I cannot believe the effort by the pharmaceutical industry and those “TRUSTED” institutions to continue to lie to the public regarding the safety and efficacy of vaccines. It’s inconscionable. I am not here to be pro or anti vaccination. I will not get into this squabble. Do your own due diligence people. More and more (thank god for small things) testimony of parents whose children have had catastrophic reactions that ruined their lives are coming forward. I hope the center for inquiry (isn’t that suppose to be an open-minded forum before rushing to judgment?) will do their own research in order to come to their own conclusions, NOT MINE. No one is doing this which makes me believe you are all sheeples just going along with the status quo. Parents are being brainwashed at the expense of their babies —who have normal brain function at birth — before they inadvertently put them at risk. Where has the God given motherly instinct to protect her children at all costs GONE? I’m amazed how many parents hand over the health and well-being of their newborns to an institution who could care less as to whether their children end up damaged as long as they profit. Fighting in court to get compensated financially (even when a parent is given what is considered to be good enough) by a closed court (which is not even legitimate because it doesn’t allow any parent to sue the manufacturers which is why Big Pharma is able to continue to deceive the public) does nothing to address the underlying fraud involved. Instead of doing what vaccines are intended to do – be a preventative – they are causing short and long term damage (according to anecdotal reports which DO HOLD SERIOUS WEIGHT) even though the pharmaceutical industry, the CDC, the FDA, and the World Health Organization takes no responsibility for. This is ridiculously absurd if you study the stats which indicate that the US, in particular, is 27th (approximately) in infant mortality with the largest mass vaccination program ever. Other countries who do not push vaccines the way the U.S. does (in the US it’s risen to 49 doses of toxins before the age of 6), has less morbidity and mortality among our most vulnerable who cannot defend themselves and must depend on their guardians to protect them. Doesn’t that clue parents in that this is something they should be very concerned about? I mean parents are worried about nutrition, getting enough fresh air, making sure their children are clean and loved, but they are missing the elephant in the room which has more potential for destruction than anything else. Let me repeat: We are talking about infants and toddlers who begin to show signs of autism before 18 months of age; often after the 5th, 6th, 7th, or 8 vaccine given at once at a well visit. We do not know which children will be damaged until the damage shows itself in autistic behavior (among other chronic illnesses) where a child that once smiled and responded to a parent’s facial cues, does none of that. This happens (according to many doctors who are coming forward to oppose the vaccination program because they’ve seen the regression firsthand) when too many shots are given to where the brain is overwhelmed and loses its ability to protect. Again, you can say this is my opinion and has not been proven. I ask you therefore to do your own due diligence. Even if a parent isn’t sure, shouldn’t this cause a parent to be extremely concerned? You bet it should. Too often brain function (which often involves neurological and immunological stress) is said (by researchers) to be compromised by the use of vaccines because the body cannot handle the onslaught of toxins being poured into the infant’s bloodstream. You ask me, how do you know this is a problem? Again, I cannot answer this to your satisfaction if you are of the mindset that vaccinations don’t pose any risk to your child. We are not talking generalizations here as if YOUR child cannot be a victim. I will say there is enough information out there to make every concerned parent worried. Could it be possible that any of these horrible reactions may possibly be due to injecting formaldehyde, aluminum (which is known to be the worst toxin known to man) and many other known carcinogens into an infant whose brain (which involves his budding neurological and immunological systems) is just developing? There are many researchers that say suppressing certain illnesses does not make a child’s immune system stronger but can cause a worsening of these mild illnesses to become virulent later on. Do you know what the industry says after parents see an immediate regression in their children which would indicate to anyone a causal relationship to the vaccine? How do you know this vaccine caused this damage? There is no cause/effect analysis. You can’t tell us that your observations have any merit because you didn’t do a double blind study. In fact, there is no cause/effect relationship at all to prove that your child was damaged by this wonderful vaccine. This is an effort to REFUSE to take responsibility which mainstream media is all for. After all, mainstream media exists because they are getting paid in advertising to continue exploiting the public. Does any one see a problem here, or am I just in a world of my own? I don’t think so.
What’s unconscionable is to ignore the obvious dangers of not being vaccinated.
100% certainty and guarantees don’t happen in real life. Why pretend your approach can eliminate risk them, (they just create different and worse dangers)?
Oh and where are the studies to support your various claims?
I’ve come to realize this “do your own research” meme is the problem. Research is drug trials, LD50 tests, putting things in test tubes and petri dishes and seeing what happens. That’s been done for over a century with vaccines.
Luckily we’ve seen how Peace Girl operates, so not much point in trying to engage her. Not much point in trying to converse with someone who says there is information out there, yet provides none. Or says there is a profit motive, but apparently has never thought about what it takes to deliver vaccines so cheaply. Who calls out “sheeple” to a forum full of people have shown the ability to sort out evidence using reason.
This is ridiculously absurd if you study the stats which indicate that the US, in particular, is 27th (approximately) in infant mortality with the largest mass vaccination program ever.Are you tying that mortality rate to vaccination programs? Got any evidence? Could there be other factors responsible for the lion share of that? I'll admit, I think it's your easy dismissal of the CDC and World Health Organization what's gotten me really irritated at your post the more I think about its breezy glib certainty in your own under-informed opinion. Where do you get off assuming all these people who have dedicated there lives to studying, learning about and battling the various disease that stalk people can just be written off because you don't understand their work or studies? Or because they aren't quite as perfect as you want them to be. Do you really imagine anecdotal evidence trumps serious study? Do you really imagine not achieving 100% guarantee's is grounds for dismissing them in favor of TALKERS and book writers and snake oil salesmen?
Lausten, citizenschallenge.pm, you’ve encountered Peacegirl before? I can’t think of any other way that you could peg her so quickly.
Hey, peacegirl, while you’re at it, why don’t you copy-paste again, as you did at FF, the proof that pi=4, and that the Sandy Hook killings were a government false flag operation? Also, since you’ve really worked up a head of steam, why not again express your shock and indignation, as you did at FF, that our precious, impressionable chillun are being taught the special theory of relativity?
Lausten, citizenschallenge.pm, you've encountered Peacegirl before? I can't think of any other way that you could peg her so quickly.I hadn't seen Lausten post when I put mine up. He makes another great point. As for Pg, nah, her words in themselves are transparent enough. Though I have spent some time studying the processes of the Denialist Mind, perhaps gives me a leg up on seeing through nonsense. http://whatsupwiththatwatts.blogspot.com :cheese:
Also, since you've really worked up a head of steam, why not again express your shock and indignation, as you did at FF, that our precious, impressionable chillun are being taught the special theory of relativity?:ahhh: Jezus Lord almighty next I suppose they are going to try and teach 'em evolution. Com'n hurry up get them ear plugs and blinders on them chillun before it's too late!!!
Lausten, citizenschallenge.pm, you've encountered Peacegirl before? I can't think of any other way that you could peg her so quickly.There's a thread in Philosophy, "Revolution in Thought" that is up to 133 pages. It has been going consistently since March 9. It is the most extreme example of stubbornness that I have ever seen. But I don't get out that much. Also, she used every red-flag word in the book, "sheeple", "wake up", "do your own research", "corporate corruption" - those aren't exact quotes, but close enough.
This is ridiculously absurd if you study the stats which indicate that the US, in particular, is 27th (approximately) in infant mortality with the largest mass vaccination program ever.Could there be other factors responsible for the lion share of that? I didn't finish the OP, so I missed that one (which PG will now take as proof that I am not diligent), it shows ignorance of what IMR is tracking. Besides HepB, infants don't get vaccines until 6 months, MMR, the one from the Wakefield study, not until 1 year. IMR is an indicator of parental health during pregnancy and getting early nutritional needs met for the baby. That is a real problem, that a rich nation allows that to happen. That's something PG should be concerned about. But that would be something that she could actually find some actual actions she would have to take. It's much easier to write blog posts about vaccines.
Lausten, citizenschallenge.pm, you've encountered Peacegirl before? I can't think of any other way that you could peg her so quickly.There's a thread in Philosophy, "Revolution in Thought" that is up to 133 pages. It has been going consistently since March 9. It is the most extreme example of stubbornness that I have ever seen. But I don't get out that much. You sure don't. :lol: The thread] with the same title by the same author at the Freethought Forum is 1,670 pages long across some four years, with 41,733 replies, and 1,588,134 page views (and counting on all counts). But then, peacegirl has been doing this online for about 13 years, and had a similar long-standing engagement at the old iidb about eight years ago.
Lausten, citizenschallenge.pm, you've encountered Peacegirl before? I can't think of any other way that you could peg her so quickly.There's a thread in Philosophy, "Revolution in Thought" that is up to 133 pages. It has been going consistently since March 9. It is the most extreme example of stubbornness that I have ever seen. But I don't get out that much. You sure don't. :lol: The thread] with the same title by the same author at the Freethought Forum is 1,670 pages long across some four years, with 41,733 replies, and 1,588,134 page views (and counting on all counts). But then, peacegirl has been doing this online for about 13 years, and had a similar long-standing engagement at the old iidb about eight years ago. From what I have been able to gather, Peacegirl has been doing the same thing, the same way, on internet forums for over 13 years and expecting different results each time. On Freethought Forum someone suggested that this was a sign of something, and it wasn't good mental health. Most of the regulars who follow Peacegirl don't expect to change her beliefs or practices, we just accept her for who she is, but we do hope that all those "thousands of lurkers" reading the thread will see the truth, and not be taken in by Peacegirl and her father. But given her posts, and the occasional excerpt from the book, I don't think there is much danger of that.
Com'n hurry up get them ear plugs and blinders on them chillun before it's too late!!!https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OAZ8yOFFbAc
This is ridiculously absurd if you study the stats which indicate that the US, in particular, is 27th (approximately) in infant mortality with the largest mass vaccination program ever.Could there be other factors responsible for the lion share of that? I didn't finish the OP, so I missed that one (which PG will now take as proof that I am not diligent), it shows ignorance of what IMR is tracking. Besides HepB, infants don't get vaccines until 6 months, MMR, the one from the Wakefield study, not until 1 year. IMR is an indicator of parental health during pregnancy and getting early nutritional needs met for the baby. That is a real problem, that a rich nation allows that to happen. That's something PG should be concerned about. But that would be something that she could actually find some actual actions she would have to take. It's much easier to write blog posts about vaccines. Lausten, you are entitled to do (if you have a newborn) what you believe is best for your family. If you feel that 49 injections into a baby (from infancy up to 6 years old including diseases that disappeared long before mass vaccinations) is the best way to protect your child, then by all means GO FOR IT.
Lausten, you are entitled to do (if you have a newborn) what you believe is best for your family. If you feel that 49 injections into a baby (from infancy up to 6 years old including diseases that disappeared long before mass vaccinations) is the best way to protect your child, then by all means GO FOR IT.That's very generous of you. That is exactly what I believe. If you believe that trading a 1 in a million (literally) chance of complications from a vaccine for a much higher probability of contracting a potentially deadly disease is a good trade off, GO FOR IT. And by giving the vaccine, you get the added bonus of protecting everyone else around you and even future generations. But, we can't make you. If you want to follow the ramblings of a former actress or discredited doctor who sells supplements, GO FOR IT.
I can’t do this every time someone comes on here claiming to have " done their own research " and decided vaccines are dangerous when in fact all they’ve done is read nonsense on the Internet.
Here is a thread where Mckenzie and I debunked the flawed arguments often put forward by anti vaxxers and others who have irrational fears and misinformation concerning vaccines
http://www.centerforinquiry.net/forums/viewthread/1758/
Enough time has been wasted already.
You can also do some real research ( not the silly kind) if you are really interested by reading through Mackenzie’s blog here: http://skeptvet.com/Blog/2015/04/sb277-eliminating-personal-belief-vaccine-exemption-in-california/
Or on my own vaccine page here: http://www.doctormelgar.com/vaccines
Just a quick note regarding your comment on formaldehyde, the amount of formaldehyde found in each vaccine is about the same amount that your own body produces every single day as side product of normal biochemical reactions. This is the sort of thing fear mongers conveniently leave out in their stories.
I can't do this every time someone comes on here claiming to have " done their own research " and decided vaccines are dangerous when in fact all they've done is read nonsense on the Internet. Here is a thread where Mckenzie and I debunked the flawed arguments often put forward by anti vaxxers and others who have irrational fears and misinformation concerning vaccines http://www.centerforinquiry.net/forums/viewthread/1758/ Enough time has been wasted already. You can also do some real research ( not the silly kind) if you are really interested by reading through Mackenzie's blog here: http://skeptvet.com/Blog/2015/04/sb277-eliminating-personal-belief-vaccine-exemption-in-california/ Or on my own vaccine page here: http://www.doctormelgar.com/vaccines Just a quick note regarding your comment on formaldehyde, the amount of formaldehyde found in each vaccine is about the same amount that your own body produces every single day as side product of normal biochemical reactions. This is the sort of thing fear mongers conveniently leave out in their stories.Look macgvver, anecdotal evidence means something when a parent sees a child convulsing right after given a vaccine. You cannot deny that some children (and they have no test to pre-screen which children will be affected) will be injured or even killed by vaccines. So don't come here and claim that there is no risk, and don't tell me that mandating vaccines by the government is democratic. And please don't tell me that the vaccine manufacturers should not be held responsible for the claims that prove the vaccines had something to do with their child's permanent disability. And don't tell me that the CDC and FDA aren't in cahoots with the manufacturers due to a profit motive. This is absolutely sick and people are beginning to fight back. I thank the whistle blower who claimed the test that said MMR shots are safe was rigged. These people cannot get away with this, and will not. The public is angry for good reason and this is far from over.
Look macgvver, anecdotal evidence means something …Anecdotal evidence means nothing.
...when a parent sees a child convulsing right after given a vaccine.LOL, independently verified evidence of this shit claim, please? :lol:
So don't come here and claim that there is no risk…No one ever claimed that, you prevaricating harridan. There is risk in everything -- even getting out of bed in the morning. What IS claimed, correctly, is that the idea that vaccines cause autism is a documented LIE. By a liar, just like you.
The public is angry for good reason and this is far from over.That small, but unfortunately dangerous, part of the public that opposes vaccines is a cohort of morons. You're in good company with them.
Like I said, I can’t waste my time with one more crackpot who doesn’t want to listen to reason. You came back and responded without reading any of the resources I linked to. If there is anyone here who is unsure about vaccines and wants to have a rational discussion I am all ears but I am not going to spend time with someone who doesn’t really want to have a science based discussion.
Like I said, I can't waste my time with one more crackpot who doesn't want to listen to reason. You came back and responded without reading any of the resources I linked to. If there is anyone here who is unsure about vaccines and wants to have a rational discussion I am all ears but I am not going to spend time with someone who doesn't really want to have a science based discussion.I have read and I have read, and I will continue to read but you cannot tell me that there isn't a problem with the amount of vaccines being given. Those who are in the medical arena cannot be honest with themselves. They have to support mainstream medicine or they could lose their license. The science that has been determined to be science is not science at all. It's junk science. Did you not hear me when I said that there was a whistle blower who said the science (the empirical testing) was doctored when it came to the conclusion that the MMR vaccine was perfectly safe and had no connection with autism in black babies? In actuality it showed a 300% increase in risk, but it was never disclosed. You are refusing to listen to the other side of this important issue.