Not totally related, but still funny
No need for histrionics, we women can do better than that, despite Freudâs Reasoning.
What about what I said?
Iâd also add that when I try to ask them about the stuff he writes about I just get deflections to stuff about me and not really about what is said, as if me disagreeing means something is wrong with me.
I said I canât tell whatâs going on with you. Iâm not going to comment on something you said to somebody who is also vague and then what they said about you
You donât think itâs odd having someone avoid asking questions about and article. He never wanted to talk about it but shifted to other things when it came up.
Iâm not sure who youâre talking about.
The guy who owns the site Iâm linking to, I posted that long bit above.
Probably has his reasons, and his own interests at play.
Might be better to focus on your own motivations and actions than spending too much time worrying about others. As I think youâve pointed out in other places, people do tend to disappoint, donât give them too much power over yourself.
What will you be present to?
Does that person matter, or do you matter?
1 Like
Well itâs hard to let it go when you canât get it out of your head:
"One of the things that we realize or distort is this notion that âOh, this person makes me so angry.â âThey make me so sad.â âThey make me so happy.â And the way weâve hypnotized ourselves with thinking and saying that sort of thing multiple times over the years. And now you come to this realization like âWait a minute, Iâve been giving my power away. I give my power away to this person.â Thatâs not whatâs been happening.
Your power hasnât been going to this person. It hasnât been going to traffic or the weather. Power has been going into this idea youâve stored in this program-memory. The unconscious about your relationship to weather, the relationship to this person, the relationship to a customer service agent. Youâve invested faith. Even though you said, âThey make me happyâ. The power isnât in them, the power is in the idea that you make them happy. And when you recognize the idea is false. âThey donât make me happy.â I love being with him and my love coming out for them feels really great, joyful, happy, lovingâŚâ But âmake meâ thatâs a different thing. âMake me miserable.â âMake me afraid.â âMake me jealous.â âMake me angry.â Thatâs amplifying it to a lie level. And itâs not them making me happy, weâre not giving our power to them, weâre giving our power to these ideas in the form of beliefs.
25:50
So you donât have to recover your power back from that or the person. Youâre recovering back your power from your own belief system, by breaking yourself from this hypnosis of lies. And Iâm not inviting you to find all these buried unconscious agreements. There are more skills needed to do that. What I first want you to do is grow an awareness and say âYes, I am creating my emotions based on these unconscious belief programs that just take off. And my mind wants to say they, or that thing, or this customer service person, or this traffic, or this rain is causing me to feel this way. And I realized thatâs not true. And I realized the truth is that Iâve invested power in these unconscious beliefs and they have been creating my emotions 80 to 90% of the time.â"
What am I supposed to think when someone says itâs not the object or person doing something but my belief about it? What am I supposed to do? How am I supposed to feel knowing nothing truly moves me?
Though this is ironic since the dudeâs page is literally hating Palestine.
He answers this, although not in a lot of detail, but you can find more on this all over. Change your habits. Beliefs are formed. Learn more about how your mind works and form new ideas, new beliefs.
Things do move you. Look at a puppy and try to feel nothing. Then look at his examples. The weather doesnât have to make you mad, a farmer is happy about a little rain, you can enjoy the sensation of rain too. There is nothing in this talk that says you canât be happy.
Hereâs better context:
"And we say these things without realizing the impact. What weâve done is weâve attributed our emotions to this joke that someone said. Good emotions or bad emotions. But if it was really the joke, then wouldnât that joke affect all people the same way? The joke is healthy water, everybody drinks healthy water, and itâs good, itâs good for him. If itâs a poison, thatâs enough poison, it would kill everybody. But if itâs a drink that makes one person better and one person, Ill, then somethingâs in that personâs system, that gives them a different effect. One person eats wheat, âI feel great!â. Another person eats wheat, if they have celiac disease, they get sick. Is it the wheat? No, itâs the way our system responds to the wheat. Whatâs going on inside of us, and how we respond and our body responds to the wheat.
With the joke. We have a response to the joke, but we donât see it, itâs invisible, we donât see it. Because itâs silent. We donât hear it. It happens so quick. We havenât tuned our attention to catch it. And thatâs the interpretation and meaning of what we believe the joke means. That gives us a response of joyful laughter or feeling offended. A personâs body responds to wheat. A creating of something painful in their body or feeling good. Itâs not the wheat. Itâs how we respond to it. We all respond, according to how we perceive based on our belief system interpreting it.
But hereâs the lie I want you to catch, itâs when we say that joke made me laugh, because thatâs the lie.
And it causes us to take our attention away, and ignore this interpretation mechanism, and meaning we create about what we just heard, and attribute our emotions of joy to the joke alone. And the person whoâs offended, they attribute their suffering, their anger, and their feeling offended to the joke or to the person who said it. And they donât notice the power they have to change their belief, to change their interpretation. And then change how they feel about what was said. Or at least reduce it if they still find itâs in bad taste."
But to this:
This is just kicking the can down the road though. If stuff doesnât make you feel a certain way about things then changing your beliefs wonât either. How does changing a belief change how you feel about something when we donât control how we feel about beliefs, he doesnât answer the question just delays the inevitable.
He says things donât move you because itâs youâre belief about something or someone and not the thing itself. Itâs literally an argument against being happy. Even the joy you get from nature functions the same, which he doesnât understand.
Thatâs not what he says. You need to figure what is meant by âhaving feelingsâ. Without that, none of this will make sense.
Lausten having this dialogue with inthedarkness playing in the background of my mind, while listening to Sapolskyâs book Iâm at chapter 10, #9 was all about the quantum realm and all its weirdness. #10 is about extrapolations that some philosophers and new agers have done with that information.
Right now Iâm relieved to see Sapolskyâs thoughtful deconstructions. Iâve already order âBehaveâ I have the feeling for me that one will be even more interesting than this one, which Iâm enjoying.
Through it all, Iâm thinking about the what if.
What if Sapolskyâs introduced his topic with some fundamental facts.
This is something Iâd love to discuss with Dark, but so far he seems to avoid it, and Iâm still looking for excuses to write about it. Iâm playing with the idea of writing Sapolsky although that would have be reduced to a question and a very few sentences.
Philosophy and psychologists canât answer the fundamental questions about the self without recognizing the biological realities of our evolved bodies.
Your mind is the product of your body/brain.
That is, the inside reflection of your body communicating with itself while maintaining homeostasis and dealing with the ever changing environment.
You, me, are a mammals. The body you possess is the product of Earthâs evolutionary processes, with countless very advantageous twists and turns. The reason thatâs important to appreciate is because it helps one realize we have systems within systems that were honed through time. Knowledge and behaviors beyond our conscious awareness, but still a part of you, because you are your body.
You really want to know thy self, then donât start with ideas and logicing-it-out. Start by looking at other mammals (and beyond). Think about how much their behavior is preprogrammed within their body, instinctive behavior.
Become aware those automatous things happening within your own body.
Our introspective, learning consciousness is build on top of that, and remains dependent on the rest of our body/brain systems.
Once we start grasping those biological fundamentals, the entire notion of âFree Willâ is deflated like an old party balloon. Itâs not right or wrong, itâs not even a thing.
Itâs like âConsciousnessâ an in the moment product of interactions.
What we actually know is that every day we must make choices, often in totally unique unexpected situations, and every choice determines aspects of your future life, many tiny, but all adding up to who we are at any particular moment.
Looking at it from the biological perspective itâs all about the moment and processing information; and becoming aware of that information; and relating it to other past events; and also to imagine future potential unfolding of events.
In my mindscape âfree willâ hides in those nooks and crannies. The dam builder v. kayaker.
The natural world, our lives and the societies we human create all have trajectories. Futures are implied, but never guaranteed, and the future always seems to be full of surprises. Thatâs why spending endless hours fretting about the loss of âFree Willâ seems like such a misguided waste, since itâs asking the wrong question. What will you be present to?
I took a short course on elevator speeches. I had a short paragraph written beforehand but thatâs a 100 story building. I now have one sentence or even less, a key phrase, a tease about how I experience it, a provocative few words. Good thing to have in mind
That is exactly what he says. Feelings are just something that happens to you. Something making you happy means you like it, if you get sad it means you cared about it, if youâre angry something is threatened, etc. Stuff makes us feel things, itâs how we move. How do beliefs move us without emotion behind them? According to him nothing makes me happy, just my belief about it. But that doesnât explain how the belief does that.
Is this what you think? Or is it what you think the guy is saying?
I didnât say that. He didnât either. I said, we have feelings, then we believe something caused the feeling. Something caused the feeling, or as you say, it just happened, but what we believe caused it and what actually caused it are often different. Thatâs what heâs saying when he says, âthe weather didnât make you feel badâ.
Is that supposed to mean some thing?
All I can make out is that it underscores why weâll never philosophize our way to understanding our consciousness, let alone who we are.
The mindscape is too wrapped up in its own Ego to let go of its own importance.
Thatâs why Iâve come to recognize the best way to approach the question of âWho Am I?â and related angst driven questions - to first, start with learning about and recognition how your body creates who you are. You are an animal. That realization helps us recognize how much our environment plays into who we are. To actually deep down visceral connect with a sense of yourself being part of an unbroken lineage. Your mind produced by your body/brain in action, dealing our inner feelings and the world.
Turn your life into a âbuddy movieâ you and your body experiencing thrills and spills. 
What makes you special is that you can be introspective, wonder about yourself, learn about yourself, pay attention to yourself with an inner curiosity about where all those crazy feelings come from.
In common with all other living creatures life promises death. What will you be present to?
What is Dark being offering, talk about talk, most of it slightly true to an extent, but meaningless if the receiver isnât receiving.
I wonder why the obsession with question that canât be answered in any event? Why not approach the problem from a new perspective? Why not give biology and science a try?
Why not less time worrying about never ending questions - spend more effort in trying to grasp yourself given the amazing information at hand?
Sopalskyâs chapter #11 is awesome in how it gets into the details that I can only wax about poetically. This guy understands the layers of physical mechanisms that goes into making us who we are individually. Heâs good at explaining aspects of how they affect us and interact with other components. He gives a broad overview, even spends some time with Penrose/Hammerhof and their microtubules idea; during which he does a nice job of explaining the scientific reality of the âScaling Problemâ I sometimes bring up. (#3 was the other standout chapter - makes me think of astronomical interferometers, various receivers combining limited images to create much greater image.)
That we even have this big debate with claimants arguing that biology canât explain human consciousness, feels evermore incomprehensible. It does reveal how little the reality of our Evolution and Earthâs biosphere being our life support system has actually soaked into our general psyche. Weâve been too busy consuming, or simply keeping up with the race.
Just the value of being succinct. Our discussions of philosophy have never resolved anything
. . .
As in assuming,
or at least projecting the attitude,
that getting a handle on the reality of your body/brain
is irrelevant towards getting a handle on oneâs own profound existential questions,
that philosophical minds have been debating for millennia.
Heck a guy by the name of Chalmers declares itâs impossible for biology to explain it,
heâs become the toast of the party, even wins wine for all his efforts. The philosopherâs message is that: to understand consciousness (from our egotistical top down perspective) requires metaphysics, because no other way can possibly make sense of all the complexity.
Yet, the evolutionary records tell us a very clear bottom up, organic story of how conscious awareness developed as creature complexity developed. Thatâs not just window dressing, itâs a key understanding who we are!
Itâs also valid to observe that the interactive nature of consciousness is rarely acknowledged - yet itâs another key to understanding consciousness. In fact, awareness (consciousness is a spectrum) is a requirement for creature evolution before ecosystems have any chance of developing.
Youâre irritated that I want to discuss it, and Iâm disappointed, and offended, that you dismiss it as irrelevant.