How does this feel to people here at CFI?

I just read this article, and I am not sure how I feel about it. Is this about hate speach and religion bashing, or is it free speach?
http://www.theblaze.com/stories/2014/05/29/risen-from-the-grave-battle-over-virgin-mary-shouldve-aborted-facebook-page-continues/
I am affraid that this stuff gives Christians a reason to claim persecution, but I’m not sure they should be shut down on the basis of free speach/hate speach debate. I definitely feel like they will do more for the religious right than they will for humanism, the same way Fred Phelps behavior made more people sympathetic to gay people. I think their exteemness will harm humanism, secularism, etc. even though I personally agree with much of what they post on their page.
What do you all think?

This touches on a very important albeit rarely discussed point. Why should anyone treat religious myth differently from any other myth? Would there be an issue if instead of the virgin Mary they had posted a rip on Santa Clause? How is it that poking fun at a truly destructive myth brings more ire than poking fun at the benign tooth fairy myth?
Religion has, for far too long, enjoyed a level of respect and immunity from criticism far above what it deserves. I don’t believe we should afford any more concessions to religion than we do to say the flat earth society.

I think that saying Mary should have aborted Jesus is not simply calling their existence a myth. It is only intended to offend devout Christians. It seems to only desire the desecration of the myth for the sake of the attention it will get. Attention that I think puts humanists and non theists in a very unsympathetic position. It doesn’t really critically examine the myth.
I hole heartedly agree that no religious thought or claim should be exempt from criticism and examination, but this is simply mean spirited.

I agree it is mean spirited. The attempt at humor is also obvious, so I don’t think Facebook can say it violates their policy. If they get any more graphic, maybe, but they have put themselves in the position of deciding what’s funny. I’m sure the lawyers are not happy.
As for being bad for humanists, sure, but the people who extrapolate this stuff to apply to all non-theists are pretty hard to reach anyway. I don’t think many of those minds will change. People who recognize the sarcasm can still think about the underlying message and still not like it if they want. The important difference with this and Westboro Baptist is there is no indoctrination going on. This is not being taught to children and no one is threatened with hell if they don’t accept it.

There’s “hate speech”, and then again there’s just crudity. This is the Internet Age. People want to get attention, and a lot of them really don’t seem to have any sense of where to draw the line these days.

I think that saying Mary should have aborted Jesus is not simply calling their existence a myth. It is only intended to offend devout Christians.
The "offense" is quite minor compared to the inhumane carnage perpetrated by that particular Christian sect who revere the "virgin". Why the soft gloves? Would it be equally offensive if they were saying Charles Manson should have been aborted?
It seems to only desire the desecration of the myth for the sake of the attention it will get.
Symbolism is very important. The virgin(sic) Mary, and Jesus, are the banners under which murder, rape, pillage, and torture were performed. To this very day, those symbols stand for bigotry, intolerance, and willful ignorance. They continue to stand against humanism, reason, and science. Disrespect of their symbols is no more offensive than disrespecting the swastika.
Attention that I think puts humanists and non theists in a very unsympathetic position. It doesn't really critically examine the myth.
The myth has been thoroughly examined and debunked.

Quoting S.C.:

The “offense" is quite minor compared to the inhumane carnage perpetrated by that particular Christian sect who revere the “virgin".
True, but it’s sort of the “you do it, too” critical thinking fallacy.
I have many fewer qualms about insulting christian beliefs than I do about joking about abortion which is a really traumatic thing for any woman to have to go through.
Occam

My point is not really whether Christians deserve being slammed in this way. My point is that religious moderates are starting be able to view the non-religious and humanists or atheists as good people with worthwhile morals and values. But, this stuff reinforces the old image of us as venom spewing, angry assholes. We need an ongoing public dialogue that allows the average Christian to see we are people, not monsters. This behavior tends to reinforce the cliche about atheists and shut down any meaningful dialogue.

This touches on a very important albeit rarely discussed point. Why should anyone treat religious myth differently from any other myth? Would there be an issue if instead of the virgin Mary they had posted a rip on Santa Clause? How is it that poking fun at a truly destructive myth brings more ire than poking fun at the benign tooth fairy myth? Religion has, for far too long, enjoyed a level of respect and immunity from criticism far above what it deserves. I don't believe we should afford any more concessions to religion than we do to say the flat earth society.
Well said! Lois
My point is not really whether Christians deserve being slammed in this way. My point is that religious moderates are starting be able to view the non-religious and humanists or atheists as good people with worthwhile morals and values. But, this stuff reinforces the old image of us as venom spewing, angry assholes. We need an ongoing public dialogue that allows the average Christian to see we are people, not monsters. This behavior tends to reinforce the cliche about atheists and shut down any meaningful dialogue.
The problem is the difference between logic and reality. Your logic is quite reasonable and correct. However, if we look at recent history in similar situations, prejudice and discrimination against African-Americans didn't start being reduced until they very actively voiced their anger. Similarly, gays had to become very vocal before their concerns were addressed, and the same for women. If we're nice, gentle, rational, quiet people, we will remain the least likely for anyone to vote for in an election. From articles I see, only a few of the most moderate religious consider us worthwhile. I'm tired of being treated as a nice pet by those few. If we stir up some trouble it will force people to address the problem and quite possibly earn us the respect everyone deserves. Occam
.... My point is that religious moderates are starting be able to view the non-religious and humanists or atheists as good people with worthwhile morals and values.
Well, yeah. By their "Morals" I don't know that we should rejoice at being viewed as "moral and worthwhile" by their standards.
But, this stuff reinforces the old image of us as venom spewing, angry assholes.
The old image in their eyes. Not in the eyes of the majority of the population. I don't think we should care what they think about us. They are becoming more irrelevant with each passing generation.
The problem is the difference between logic and reality. Your logic is quite reasonable and correct. However, if we look at recent history in similar situations, prejudice and discrimination against African-Americans didn’t start being reduced until they very actively voiced their anger. Similarly, gays had to become very vocal before their concerns were addressed, and the same for women. If we’re nice, gentle, rational, quiet people, we will remain the least likely for anyone to vote for in an election. From articles I see, only a few of the most moderate religious consider us worthwhile. I’m tired of being treated as a nice pet by those few. If we stir up some trouble it will force people to address the problem and quite possibly earn us the respect everyone deserves.
And we also need to remember that religious "moderates" are in the minority in the xtian community. And even if the moderates do tolerate the secular humanist and atheists, the fundamentalists most certainly do not. In their eyes we represent a visible threat to their religious beliefs and world views. You cannot reason with nor convince them that their belief system is a sham and anachronistic. To moderates we appear as, to quote Occam " nice, gentle, quiet people", or as a loose analogy, Uncle Toms. The atheist community mobilized and 20,000 attended the Reason Rally last year. We need more of those mass demonstrations to begin to see the results enjoyed by the African-American and Gay communities. Respect has to be earned. Cap't Jack
And we also need to remember that religious "moderates" are in the minority in the xtian community. Cap't Jack
You think so? I don't know...
The problem is the difference between logic and reality. Your logic is quite reasonable and correct. However, if we look at recent history in similar situations, prejudice and discrimination against African-Americans didn’t start being reduced until they very actively voiced their anger. Similarly, gays had to become very vocal before their concerns were addressed, and the same for women. If we’re nice, gentle, rational, quiet people, we will remain the least likely for anyone to vote for in an election. From articles I see, only a few of the most moderate religious consider us worthwhile. I’m tired of being treated as a nice pet by those few. If we stir up some trouble it will force people to address the problem and quite possibly earn us the respect everyone deserves.
And we also need to remember that religious "moderates" are in the minority in the xtian community. And even if the moderates do tolerate the secular humanist and atheists, the fundamentalists most certainly do not. In their eyes we represent a visible threat to their religious beliefs and world views. You cannot reason with nor convince them that their belief system is a sham and anachronistic. To moderates we appear as, to quote Occam " nice, gentle, quiet people", or as a loose analogy, Uncle Toms. The atheist community mobilized and 20,000 attended the Reason Rally last year. We need more of those mass demonstrations to begin to see the results enjoyed by the African-American and Gay communities. Respect has to be earned. Cap't Jack
I'm not so sure that moderates are in the minority in the xtian community. In fact most people are religiously moderate. It's just that we hear more from and about the extremists. It's fundamentalists of any stripe who are a small, but loud and extremely annoying minority. Lois

Hey Cap’t Jack, you claim that moderate Xtians are in the minority. Something like 70% of the US identifies as Christian. Yet pew research shows that 66% of US citizens believe gay people should have the same rights as everyone else. That would imply that a very large portion of Christians are actually rather liberal toward gay rights. Where did you get the information that moderate Christians are a minority? I can’t find any data supporting that.
Anyway, the main portion of the US population that is becoming less religious and more moderate or un affiliated with any religion are millennials. The data suggests that they are moving away from religion because it is seen as more and more uncaring, uncharitable, and un-Christian to them. If Christians were not so vitriolic in their public battle against secularist, this trend would be slowed down somewhat, wouldn’t you agree?

I think it depends on what part of the country you are in for the percent of moderates vs. fundamentalists.
As we’ve seen in many different venues, it takes only a small number of highly motivated and active fanatics in a total population of somnolent moderates to bring about changes not desired by most.
Occam

This touches on a very important albeit rarely discussed point. Why should anyone treat religious myth differently from any other myth? Would there be an issue if instead of the virgin Mary they had posted a rip on Santa Clause? How is it that poking fun at a truly destructive myth brings more ire than poking fun at the benign tooth fairy myth? Religion has, for far too long, enjoyed a level of respect and immunity from criticism far above what it deserves. I don't believe we should afford any more concessions to religion than we do to say the flat earth society.
Exactly! MzLee