Imposed ON the world, meaning we make it up. It’s a problem because it’s not reality.
Life isn’t about anything, not even living. That goes to the above about projecting meaning onto the world. Philosophy is about the truth and sometimes the truth isn’t pleasant.
There isn’t good or love, that’s just us making things up again.
The ability to experience truth in any form is a miracle. Atoms organizing into a biomic systems that has the ability to feel and share is the great mystery and its beautiful.
Watch a honeybee making love to a flower and thereby advancing life into a new generation of food and energy for 75 % of the world’s grazing animals.
Did you know that the human biome consists of 10% human DNA and 90% symbiont bacterial DNA? We are a universe unto ourselves.
An insect producing a completely sterile substance that can be used to clean and heal wounds!
Ever wondered how Royal Jelly can turn a worker bee pupae into a fertile queen?
It boggles the mind.
Great point. One that puts IDK in a round room, looking for a corner. He says everything is a lie but how does he know? How do you prove everything is a lie?
He can’t answer “how would you prefer it” because he doesn’t spend a second thinking about it.
Is it really truth if it’s concepts we impose on reality?
You could say it’s all a lie because we made the concepts and drew the distinctions between everything and projected meaning onto the world.
You could say a lot things. It’s a free country. If you want to communicate with others, coherently, …
No, these are concepts imposed on us by reality. These concepts can be tested against reality. It’s called falsification.
The concept that in geometry a self referential system has to consist of a circle or at least triangular (3 connecting points, fractal).
This is why Pi and Phi are irrational numbers. They are self-referential into infinity.
Note also that the natural wave frequency of 432 htz is a magnitude of 3.
These connections cannot be ignored when contemplating how the universe is a self-referential system and evolves due to it’s dynamic beginning of rapid expansion.
Chaos theory is based on that concept (principle). The self-organization of complex patterns emerging from an original state of chaos. It’s a probabilistic mathematical progression.
We’re getting off topic, but since you brought it up
I googled it, interesting discussion, outer_space_ comments:
432 is kinda cool because using it for A makes other notes down the line whole number frequencies.
ex: A = 432hz D = 288hz E = 324hz G = 384hz
But, that doesn’t make it any more spiritual than 440, just a bit lower pitchwise and somewhat mathematically interesting.
Googling “432 hz” will bring up hoards of new age woo about chakras, DNA healing (I study molecular biology, this claim is utterly laughable), and other forms of phenomenal cosmic power all without any rigorous scientific evidence to support their claims.
You’ll find many people bashing 440 because it might have been made standard under nazi germany, but again, how that makes the frequency spiritually unsavory is never made clear. Standardization makes music easier to play with other people.
To which Seafroggys makes a keen observation:
As others say, its b!!s@!t*, because seconds are an arbitary human invention. A hertz is entirely based on this human invention.
Tehsma, then nails a fine point that ITD might appreciate:
That’s why I always tune my instruments to multiples of the vibrational period of a hydrogen atom.
And I’ll mix it up even more by suggesting that you check out these natural vibes:
Nigel John Stanford
Download in 4k / HD. All of the science experiments in the video are real. Watch behind the scenes and see how it was made. http://nigelstanford.com/y/Cytext-Cym…
Are you making up terms again?
Yes it does! Dissonance is not conducive to harmony.
Note: The artificial selection of 440 was chosen for convenience but it does not harmonize with nature. In fact it is an irritant that incites dynamic response instead of harmony.
440 Hz is not the universally natural harmonic standard . It is not in tune with the human’s vibration because the root tone is 16.5 Hz. There is no evidence that tuning the A to 440 Hz is harmful to humanity or nature. Natural Tuning includes 432 Hz as well as 256 and 440 Hz. The contention between 432 Hz and 440 Hz arises from differing beliefs about the ‘right’ standard for tuning.
This may not be harmful per se, but it is not conducive to balance and tranquility either.
Note that this discussion about modern “music” includes “trance”, “heavy metal” and “head-banging”, none which lead to “thoughts of the noblest kind”.
But this is the sound of nature and he evolution of melodies within the harmonies.
No, these are not whole numbers, they are ratios and the ratios remain the same into infinity.
As to 440 hz, it is an artificially invented frequency based on cycles per second, not natural harmonics.
Frequency at which they vibrate
The main difference between 440 Hz and 432 Hz is the frequency at which they vibrate. 440 Hz is the standard concert pitch, while 432 Hz is believed to be more in tune with the natural harmonic series and the universe’s vibrational frequency.
Right but the point is that we still are imposing our concepts and distinctions on reality.
THat’s not how it works, concepts don’t exist in reality, we put them on it.
You are right , the universe does not conceptualize, it expresses.
And human have formed a conceptualizaton (understanding) of how this is being expressed via EM wave frequencies permeating ALL of it and eventually forming patterns that are observable, measurable, and codifiable.
The same as with mathematics.
Humans symbolize mathematics, the universe expresses mathematics.
I’m not questioning the infinite part, it’s the “self referential” part. What is “self-referential into infinity”)
And the ratios don’t “remain the same either”. Each digit added gets closer to precise value.
Oh for ¶u@ 
sake, I make a joke and suddenly all the talk is about EM vibrations - and fairlytales.
Why not save this airy fairy harmonic and god’s geometry stuff for another thread.
I mean I don’t mind digressions that are interesting, but this is ridiculous.
As this link seems to point out, the silliness of the grand claims,
Let me be clear, my contribute was about the translation of sound harmonics into physics matter - it’s not the secret sauce of life!!! Of course, like quantum mechanics, it’s part of the matrix that all else is created out of it. That’s it, but scale matters and all sorts of things we are too self-absorbed to even notice matter.
This thread was about me examining the relationship we have with the knowledge we possess. - here, this turned into another example of how dysfunctional that relationship is.
Further it’s about examining the influences that went into making the character that I am. Ignore it if you want, but please take spinning wheel distractions somewhere else where they might be more appropriate.
You have never defined truth or reality, so I can’t answer that. Any time I answer your question with my definition of truth and reality you say it’s wrong and you use the words in ways that don’t fit my understanding of truth or reality. And you don’t give direct answers to this question. You can’t define “concept” or “story” or “fact”, until you define “truth” and “reality”.
I like the Correspondence Theory it argues that truth is whatever corresponds to reality. An idea which corresponds with reality is true while an idea which does not correspond with reality is false. It is important to note here that truth is not a property of facts.
And I would add, that ideas themselves are real. They aren’t mappable, yet, like a position in space, they can’t be put in a jar, yet, but they most certainly exist.
Reality is a little harder to define, grabbing some notes from this.
Reality can be described as the state of things as they are, not as they are imagined to be. But, experiences can be altered so If different people can encounter different versions of a base reality, reality may just be a collective experience shared by the majority. We know our experiences are limited but we have derived truths that are proven by their predictive power.
I think it’s been over a year now since I pointed out that this entire forum has degraded beyond repair. Darkness has left the confines of his own threads. Bohm and Seth have confused many other threads, blurring the lines between math and spirituality, turning claims about unanswerable questions into arguments about true Scotsmen. There’s more.
The next phase will probably be an invasion of AI bots and CFI will have to pull the plug.
[quote=“lausten, post:33, topic:11406”]
I’m not questioning the infinite part, it’s the “self referential” part. What is “self-referential into infinity”)
All cicles are self-referential, all triangles are self referential.
And the ratios don’t “remain the same either”. Each digit added gets closer to precise value.
Yes , but never resolve to zero. They can’t. That’s why they’re called “irrational”.
And for Circles the ratio of Pi remains the same at all magnitudes.
The Fibonacci Sequence (Phi or Golden Rule)
An irrational number is not self-referential and a circle is not a ratio. You’re showing me how you mix up words but I can’t figure how you don’t see it.
I know that.
3.141592
In a circle, the ratio between the circumference and the diameter is represented by the Greek letter π (pi). This ratio is always the same, regardless of the size of the circle, and it is approximately equal to 3.141592.
And a circle by its very pattern is self-referential at all points of the circle.
Hence the term “circular reason”. I am speaking in philosophical generalities.
You can’t admit that you said something that doesn’t compute can you? If you know what I said, then you know Pi is not self-referential to infinity.
