I seem to remember something about Jesus overturning the tables of the moneychangers…WELL, their back!
Who here is tired of listening The Reason for the Season from one side of peoples mouths and promotion of a gift buying free-for-all out of the other?
The idea that there are adults out there that will go through serious anxiety attacks because they can’t afford a Tickle-me Elmo doll. When did a frenzy of purchasing toys and games ever become the replacement for love in the family?
When did love ever depend on what you could put in a child’s hand and not what you put in their hearts.?
I grew up as a Jehovah’s Witness child, I never had a Christmas and always, for years had to go back to school after the Xmas vacation to set and listen to all these rich kids talk about how many presents they’d gotten and how much they hated most of them. I know how it feels to search through the Sears wish book hour by hour and see commercial after commercial about some great and wonderful toy, you couldn’t live without.
Those days are long gone and Xmas isn’t any more of a holiday to me than my birthday, which wasn’t celebrated either. This is no problem to me, but it is to those kids out there whose families are poor and underprivileged. I know how they feel. I know how it is not to get these shiny bobbles that so many who do get them don’t appreciate them and to turn insult into injury, parade the fact that they have what you will never get.
I am not against buying in moderation, but not as a duty to perform as if it were a parents duty to a child to get the best, the brightest and most shiny new got to have device on the market. These parents also become victims of this buy craze as they feel guilty somehow, if they can’t get their children, what they call a decent Xmas. It’s if nothing they had done for them all year long is completely without merit, unless the kid gets his Elmo doll.
Xmas, above all the other days of the year is when society reaches out to the poor children of this and every other country who is drowning in wealth and slaps their children across the face with the full revelation that they come from a poor family.
Is this the barrier we wish to set up to distinguish whose family is the better family. Are the rich, somehow a better family, because they can afford these bobbles and poor families can’t? Is there, automatically more love in a families house that has an Elmo doll in it, than one who doesn’t?
The axiety that people feel is the most horrible felling alive. It cuts right to the bone for those who love their family just as much at Xmas time as they do 6 months later. It’s like they are pressured to over-perform on one day a year, to be a good parent and then play catchup with their finances to get out of the red, they placed themselves, just because of an idea that was never part of the original idea behind Xmas, in the first place.
I keep quiet on this one for the most part. I mean, who has ever complained that Chinese Restaurants are open on the holidays? I think there are plenty of people who need the hours and I’ve worked on many holidays myself, that’s life. As for the businesses themselves, that’s a business decision. Very few will see any loss in business due to boycotting. If the demand wasn’t there, they wouldn’t open.
On the other hand, yes, the commercials are disgusting. I saw one today that said, straight out, don’t do the dishes, go shop. You do have to wonder why they open a store only to offer large discounts. Seems like they are depending on the feeding frenzy to increase traffic enough to offset the lower prices. But again, it took a few decades to create that, no one store or one call to boycott can shut it off.
There’s a book out, “Scroogenomics”, which I have not yet read. I was waiting to see if it gains any following. It’s claim is that the holiday shopping season skews the economy. It creates many stores filled with cheap items designed specifically for people who are shopping for someone they barely know. Items to decorate a season that revolves around nothing but itself. It tries to mask what is happening with words like “giving” and “togetherness”. Makes you wonder what we would do if we were left to our devices. What would we give and to whom?
I never shop ‘Black Friday’ and I certainly won’t be shopping Thanksgiving either. WuCares, your parents made those decisions. It is not only the ‘rich kids’ who get Christmas presents. Even poverty stricken parents try to provide something for children. I make donations to families who are poor, there is nothing I can do about families who do not celebrate holidays. I don’t celebrate Ramadan, Chanukah or the Hindu festivals, but it doesn’t bother me when others do. When they invite me to share in their festivities, I join them. The difference is that a JW would refuse. Not my problem. I am an atheist, but I celebrate a completely secular Christmas, complete with Santa, not an angel, creche or cross in sight. Birthdays have always been a big celebration in my family, both to appreciate your parents and celebrate the anniversary of your birth. Sorry that after freeing yourself from JW, you can’t give people leave to celebrate as they wish.
For the most part I agree with Asanta. I don’t do any Christmas a shopping until well after Thanksgiving. i also see no reason for stores to be open on Thanksgiving day but I unwillingly tolerate it.
The biggest problem, as I see it, is that many retail workers are forced to work on national holidays. This I am against. I wish there were a law that no retail employer can force employees to work on a national holiday under the threat of losing their job orvother threats to their livelihood. This would give the retail workers a needed boost. Employers would be able to offer inventives to employees to work on national holidays but employees wouldn’t be forced to accept them. This would mean employers would either have to offer more substantial incentives that the employees are unlikely to refuse or keep their stores closed on national holidays.
Do I think this will happen? No. retail employees will continue to be exploited in this way all in the interest of businesses making more money. It’s the American way, after all.
Lois
What you’re talking about Lois is worker’s rights. Thanks to Charles Dickens, we have at least one day left on the calendar that is nearly untouchable for putting family ahead of work. Unless you come from a different culture, you better have a darn good reason for working on Christmas or at the very least, you’ll get some dirty looks. Retail marketing is slowly making inroads into even that sacred day. But I don’t think it would matter if we treated people with the respect they deserve during the other 364 days of the year. If we acknowledged that not everyone has all the skills needed to start a business, or even if they do, they have other values that lead to other choices. Basically, we need to recognize the value of a hard day’s work.
Then we wouldn’t need to set aside one special day and pretend like greed and gluttony aren’t happening the rest of the year. We’d actually have a reason to be thankful.
The biggest problem, as I see it, is that many retail workers are forced to work on national holidays. This I am against. I wish there were a law that no retail employer can force employees to work on a national holiday under the threat of losing their job orvother threats to their livelihood. LoisI'm curious. Why should retail employees be given some sort of special status?? Nurses, doctors, police, firemen, restaurant employees, entertainment people, gas station attendants and many others have to work on national holidays. There is no way of getting around that. Those services are needed. Why is it so sacrosanct that retail employees have certain holidays off when so many others don't? If we are being perfectly honest here I don't think this has anything do with people having a day off. I think you are appalled at the materialism that you see and are focusing on the loss of a day of for the worker when that's not really the problem.
If we are being perfectly honest here I don't think this has anything do with people having a day off. I think you are appalled at the materialism that you see and are focusing on the loss of a day of for the worker when that's not really the problem.I know I am. The idea that you have to go through an anxiety attack and a hoard of mindless stampeding psychopaths is the closets thing I think today's society has to the Hunger Games. Id this is what you need to do to bring joy to your kid I'd rather take him on a cruise to nowhere and come back after New Years to a much more sane world. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rivL5KYeBvk And they shoot horses, don't they?
If we are being perfectly honest here I don't think this has anything do with people having a day off. I think you are appalled at the materialism that you see and are focusing on the loss of a day of for the worker when that's not really the problem.I know I am. The idea that you have to go through an anxiety attack and a hoard of mindless stampeding psychopaths is the closets thing I think today's society has to the Hunger Games. Id this is what you need to do to bring joy to your kid I'd rather take him on a cruise to nowhere and come back after New Years to a much more sane world. Well there you go then. You should be discussing materialism and what if anything can be done about it, not the evils of making one class of workers give up a perk that many other classes of workers have no hope of ever getting.
If we are being perfectly honest here I don't think this has anything do with people having a day off. I think you are appalled at the materialism that you see and are focusing on the loss of a day of for the worker when that's not really the problem.I know I am. The idea that you have to go through an anxiety attack and a hoard of mindless stampeding psychopaths is the closets thing I think today's society has to the Hunger Games. Id this is what you need to do to bring joy to your kid I'd rather take him on a cruise to nowhere and come back after New Years to a much more sane world. Well there you go then. You should be discussing materialism and what if anything can be done about it, not the evils of making one class of workers give up a perk that many other classes of workers have no hope of ever getting. Who says I wasn't? Who started this thread in the direction of the workers. Not I.
Who says I wasn't? Who started this thread in the direction of the workers. Not I.You're right. Now we're back on track
I seem to remember something about Jesus overturning the tables of the moneychangers.........WELL, their back! Who here is tired of listening The Reason for the Season from one side of peoples mouths and promotion of a gift buying free-for-all out of the other? The idea that there are adults out there that will go through serious anxiety attacks because they can't afford a Tickle-me Elmo doll. When did a frenzy of purchasing toys and games ever become the replacement for love in the family? When did love ever depend on what you could put in a child's hand and not what you put in their hearts.? I grew up as a Jehovah's Witness child, I never had a Christmas and always, for years had to go back to school after the Xmas vacation to set and listen to all these rich kids talk about how many presents they'd gotten and how much they hated most of them. I know how it feels to search through the Sears wish book hour by hour and see commercial after commercial about some great and wonderful toy, you couldn't live without. Those days are long gone and Xmas isn't any more of a holiday to me than my birthday, which wasn't celebrated either. This is no problem to me, but it is to those kids out there whose families are poor and underprivileged. I know how they feel. I know how it is not to get these shiny bobbles that so many who do get them don't appreciate them and to turn insult into injury, parade the fact that they have what you will never get. I am not against buying in moderation, but not as a duty to perform as if it were a parents duty to a child to get the best, the brightest and most shiny new got to have device on the market. These parents also become victims of this buy craze as they feel guilty somehow, if they can't get their children, what they call a decent Xmas. It's if nothing they had done for them all year long is completely without merit, unless the kid gets his Elmo doll. Xmas, above all the other days of the year is when society reaches out to the poor children of this and every other country who is drowning in wealth and slaps their children across the face with the full revelation that they come from a poor family. Is this the barrier we wish to set up to distinguish whose family is the better family. Are the rich, somehow a better family, because they can afford these bobbles and poor families can't? Is there, automatically more love in a families house that has an Elmo doll in it, than one who doesn't? The axiety that people feel is the most horrible felling alive. It cuts right to the bone for those who love their family just as much at Xmas time as they do 6 months later. It's like they are pressured to over-perform on one day a year, to be a good parent and then play catchup with their finances to get out of the red, they placed themselves, just because of an idea that was never part of the original idea behind Xmas, in the first place.I also find the black friday madness sickening. Not so much the fact that it's a good example of a problem with American retail, but mostly the way these slobs act while shopping. I disagree with the rich vs. poor aspect, however; out of the herd of people participating in this, many are lower class to squarely middle class themselves.
If we are being perfectly honest here I don't think this has anything do with people having a day off. I think you are appalled at the materialism that you see and are focusing on the loss of a day of for the worker when that's not really the problem.I know I am. The idea that you have to go through an anxiety attack and a hoard of mindless stampeding psychopaths is the closets thing I think today's society has to the Hunger Games. Id this is what you need to do to bring joy to your kid I'd rather take him on a cruise to nowhere and come back after New Years to a much more sane world. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rivL5KYeBvk And they shoot horses, don't they?That clip is relatively tame compared to some others. There's another one out there that showed people being gleefully stomped on by some human shaped rhinos. I feel bad for the employees in those box stores. Sometimes. 8-/
What you're talking about Lois is worker's rights. Thanks to Charles Dickens, we have at least one day left on the calendar that is nearly untouchable for putting family ahead of work. Unless you come from a different culture, you better have a darn good reason for working on Christmas or at the very least, you'll get some dirty looks.Slightly off topic, but I've worked Christmas before, and no one gave me any attitude about it. Do you mean retail employees working Christmas exclusively?
What you're talking about Lois is worker's rights. Thanks to Charles Dickens, we have at least one day left on the calendar that is nearly untouchable for putting family ahead of work. Unless you come from a different culture, you better have a darn good reason for working on Christmas or at the very least, you'll get some dirty looks.Slightly off topic, but I've worked Christmas before, and no one gave me any attitude about it. Do you mean retail employees working Christmas exclusively? Your boss telling you that you have to work would be a perfectly valid reason. The types of jobs that are open 24 hours a day as mentioned above would fall in this too. I was referring to anyone who had the authority to make the call of working that day or not, like the self-employed or small business owner. The corporate decisions by Pizza Hut and Target this year are getting the type of "dirty looks" I'm talking about. I would consider getting paid extra to work a holiday also a "darn good reason".
It amazes me that with all the stories about black friday chaos from yesterday not one reporter suggested the obvious solution to this idiotic self made problem, End the specials that cause the problem. Many of these stores run crazy specials like a 50 inch TV for $200 but there are only 3 in each store. People line up for hours in the cold and then make a mad dash when the doors open only to get into fist fights over the handful of items on sale. The store’s solution to the problem is to put a couple more security guards in the store to try and control hundreds of crazed shoppers. Instead of trying to put a patch on the problem they should eliminate the cause of the problem which THEY created intentionally.
It amazes me that with all the stories about black friday chaos from yesterday not one reporter suggested the obvious solution to this idiotic self made problem, End the specials that cause the problem. Many of these stores run crazy specials like a 50 inch TV for $200 but there are only 3 in each store. People line up for hours in the cold and then make a mad dash when the doors open only to get into fist fights over the handful of items on sale. The store's solution to the problem is to put a couple more security guards in the store to try and control hundreds of crazed shoppers. Instead of trying to put a patch on the problem they should eliminate the cause of the problem which THEY created intentionally.Their job isn't to make sense. The jobs of reporters is to dramatize the story as much as possible so more people will want to tune in and their station gets a ratings spike.
It amazes me that with all the stories about black friday chaos from yesterday not one reporter suggested the obvious solution to this idiotic self made problem, End the specials that cause the problem. Many of these stores run crazy specials like a 50 inch TV for $200 but there are only 3 in each store. People line up for hours in the cold and then make a mad dash when the doors open only to get into fist fights over the handful of items on sale. The store's solution to the problem is to put a couple more security guards in the store to try and control hundreds of crazed shoppers. Instead of trying to put a patch on the problem they should eliminate the cause of the problem which THEY created intentionally.Their job isn't to make sense. The jobs of reporters is to dramatize the story as much as possible so more people will want to tune in and their station gets a ratings spike. I agree whole heatedly but there are a few ( I emphasize "few") journalists out there who occasionally seem to think about the stories they report and yet not a single one hasd any insight into this problem. I'll just chalk it all up to Turkey Coma.
It amazes me that with all the stories about black friday chaos from yesterday not one reporter suggested the obvious solution to this idiotic self made problem, End the specials that cause the problem. Many of these stores run crazy specials like a 50 inch TV for $200 but there are only 3 in each store. People line up for hours in the cold and then make a mad dash when the doors open only to get into fist fights over the handful of items on sale. The store's solution to the problem is to put a couple more security guards in the store to try and control hundreds of crazed shoppers. Instead of trying to put a patch on the problem they should eliminate the cause of the problem which THEY created intentionally.Their job isn't to make sense. The jobs of reporters is to dramatize the story as much as possible so more people will want to tune in and their station gets a ratings spike. I agree whole heatedly but there are a few ( I emphasize "few") journalists out there who occasionally seem to think about the stories they report and yet not a single one hasd any insight into this problem. I'll just chalk it all up to Turkey Coma. Don't kid yourself. They know the solution. It's only the solution is so much against the perfect storm aborigine hoards and unscrupulous business men that the mere articulation of said solution will effectively eliminate their credibility. It's better to let a mob rip apart a store and report it than condemn them and have them rip you apart. It's like the Christmas Carol on steroids and doing crack on the side. In order to stay credible their news agencies will toss them to the wolves and hope nothing gets directed their way.
The biggest problem, as I see it, is that many retail workers are forced to work on national holidays. This I am against. I wish there were a law that no retail employer can force employees to work on a national holiday under the threat of losing their job orvother threats to their livelihood. LoisI'm curious. Why should retail employees be given some sort of special status?? Nurses, doctors, police, firemen, restaurant employees, entertainment people, gas station attendants and many others have to work on national holidays. There is no way of getting around that. Those services are needed. Why is it so sacrosanct that retail employees have certain holidays off when so many others don't? If we are being perfectly honest here I don't think this has anything do with people having a day off. I think you are appalled at the materialism that you see and are focusing on the loss of a day of for the worker when that's not really the problem. I used the term "retail workers," which' IMO would include gas station attendants, restaurant employees and many entertainment jobs, among others, to make a distinction, without having to list them all, between jobs that involve the health and safety of the community and those that simply earn money for the owners of the businesses. There is good reason to expect medIcal and safety employees to work over holidays, whereas most other jobs shouldn't require it. The majority of people working in retail are oppressed already, paid low wages, and are exploited in many ways--and their jobs are not required for health or safety. When retail workers are expected to work on national holidays, no one's life would be put at risk if they chose not to work. Only profits would be at risk. That was my point. Let the employers pay as much as it takes to encourage employees to work on those days. It should not be a matter of losing their jobs or giving up promotions or raises to force them to work in non-essential jobs.
It amazes me that with all the stories about black friday chaos from yesterday not one reporter suggested the obvious solution to this idiotic self made problem, End the specials that cause the problem. Many of these stores run crazy specials like a 50 inch TV for $200 but there are only 3 in each store. People line up for hours in the cold and then make a mad dash when the doors open only to get into fist fights over the handful of items on sale. The store's solution to the problem is to put a couple more security guards in the store to try and control hundreds of crazed shoppers. Instead of trying to put a patch on the problem they should eliminate the cause of the problem which THEY created intentionally.Their job isn't to make sense. The jobs of reporters is to dramatize the story as much as possible so more people will want to tune in and their station gets a ratings spike. I agree whole heatedly but there are a few ( I emphasize "few") journalists out there who occasionally seem to think about the stories they report and yet not a single one hasd any insight into this problem. I'll just chalk it all up to Turkey Coma. Don't kid yourself. They know the solution. It's only the solution is so much against the perfect storm aborigine hoards and unscrupulous business men that the mere articulation of said solution will effectively eliminate their credibility. It's better to let a mob rip apart a store and report it than condemn them and have them rip you apart. It's like the Christmas Carol on steroids and doing crack on the side. In order to stay credible their news agencies will toss them to the wolves and hope nothing gets directed their way. There was a case recently where a store running specials was fined for creating unsafe conditions by encouraging a mob scene in offering deep discounts. It doesn't happen often enough, but I can't see preemptory laws being passed to ban such promotions. It would come under free speech rights. But if promotions create mob scenaes, I am in favor of arrests and substantial fines. If consistently enforced, that should go a long way towad discouraging promotions that cause mob scenes. Lois