what is there? Or are we discovering new and exciting things about the universe that were never known before?
Biologists do too, discovering how things work in the field of biology.
Biology, the study of living organisms, is a complex field with many career possibilities. You can pursue a wide variety of biology-related careers in academia, writing and editing, laboratory research, health care and pharmaceuticals.May 26, 2023
Top 21 Biology Degree Jobs | Indeed.com
Fibonacci did! Do you think he made the trees grow the way they do or did he discover the way they grow?
Fibonacci numbers do appear in nature often enough to prove they reflect some naturally occurring patterns. You can commonly spot these by studying the manner in which various plants grow. Many seed heads, pinecones, fruits and vegetables display spiral patterns that when counted express Fibonacci numbers.Sep 23, 2021
The Fibonacci Sequence | Imagination Station
Trees used the Fibonacci growth sequence billions of years before Fibonacci was born.
Natural selection selected this efficient (exponential ) growth equation for a host of plants and trees from among every random growth process possible.
Do you know why the Fibonacci sequence is so successful in nature?
Being a scientist is the job discovering how things work in the field of physics.
This question makes no sense
No I don’t.
Neither do you!
Because it seems the fabled Fibonacci sequence, has been blown out of proportion. Quite literally.
You present the Fibonacci sequence the way a reporter would, all melodramatic conjectures and oversimplified conclusions.
I say this because whenever I do a little homework reading on the Fibonacci series, it never takes long to find out all sorts of articles blowing holes into the notion of the perfection in how we humans perceive the Fibonacci sequence.
PAPER
Phi does have one amazing quality. When you apply the ratio to a rectangle you create a golden rectangle. If you add a square the same width as its longest side then you create a new golden rectangle. Most commonly you see this applied in the layouts and proportions of books and magazines. The problem is the fiction around Phi, when it’s retrospectively applied to justify why a piece of art is great, to prove why a logo is perfect or to explain how a flower evolved. It’s an intoxicating idea to think that a number can unlock the secrets of nature, or success on the stock market, or beautiful design but, it’s an untrue one.
References
The Myth that Will Not Go Away
The Golden Ratio — A Contrary Viewpoint
Interview with Rob Janoff
Misconceptions about the Golden Ratio
https://www.fastcompany.com/3044877/the-golden-ratio-designs-biggest-myth
The golden ratio’s aesthetic bona fides are an urban legend, a myth, a design unicorn. Many designers don’t use it, and if they do, they vastly discount its importance. There’s also no science to really back it up. Those who believe the golden ratio is the hidden math behind beauty are falling for a 150-year-old scam.
Dec 11, 2012 Lecture Collection | Mathematics: Making the Invisible Visible
(October 8, 2012) Professor Keith Devlin dives into the topics of the golden ratio and fibonacci numbers.
Yeah, we know. Let’s move on from there.
You proposed that biology (science) does not discover things .
Seems to me you are proposing that we know everything, but just study it.
IMO, if we know 10 % of what the universe is all about, we still would need to discover the remaining 90% , no?
I did not propose that. You said:
How do you think biology discovered the Fibonacci sequence in plants and trees?
If you meant “biologists”, that makes a little more sense, but in response to my question, it still makes no sense at all. It’s phrased rhetorically, as if it addresses my comment about how scientific discoveries were not made by shamans communing with nature. A biologist studying a tree is a completely different thing than an insight gained by meditation. Once again, you are taking the conversation off in some direction that has nothing to do with what I’m talking about.
This is the question that made no sense:
Do you think that we know everything in the universe and only need to study what is there?
Of course I don’t think that. Try to be a little more charitable in your interpretation of other people’s words. What else have I ever said that would lead you to think I thought that?
This is where we were before you went off on this latest tangent. I should just delete the last nine posts.
Of course I meant biologists as representing the field of biology. No, I am not taking it in a random direction. I agree that shamans are not scientists, but I am absolutely sure they do discover things about the universe. Observation alone will go a long way to get a general idea of how the universe works.
It is at the very large and very small scales that things begin to diverge mathematically.
That comment was in context of your less-than-charitable way of looking at my use of the general term “biology” as being practiced by biologists, and your response that biology makes no discoveries.
This is the core problem, the rest is difficulty knowing what you mean when you aren’t addressing the actual topic.
Name a discovery about the universe that only comes from some kind of pre-scientific knowledge system. It could even be recent. Other than the obvious, like things fall down or stars move across the sky.
I addressed that. You ignored it
Time, Gravity, Triangulation,
Timeline of scientific discoveries
The timeline below shows the date of publication of possible major scientific breakthroughs, theories and discoveries, along with the discoverer. This article discounts mere speculation as discovery, although imperfect reasoned arguments, arguments based on elegance/simplicity, and numerically/experimentally verified conjectures qualify (as otherwise no scientific discovery before the late 19th century would count). The timeline begins at the Bronze Age, as it is difficult to give even estimates …
Geometry and trigonometry
2100 BC: The concept of area is first recognised in Babylonian clay tablets,[8] and 3-dimensional volume is discussed in an Egyptian papyrus. This begins the study of geometry.
Early 2nd millennium BC: Similar triangles and side-ratios are studied in Egypt (e.g. in the Rhind Mathematical Papyrus, a copy of an older Middle Kingdom text) for the construction of pyramids, paving the way for the field of trigonometry.[9]
Algebra
2100 BC: Quadratic equations, in the form of problems relating the areas and sides of rectangles, are solved by Babylonians.[8]
Number theory and discrete mathematics
2000 BC: Pythagorean triples are first discussed in Babylon and Egypt, and appear on later manuscripts such as the Berlin Papyrus 6619.[10]
Numerical mathematics and algorithms
2000 BC: Multiplication tables in Babylon.[11]
1800 BC – 1600 BC: A numerical approximation for the square root of two, accurate to 6 decimal places, is recorded on YBC 7289, a Babylonian clay tablet believed to belong to a student.[12]
19th to 17th century BCE: A Babylonian tablet uses 25⁄8 = 3.125 as an approximation for π, which has an error of 0.5%.[13][14][15]
Early 2nd millennium BCE: The Rhind Mathematical Papyrus (a copy of an older Middle Kingdom text) contains the first documented instance of inscribing a polygon (in this case, an octagon) into a circle to estimate the value of π.[16][17]
Notation and conventions
3000 BC: The first deciphered numeral system is that of the Egyptian numerals, a sign-value system (as opposed to a place-value system).[18]
2000 BC: Primitive positional notation for numerals is seen in the Babylonian cuneiform numerals.[19] However, the lack of clarity around the notion of zero made their system highly ambiguous (e.g. 13200 would be written the same as 132).[20]
Astronomy
Early 2nd millennium BC: The periodicity of planetary phenomenon[clarification needed] is recognised by Babylonian astronomers.
Regular occurrence of Night and Day.
Insects mastered flight billions of years before the first birds.
Echo-location by several species in air, on land, at sea.
Underground farming by ants and termites.
Bees learning to construct hexagonal honeycombs
Definitely not science.
I’m not talking about a point in time after the word "science " was coined.
Were any of these documented as some sort of revelation, or are they the result of observation and testing?
Your question was “outside science”
What I posted was pre-science
You are having trouble understanding words. You can’t just ignore a keyword, like “discovery” and name some things that fit the other words.
You are saying you have given me a list of prescience discoveries when the list is labeled “science”.
I’m not talking about a point in time after the word "science " was coined.
It’s nice to have a baseline against which to reference prior knowledge.
Obviously there wasn’t much science being done before any records were kept.
Were any of these documented as some sort of revelation, or are they the result of observation and testing?
My guess, both. But obviously anything prior to that was from simple observation.
When exactly did science begin? I admit I don’t know when conscious inquiry began and the first “person” asked the question, “what is it and what makes it tick”
But that is not science. Actually, that is how religion was born.
Long, long before the establishment of Science, possibly even before homo sapiens.
That’s the question of this thread. You’ve had an awful lot to say. But now, you don’t know. Okay
Do you have a date certain? At least I am saying something and we are having a
conversation. You can take it anywhere you wanna go. I’m versatile.