CC, you really adore this guy huhn? The title of this thread is rapidly changing to "Why other countries are not playing along with Snowden." The guy is a US citizen still...he can come home anytime he wants. Why do I get the feeling that is what's going to happen.You are being unfair, perhaps even emotional I simply don't understand why he's become USA's enemy number one and I don't think anyone can really explain beyond: that's the way it is son. Yeah, I decided to leave it alone, because there doesn't appear to be an answer that satisfies VYAZMA in either of these threads. -shrugs-
pssst:
Why are Republican leaders almost all “CHICKENHAWKS” ?
http://liberalslikechrist.org/about/chickenhawks.html
~ ~ ~
Incidentally since I’ve gone this far
recently I’ve had cause to think about presidential Candidate McGovern
who was torn to shreds by the Nixon boys - future Reagan men - future Neocons
even though the man was a bomber pilot in WWII - an F’n bomber pilot… not bomber, navigator, etc. - the F’n man responsible for the crew and the plane and getting the bombs where they were supposed to go and getting everyone back home safe. And with his own skill and brains and nerve and some luck he DID IT !
Yet, politico punks misrepresented and treated this hero like some lost-soul-clueless-hippy - and never ever felt ashamed.
Lordie knows this country would have benefited way the hell more from McGovern insights and experience and administration then we ever got out of slippery Dick.
DEMOCRATIC LEADERS who "walked the walk" : While most Democrats don't just say that war should be the last resort but truly believe it and try to resolve conflicts through more peaceful means, when just wars have been necessary and unavoidable, they have a long established record of putting their own lives and those of their own children on the line, rather than persuading other people to sacrifice themselves and their children: Sen. & Presidential Candidate McGovern, one of the elite few Air Force bomber pilots to fly the maximum 35 successful bombing missions in WW II. Stephen Ambrose, who wrote a book about him, called him "one of the greatest patriots I know." Jack Valenti ( President L.B. Johnson's special personal assistant) flew 51 combat missions as the pilot-commander of a B-25 attack bomber and received four decorations. The famous liberal Democrat Norman Lear (of Archie Bunker fame) also flew 52 bombing missions, during that war, 37 of them over Nazi Germany. Former Vice President Al Gore – enlisted August 1969; sent to Vietnam January 1971 as an army journalist, assigned to the 20th Engineer Brigade headquartered at Bien Hoa, an air base twenty miles northeast of Saigon. Sen. John Kerry, Lt., U.S. Navy 1966-70; Silver Star, Bronze Star with Combat V, and three awards of the Purple Heart for his service in combat. Gov. & President Jimmy Carter: Lt. Commander in the Navy 1946-53. Gov. & presidential candidate, Michael Dukakis: Army 1955-57. Sen. John Glenn: WWII and Korea; six DFCs; Air Medal w/18 Clusters. During World War II, Sen, & VP Hubert Humphrey tried twice to join the armed forces, but was rejected both times due to a hernia. Gov. & U.S. Sen. Chuck Robb: U.S. Marine Corps, 1961-70, Vietnam. Sen. Daniel Inouye, US Army 1943-'47; Medal of Honor, World War Two. Sen. Ted Kennedy (D-MA) – U.S. Army, 1951-1953. Sen. Jim Webb (D-VA) – U.S. Marine served in combat in Vietnam 1968-69, and was awarded the Navy Cross, Silver Star, Bronze Star with combat V, and Purple Heart. Sen. Tom Harkin (D-IA) – Lt., U.S. Navy, 1962-67; Naval Reserve, 1968-74. Sen. Jack Reed (D-RI) – U.S. Army Ranger, 1971-1979; Captain, Army Reserve 1979-91. Sen. Fritz Hollings (D-SC) – served as a U.S. Army officer in World War II, receiving the Bronze Star and seven campaign ribbons. Senate Democratic Leader Tom Daschle, 1st Lt., U.S. Air Force SAC 1969-72. Sen. Bob Kerrey, Lt. j.g., U.S. Navy 1966-69; Medal of Honor, Vietnam Sen. Max Cleland, Captain, U.S. Army 1965-68; Silver Star & Bronze Star, Vietnam. Sen. Howell Heflin: .USMC WWII, Silver Star, Purple Heart (x2) Rep. Richard Gephardt, former House Minority Leader – Missouri Air National Guard, 1965-71.. Rep. David Bonior – Staff Sgt., United States Air Force 1968-72. Rep. Charles Rangel, Staff Sgt., U.S. Army 1948-52; Rangel served with distinction at the front in Korea. "where he received both a Purple Heart for being injured and a Bronze Star for bravery. The wounded Rangel led 40 of his comrades for three days behind enemy lines rather than surrender." [http://www.answers.com/topic/charles-b-rangel] Rep. Jack Murtha (D-PA) – distinguished 37-year career in the U.S. Marine Corps, Bronze Star and two Purple Hearts, retired from the Marine Corps Reserve as a colonel in 1990. Rep. Leonard Boswell (D-IA) – Lt. Col., U.S. Army 1956-76; two tours in Vietnam, two Distinguished Flying Crosses as a helicopter pilot, two Bronze Stars, and the Soldier's Medal. Former Representative "Pete" Peterson, Air Force Captain, POW, Ambassador to Viet Nam, and recipient of the Purple Heart, the Silver Star and the Legion of Merit. Rep. Mike Thompson, D-CA: Staff sergeant/platoon leader with the 173rd Airborne Brigade, U.S. Army; was wounded and received a Purple Heart. Rep. Pete Stark, D-CA, served in the Air Force 1955-57. Rep. Tom Lantos: Served in Hungarian underground in WWII. Rep. Jim McDermott: Navy. Rep. Joe Stupak, served Navy 1974-2005,vice-Admiral Gray Davis, California Governor, Army Captain in Vietnam; received Bronze Star. Bill McBride, Democratic Candidate for Florida Governor – volunteered and served as a U.S. Marine in Vietnam; awarded Bronze Star with a combat "V." Gen. Wesley Clark, Democratic Presidential Candidate – lengthy military career.
Is it me or has this whole thread derailed?
No I believe all this speaks to the question of why other countries aren’t playing along with the USA anymore.
because in large part we have burned up the respect we once had… and there’s a slippery slope that lead to this situation… with milestones to mark our path.
well OK, then someone implied “neocon” was a meaningless slur… and we did drift a little
But, considering that “neocon” behavior is at the roots of much of the erosion of our moral high ground in the world
and other countries no longer playing alone… I’d say I didn’t drift that far.
OK that last long list has a lot to do with me just being totally sick of the self-righteous Republicans… who have in actually done more to destroy our long term future prospects than anyone.
Guess that does deserve it’s own thread - so I’ll not say one more word :blank:
meanwhile back at the ranch,
old news:
A petition demanding the US government to pardon Edward Snowden passes 100,000 signatures, forces the White House to respond The White House is forced to respond to petition to pardon Edward Snowden By: Anthony Garreffa (more) | Current Affairs News | Posted: Jun 23, 2013 12:29 pm There has been a petition demanding that the US government pardon NSA whistleblower Edward Snowden, which saw over 100,000 digital 'signatures', forcing the White House to make a formal response. Considering the US government are attempting to charge Snowden with two counts of espionage, it'll be interesting to see what the White House has to say about this. http://www.tweaktown.com/news/31256/a-petition-demanding-the-us-government-to-pardon-edward-snowden-passes-100-000-signatures-forces-the-white-house-to-respond/index.htmlnew news
7/12/2013 http://www.cbsnews.com/video/watch/?id=50150806n Edward Snowden emerges from hiding in Moscow NSA leaker Edward Snowden, who continues to be holed up at a Moscow airport, met with a small group of human rights advocates and released a statement asking for help in getting asylum in Russia. Bob Orr reports.
Snowden,
My view point is somewhat different than most of the post replies. I was delighted to see Snowden turning over information. So yes, I see Snowden as a hero. I see what he did as bad and against our country. And I see it as harmful to our country. But I feel that the people controlling this information can cause more harm to our country and our freedom.
Why is my thinking different?
Well, do you remember the “Robo Signing" done by the major banks? Tens of thousands of felonies and nobody arrested.
Do you know why the U.S.A. kept Taiwan under Marshall Law for fifty years?
I think if you knew the answers and understood these two questions, then you would view the Snowden affair differently.
If you would take a look at people’s lifetime careers working for the government and what their jobs were and what they help accomplished, it would shed a light on the problem. An example would be people like John R. Petty and Roger Robertson.
You can be sure that everything is done for a reason. But the system and damage done is causing a class system of rich and poor in our nation that may erase all the good that these people think they are doing. They may win the war but lose the nation in the process.
Mike
Snowden, My view point is somewhat different than most of the post replies. I was delighted to see Snowden turning over information. So yes, I see Snowden as a hero. I see what he did as bad and against our country. And I see it as harmful to our country. But I feel that the people controlling this information can cause more harm to our country and our freedom.You know in light of all Snowden brought to light and forced our government to discuss
NSA Leaks Focus New Attention On Government Contractors by TOM GJELTEN July 08, 2013 4:15 PM http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=200104716 ========== NSA's Reach Leads To Calls For Updated Eavesdropping Laws by TOM BOWMAN July 05, 2013 3:36 AM http://www.npr.org/2013/07/05/198746851/nsa-s-reach-leads-to-calls-for-updated-eavesdropping-laws ============== The House Hearing On NSA Surveillance In 3 Audio Clips by EYDER PERALTA June 18, 2013 1:43 PM http://www.npr.org/blogs/thetwo-way/2013/06/18/193113274/the-house-hearing-on-nsa-surveillance-in-3-audio-clips~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Can't help but seeing this as an example of a healthy democracy in action. Oh yea, oops, that was soo last century. ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ Can anyone explain why Snowden isn't a plain old All-American "whistle blower" ?