Two in a row! :ahhh:
I may have to hide for a while before I get over this, I'm not really that dumb, just that inattentive*.
No wonder. If you are so much more committed to global warming... Well it is clear what is more important. But it is good to see how beautiful the world can be, so now and then.
This seems like a good jumping off point for some thoughts i’d like to share with cerebral friends.
I wonder about my passion for the global warming thing, believe it or not, it’s actually an off shoot - {understanding the pageant of evolution is my real passion.}
Its roots are in my life long passion for getting to know this existence and planet that surrounds me.
With the years, I’ve come to know that’s not my own invention, that came from the passion that’s in my “stock” . . . my blood, my parents, their parents.
Nature awareness from Mom and Grandma… my maternal great grandfather long dead before my birth, but I know he had a fruit tree orchard and did lots of experiments with grafting… I can only imagine his thoughts and dreams and where they sprang from, but I’ll bet his parents had a bit to do with it.
There is something to be said for blood lines. The global warming situation happens to be the most important challenge of our time, bar none.
Unfortunately, I think our realistic windows of opportunity closed with the 80s and 90s - now… often, I don’t even know what the point of writing about it is, I know it’s an exercise in futility. I rarely talk about AGW with friends and acquaintances, it seems so pointless and the lack of basic scientific/natural awareness is staggering, and the lack of curiosity is even more heartbreaking, so what’s the point I ask/tell myself.
But, then I read these totally mistaken things people are repeating and believing… and I can’t shut up.
Or, I bump into another example of the steady parade of pure con artists and denialist punks and bullies… and I can’t shut up. What'sUpWithThatWatts, et al.: Surely you're joking Mr. Weingarten!
I do struggle with it, walk away… get realistic, leave it be, tell myself to worry more about my own day to day.
But, then I start feeling like a fraud and a coward, and that’s exactly how these folks get away with it - everyone gets overwhelmed and gives up -, and next thing I know, I have some free time and all I can think of is trying to do a better job of trying to explain it… It’s also my process for trying to understand that collective permeating denial of what we are doing to our only planet.
~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ * and fatigued at the time
I do struggle with it, walk away… get realistic, leave it be, tell myself to worry more about my own day to day.
But, then I start feeling like a fraud and a coward, and that’s exactly how these folks get away with it - everyone gets overwhelmed and gives up -, and next thing I know, I have some free time and all I can think of is trying to do a better job of trying to explain it… It’s also my process for trying to understand that collective permeating denial of what we are doing to our only planet.
~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~
Lots of ways to address the problem CC. I know that one way is to post here but in essence you're preaching to the choir, to borrow a religious analogy. That doesn't mean you should by any means stop though. Have you ever thought about getting involved in politics,say on the local level at least? That would be one way to spread the word about AGW. Most people have little or no exposure to the problem even through the media which, even here doesn't cover it as well as it should. Writing letters to local and national leaders also will help. Hell, even letters to the local newspaper may help some readers to give pause for thought. And you're right about the overwhelming part. I know you have a blog but are you a Facebook user as well? It links to millions of people. It's a daunting task to be sure but the more people hear about how it will negatively affect their lives the better. You're fighting apathy, ignorance and fear and those three are pretty to tough to beat. BTW, my passion is evolution as well, especially Paleoanthropology. They keep pushing our origins farther and farther back. Right now it's 6.7 million ya and counting!
Cap't Jack
true, true. Trust me what I’ve written here is a fraction of what I’ve written
And there is:
And the first one is up to about 7,000 views per month.
And the last one has had an impact on the political process regarding a Mr.ClearChannel, Red McCombs’ crazy 80s dream of bulldozing a luxury village of ten thousand at over 9,000 feet elevation, in the middle of a source waters watershed for the Rio Grande River.
Actually in a couple weeks the Rio Grande Nat’l Forest will be releasing a key EIS and we’ll see just how much impact I may have had with NO Village at Wolf Creek: Village at Wolf Creek Environmental Impact Study Issues and such.
{Been to the past three State Democratic Conventions, 2 out of 3 as a delegate }
~ ~ ~
Yea, the Facebook thing… I really should look into that more than I have…
<em>I come here for a break with a group of folks I can relate to and feel comfortable around.</em>
Yeah, I just read your Wolf Creek blog on your other posting. It looks like you’re fully committed to the fight so all I can possibly add is that I’m impressed, keep hammering home the message and I’m with you one hundred percent. this is a cause everyone should pursue as it’s our asses as well as all life on this planet if we don’t.
Cap’t Jack
Yeah, I just read your Wolf Creek blog on your other posting. It looks like you're fully committed to the fight so all I can possibly add is that I'm impressed, keep hammering home the message and I'm with you one hundred percent. this is a cause everyone should pursue as it's our asses as well as all life on this planet if we don't.
Cap't Jack
I do see your point. If you look at statistics http://www.actionforourplanet.com/#/top-10-polluting-countries/4541684868 then I think you might be able to find your focus. Focusing on local “small ticket” pollution seems to me a waste of time. You can influence 1000 kids to “think green”, do a recycling drive, whatever. And if every city in the US followed suit that might eliminate a miniscule fraction of a fraction of what China alone pollutes. Instead focus on Chinese government somehow. Same with the US government though even that would be minimal I think. If the US cut it’s emissions by 75% but China still put out (and increased) it’s output what effect would the US reduction really have?
I do see your point. If you look at statistics http://www.actionforourplanet.com/#/top-10-polluting-countries/4541684868 then I think you might be able to find your focus. Focusing on local “small ticket" pollution seems to me a waste of time. You can influence 1000 kids to “think green", do a recycling drive, whatever. And if every city in the US followed suit that might eliminate a miniscule fraction of a fraction of what China alone pollutes. Instead focus on Chinese government somehow. Same with the US government though even that would be minimal I think. If the US cut it’s emissions by 75% but China still put out (and increased) it’s output what effect would the US reduction really have?
I suppose one person could have the balls to tackle the most populated country on Earth but my advise is to help clean up your own corner first, then you and all of your friends and fellow citizens can bring your pressure to bear on China. Of course the only way to accomplish that Herculean feat is via the Government and the only way to influence the Gov't is with a massive political movement, maybe a "Green party" of our own like the Germans. It seems though that the Chinese are just beginning to realize the real pollution threat as well when they have to wear masks in their cities because of the incredible increase of smog from automobiles and coal fired factories. They're going to figure it out soon or slowly choke to death on Twentieth Century modernity regardless of the temporary benefits.
Cap't Jack
The global warming situation happens to be the most important challenge of our time, bar none.
Unfortunately, I think our realistic windows of opportunity closed with the 80s and 90s - now… often, I don't even know what the point of writing about it is, I know it's an exercise in futility. I rarely talk about AGW with friends and acquaintances, it seems so pointless and the lack of basic scientific/natural awareness is staggering, and the lack of curiosity is even more heartbreaking, so what's the point I ask/tell myself.
The future isn't set yet, there will almost certainly be a large loss of species, but my thinking is we can preserve the majority of them and create a truly sustainable method of living when we get serious about it like so many people want to. So I think it's a very good idea to keep debunking the contrarians who value things that in my opinion really have no real intrinsic value like the endless treadmill of mindless consummerism with "profit" replacing the concept of god in some people's minds.
I'm going to keep pointing out the well established science behind climate change and the dangers of things like uncontrolled industrial fishing, destructive agriculture, clear-cutting old growth forests into extinction, urban sprawl, the loss of coral reefs and more. I don't think most people are consciously suicidal on a collective level, so they need to be told that very influential segments of society are forcing us on that path out of ignorance. Knowledge is the antidote to that.
As I’ve mentioned before, Americans don’t have to look that far back in our History to see the effects of climate change coupled with wasteful and unscientific agricultural practices to see the results. The Dust bowl should have taught us a valuable lesson. There are even a few hardy souls who remember when the Midwest dried up and blew away into a cloud of red dust and nearly a million people were displaced. Just think what would happen if that event occurred today. Where would they go? East? West?
Cap’t Jack
CC, On this issue, you are a drop of water. But an ocean is made up of a multitude of drops of water. Most others may resolve their cognitive dissonance on this issue, by becoming a denier, or by being firmly apathetic, or by being a cynic.
By far, I admire your approach and its intellectual integrity.
To be quite honest, I am utterly confused when it comes to global warming or climate change.
I know the Earth goes through cycles (which we can’t change) and that people destroy the planet with their irresponsible and greedy behavior (which we can change), but in how far this can be curbed I’m at a total loss. I don’t think political change will help much, as the whole planet would have to go with it. I think there would have to be an entirely new underlying philosophy. What I mean is:
Green energy… BUT nobody cares and it’s subsidized because it can’t produce (yet) the needed energy to feed our habits.
Nuclear is “BAD" because we’re hippies, and yet it’s the cleanest thing there is. And the new fracking thing might be a gold mine of independence, but did any habits change?
How much damage does our beef consume do? Those farting cows probably destroy the most.
The whole thing is a big mess because everybody wants to address symptoms and put bandages on. It goes much deeper than that.
To address climate change (I don’t know if global warming is necessarily the correct word, as it includes crazy winters like this year and confused hurricanes down here in FL), I think we need to first address our habits and entire worldview and outlook on life. A “Christian worldview", just for example, sees nothing wrong with exploiting the Earth. Sure, “be good stewards of God’s creation", but the focal point is always “the crown of creation". It’s the most selfish religion there is. Stuff like that contributes.
I like green energy, but I don’t oppose nuclear energy like some of my “tree hugging" friends because it’s really the only way to get this planet clean unless people cease to be addicted to their status quo. And, green energy has problems of its own. Wind mills hurt certain birds and bats. Who knows where that leads. Solar panels must be disposed of somehow. …
But anyway, I’m utterly confused. Unless something really drastic will happen, nature-wise, nobody will do anything.
Hopefully I’m wrong, but WHAT to do…. I have no idea.
CC is extremely expert in this area and could easily write a whole book on the topic. I’ll try to be succinct, and he can correct me.
Animals breathe in oxygen and breathe out carbon dioxide, and plants absorb the CO2 and use it to make themselves and give off oxygen. It used to be a great equilibrium.
As our civilization grew we needed energy for almost everything. The most available source we have is carbon based: coal, petroleum, and a bit of wood. When it’s burned including in an automobile engine the carbon combines with oxygen to make carbon dioxide. And we dump far more in the atmosphere than the plants can convert back.
The sun is our ultimate source of energy (ignoring nuclear for the moment), and pours a huge amount on the earth. A fair amount of it is radiated back into space as long wave infra-red, again in equilibrium. But while carbon dioxide is transparent to visible light, it’s opaque to long wave infra-red. This means as we dump CO2 into the atmospnere less and less of the excess sun energy can escape so we heat up.
The polar ice caps and glaciers melt dumping huge amounts of water into the oceans and causing the level to rise. A great deal of the land is just a few feet above present sea level so it is becoming flooded. This means less farm land and less liveable land.
All of these change weather patterns so some areas will become wetter and some drier. Much present farm land will become arid, food production will drop and many people will starve.
Nuclear doesn’t create CO2, but it does create extremely toxic waste which has to be disposed of, and there isn’t enough uranium, etc. to keep the world’s energy supplied for too long.
Solar panels can wear out just as everything else does, but they can be recycled.
Some birds are killed by windmills, but I seem to recall seeing a paper that showed that far fewer were killed than was being claimed.
Sorry, that wasn’t very succinct.
Occam
The Quantum Mechanics of it are quite amazing, one CO2 molecule can go through billions of interactions a second with longwave EM, the air around us is alive in a certain sense. Which is why it’s a really bad idea to change the concentration of such important trace gases so quickly.
Succinct or not, Occam, you give me material to think about.
I don’t really care much about global warming personally, as I try to do the best I can anyway, global warming or not, but I can understand CC’s frustration. It sucks to see the end coming and nobody listening. CC, you’re in Nietzsche shoes…
Peace, my friends.
To be quite honest, I am utterly confused when it comes to global warming or climate change.
I know the Earth goes through cycles (which we can’t change) and that people destroy the planet with their irresponsible and greedy behavior (which we can change), but in how far this can be curbed I’m at a total loss. I don’t think political change will help much, as the whole planet would have to go with it. I think there would have to be an entirely new underlying philosophy. What I mean is:
1) Green energy… BUT nobody cares and it’s subsidized because it can’t produce (yet) the needed energy to feed our habits.
2) Nuclear is “BAD" because we’re hippies, and yet it’s the cleanest thing there is. And the new fracking thing might be a gold mine of independence, but did any habits change?
3) How much damage does our beef consume do? Those farting cows probably destroy the most.
The whole thing is a big mess because everybody wants to address symptoms and put bandages on. It goes much deeper than that.
To address climate change (I don’t know if global warming is necessarily the correct word, as it includes crazy winters like this year and confused hurricanes down here in FL), I think we need to first address our habits and entire worldview and outlook on life. A “Christian worldview", just for example, sees nothing wrong with exploiting the Earth. Sure, “be good stewards of God’s creation", but the focal point is always “the crown of creation". It’s the most selfish religion there is. Stuff like that contributes.
I like green energy, but I don’t oppose nuclear energy like some of my “tree hugging" friends because it’s really the only way to get this planet clean unless people cease to be addicted to their status quo. And, green energy has problems of its own. Wind mills hurt certain birds and bats. Who knows where that leads. Solar panels must be disposed of somehow. …
But anyway, I’m utterly confused. Unless something really drastic will happen, nature-wise, nobody will do anything.
Hopefully I’m wrong, but WHAT to do…. I have no idea.
If you're confused by a scientific phenomena, listen to the scientists. 95% of the members of the National Academy of Sciences and most international scientific bodies agree that there is global warming and volatile climate change already happening, with more to come. Learn what they are saying and why they are saying it. Why believe amateurs and lay people who don't have a clue as to what is actually happening? Educate yourself as to what professional scientists are saying about climate change and what is causing it. There is no reason to be confused unless you are listening to fools.
Lois
To add to Lois’ “amateurs and lay people” some of the major deniers are “scientists” employed by the oil and coal companies which would stand to lose much of their markets as people move away from energy produced by their products.
Occam
To add to Lois' "amateurs and lay people" some of the major deniers are "scientists" employed by the oil and coal companies which would stand to lose much of their markets as people move away from energy produced by their products.
Occam
But they aren't likely to be members of the National Academy of Sciences. You can find ignoramuses in any group and the ones who are paid ignoramuses are the worst.
Lois
Oh god, no, no not that. :ahhh:
As a pure novice, my impression is Nietzsche spent way too much time bellybutton gazing, not that he didn't have some good points. :-/
Me I'm hooked on understanding this planet and my time here.
And though the global warming reality is a big downer and most of my internet presence
I am fully engage in all the joyful stuff too]. :coolsmile:
Maybe that's why I'm so passionate, I appreciate the stakes we are gambling away.
===========
Oh about the global warming thing, to be succinct. :)
We ARE increasing our planet's atmospheric insulation layer,
it IS heating up our planet,
and that Will disrupt all of the geophysical systems we have come to know and love… and depend on.
:cheese:
}