HOW DARE YOU!!

Politics and Social Issues
101

Mike this isn’t about You - this is about the dishonest clueless idiocy you spew with such self-certain conviction.

Perhaps also your inability to absorb new information and process it into your world view.

==============

Oh and tell us how much (see above index )

Global Warming: Understanding the Forecast

Professor David Archer PhD.

is a comprehensive introduction to all aspects of global warming. Written in an accessible way, and assuming no specialist prior knowledge, this book examines the processes that control climate change and climate stability, from the distant past to the distant future.

http://forecast.uchicago.edu/index.html –


are you familiar with?

102
October 4, 2019 at 9:16 am#309690 MikeYohe Go get a fourth-grade math book and do the CO2 math. It does not work.
Armed with a fourth-grade math book Mike convinces himself that the experts are in on a great con-job.

What’s terrifying is that is truly the way the Trumpkin GOP thinks (40 percent of the nation and pretty near ALL Republican Senators and Congressmen.)

================================================================================

I did the math and it does not work
A scientist, or student, or any serious attentive human for that matter - Would immediately ask: "WHAT AM I NOT GETTING HERE"

Then they would proceed to spending a lot of time trying to find their mistake -

quite probably discovering things they were totally unaware, thus requiring a few side trips for a bit more schooling/learning (as the case may be)

 

In the wild chance that one’s math continues to add up and the experts are still wrong - it would behoove one write up a concise, evidence and argument filled paper explaining exactly what you’d discovered about the mistake. It has happened. But pretty dang rarely. All you’ve provide is emotional conviction and slander towards all who disagree.

A serious sciencie approach is what I try to do, keep providing the evidence I’ve based my convictions on; listening to challenges; pursue those in a good faith manner - which incidentally has given me decades of solid background, which is why its so easy for me to act the know-it-all. Though I certainly don’t know the half of it and I don’t trust all I remember; so check and double check and learn from new evidence and learn from examining my own mistakes; and pursue weird claims others make; and so on and so forth.

103
CC says clouds have zero affect.
Where do you remember me sharing that? Bet you won't find me writing that - so come please do share my complete quote.

Not that I’m ready to start arguing Mike’s Smoke Screen, but for those who want to learn a bit more, it’s soooooo easy, you simply need to be a little critical about which links you follow

Google: "clouds and global warming - state of the understanding"
 
104
October 4, 2019 at 1:37 pm#309714

MikeYohe
Participant
CC, I already know what you think of me and the science. What I don’t know is what you think of the questions I ask. You never answer. You would rather attack me than deal with the science.


I repeat, Ask an intelligent constructive question.

105

TimB, Mike, You must be the only “progressive” who thinks we should be pumping more CO2 into the atmosphere.

Around here anyway.

For the sun, I go to Dr. Moon. He seems to understand the sun. Dr. Moon in July was in a House Science, Space, and Technology Committee hearing on climate change, under questioning by Congressman Mo Brooks (AL-05), four members of a bipartisan panel of climate science experts all admitted that humans are NOT responsible for the Earth’s global warming that has occurred over the past 20,000 years (since the Earth’s last glacial maximum).

I’m not willing to go that far. I still go with the 3% until someone can come up the datum points. Now you understand that in areas like America we are going to see more affects than Canada. But we have to average the affects worldwide.

Dr. Twila A. Moon, Research Scientist, National Snow and Ice Data Center’s (NSIDC) Cooperative Institute for Research in Environmental Sciences.

Dr. Moon is a progressive and dedicated to the restoration of a progressive democracy.

Tim, you know the problem is overpopulation. Talking about that is taboo. It is said America creates a lot of carbon. The most per person in the world. So, why are people wanting to bring millions more into to our country if they care about lowering the carbon? The hypocrisy is never ending.

So much of the data is still bad or changing. It is agreed that 1,000 to 2,000 ppm levels of CO2 causes drowsiness and should not be used. Yet, our submarines use 4,100 ppm with a range of 300-11,300 ppm. Is there something they are not telling us! We really haven’t got what we paid for with Climate Science in the last few decades.

106

CC, just search how many atomic bombs Climate Change is causing per day.

It only requires 4 grade math. CO2 lasts for 1,000 year before being completely gone. Use two hundred years and most of the CO2 will still be in the atmosphere.

Scientists estimate that, each day, our added emissions trap the heat equivalent of four hundred thousand Hiroshima-sized bombs. The New Yorker April 27th, 2018.

Let’s go back twenty-years. 7,300 days X 400,000 = 2,920,000,000

Thus, today we have the extra heat of 3T nuclear bombs contributing heat to the earth each day.

This is twenty year of CO2 in our atmosphere.

Gore was saying that back in 2013.

Now the sun is producing the energy of about one trillion nuclear bomb per second.

Of that energy the earth then radiates 2700 nuclear bombs worth of energy every second back into space.

Math – 60 sec/min. 3,600 sec/hr, 86,400 sec/day

86,400 X 1T = 86,400,000,000,000,000 nuclear bombs per day.

This equals 3 seconds of heat or 3.38% extra heat. Subtract the energy radiated back to space and you got 3%.

Now in the last twenty years we have had a 10% increase in clouds. This means more rain and evaporation along with more reflecting energy into space. Rain take CO2 out of the atmosphere. Could be one of the major reasons the heating has not been matching the numbers.

107

Okay. I’ll be the bitch:

:heavy_check_mark:Informal grammar is one thing.

:heavy_check_mark:Grammatical errors, misspellings, and typos are another thing.

:heavy_check_mark:Limited literacy is a different thing altogether.

A handful of people in the CFI forum appear to have limited literacy skills. They aren’t “functionally illiterate” (or they wouldn’t be here). They aren’t necessarily stupid (intelligent people can have literacy issues).

But they struggle with pretty basic concepts of writing (and apparently, reading)…more than they realize, I think.

Those folks have every right to be here. But it’s really hard for the rest of us to comprehend them. We have to struggle through their words, trying to glean meaning from them, and it’s a little frustrating.

But even more frustrating is that they’re the very same people most convinced of their own knowledge, intelligence and superiority.

They make the same claims again and again, usually with no source or credentials. If they provide a link, it’s often outdated or out of context.

They have strong opinions about science, journalism and theology, and these run contrary to the opinions of people who have been educated in, or worked in, those very fields. In other words, they are the LEAST knowledgeable, but the MOST certain of their rightness… and with limited literacy skills to boot.

They like to call others ignorant, without realizing the irony.

It’s the Dunning Kruger effect.

 

 

 

 

 

 

108

@citizenschallengev3

You refuse to acknowledge that global observations are so complex, varied and overlapping that any attempt to start fudging numbers would quick reduce the whole effort into chaotic noise like when you put a mic next to an amp.
Actually, your point here applies to many, many beliefs on the Right.

This whole belief system is connected to one basic conviction: It’s a conspiracy. All of it. The lying mainstream media. Climate scientists. “The Evolutionists.” Institutes of higher education. The Liberals. The Secular movement. Feminists. The educated “elite.” The America Justice System, CIA, FBI, and other Intel. Etc etc etc etc etc.

Somehow, all this is holding together. Somehow, all these folks are working together to create a huge false narrative to make Conservatives and this President look bad.

But all these things have multiple elements, things happening constantly and independently, often intersecting and entwining.

Obviously there are some liars and some bad players in there. But if it were all just a big “hoax,” just “fake,” if everyone involved were just “mindless sheep doing as expected,” then…Well, reality would just collapse, wouldn’t it?

 

109

@MikeYohe

Tim, you know the problem is overpopulation. Talking about that is taboo. It is said America creates a lot of carbon. The most per person in the world. So, why are people wanting to bring millions more into to our country if they care about lowering the carbon? The hypocrisy is never ending.
Mike, I'm not sure but is this what you are trying to say:
Liberals claim that overpopulation is a problem. And they claim carbon is a problem.

Yet Liberals want open borders. They want millions of illegals coming into the USA.

If Liberals really think there’s too many people, and too much carbon, then why do they want to fill our country with even more people??


Is that what you are saying?

If so … oh, God.

You are mixing a whole bunch of different things that are unrelated. Then you are drawing the conclusion that hypocrisy is the result.

I am too tired to debunk every weird connection you are trying to make.

 

110

@teebryantoo Yeah, I noticed his grammar too and mentioned it on page six. I’m glad I’m not the only one who noticed his horrid grammar. I’m not sure what makes him think we will accept what he says as educated information when he doesn’t know the difference between “set” and “sit”, among other things.

111

heathens.

how much can we be expected to endure?

112

When Mike arrived a long time ago, I remember him saying English was not his first language. For what it’s worth.

113

OK then I’ll excuse his grammar then.

114

Of course, consider the source. I don’t recall discussion of life in other counties.

115

Thanks for the info, @Mriana and @Lausten.

Actually, that doesn’t give him a pass in my eyes. In fact, if it’s true, it almost makes it worse.

My first few days here, when he began instructing me on the History of Christianity, I asked him more than once whether English might not be his first language.

Of course, he never responded.

 

Since I’ve been here, numerous people have mentioned that his comments are incomprehensible, AND that he regularly misinterprets what they say. In fact, he often says he agrees with them, and people respond, “No. You don’t understand my point at all.”

As far as I have seen, he has never acknowledged that he has misunderstood. He has never asked for clarification in these situations.

He’s never apologized for miscommunucating on his end. He has never said, “My apologies, English isn’t my first language,” or “Sorry, I have dyslexia.” (He’s admitted to misspellings, but SPELLING was the problem; it shouldn’t be a thing…)

I’ve edited thousands of articles, as well as several manuscripts. I’ve seen non-native, “broken” English. And I don’t know if that is the problem here. I do know that if I were in a forum, and speaking a second language, I would defer to others if everyone told me I made no sense.

I think the problem is that this is how he thinks. I’ll bet he is also hard to understand in his native language, TO people who speak his native language.

But the big, big problem is that he is too arrogant to learn. He is too arrogant to realize that the problem may be HIM. And that is the only reason I say anything at all. It isn’t the GRAMMAR. It is the ATTITUDE.

 

116

Mike remains a mystery to me. My best guess is that he has an over-riding worldview paradigm or maybe just an organically based neurological imperative that results in him believing some of the most opposite of reality kinds of things, here and there.
I have not viewed his supreme confidence in some of his beliefs as arrogance. His intransigence, seems to me to be simply not recognizing he could be wrong. I guess all that looks a lot like arrogance, tho.

Anyway, he is polite enuf and some of his thinking does seem pretty far out at times. If we knew what he was talking about, who knows?

117

Mike, October 4, 2019 at 2:56 pm

Why don’t you offer a link to this testimony of Dr. Moon’s? Why not actually quote her - rather than telling us what you heard?

Guess I’ll have to ask Dr. Twila Moon - I assume that is who you are talking about… correct?

118
https://centerforinquiry.org/forums/topic/how-dare-you/page/7/#post-309731
You just make up shit - hasn't anyone ever thought you how to us google?
https://www.nap.edu/read/11170/chapter/5#47

SUMMARY OF TOXICITY
The information below was taken largely from a more comprehensive review, Spacecraft Maximum Allowable Concentrations for Selected Airborne Contaminants, Volume 2 (NRC 1996). The studies discussed represent those most relevant to submariners and the submarine environment.

CO2 is a simple asphyxiant and lethal asphyxiations have been reported at concentrations as low as 110,000 ppm (Hamilton and Hardy 1974). Loss of consciousness can occur within a minute of exposure at 300,000 ppm and within 5-10 minutes (min) of exposure at 100,000 ppm (HSDB 2004). The effects of concentrations of CO2 between 7,000 and 300,000 ppm in humans and animals are discussed below and include
Page 48

tremor, headaches, chest pain, respiratory and cardiovascular effects, and visual and other central nervous system (CNS) effects.

The respiratory, cardiovascular, and CNS effects of CO2 are related to the decreases in blood and tissue pH that result from exposures (Eckenhoff and Longnecker 1995; Yang et al. 1997; HSDB 2004). Changes in pH act directly and indirectly on those systems. The pH changes also trigger various compensatory mechanisms, including increased ventilation to reduce excess CO2 in the bloodstream, increased renal acid excretion to restore acid-base balance, and sympathetic nervous system stimulation to counteract the direct effects of pH changes on heart contractility and vasodilation (Eckenhoff and Longnecker 1995; HSDB 2004). The key effects for setting EEGL and CEGL values are tremor, headache, hyperventilation, visual impairment, and CNS impairment.

Suggested Citation:“3 Carbon Dioxide.” National Research Council. 2007. Emergency and Continuous Exposure Guidance Levels for Selected Submarine Contaminants: Volume 1. Washington, DC: The National Academies Press. doi: 10.17226/11170.×


The reason we are worried about CO2 is because of its atmospheric radiative properties, these are slowing down the escape of infrared rays into outer space - that is warming our climate away from the regime we have evolved within. Earth’s history makes very very clear, to all but deft, blind, mutes - that biospheres/environments that evolved under one climate regime do not adapt to radical climate regime changes. IT IS THAT SIMPLE.

119
CC, just search how many atomic bombs Climate Change is causing per day.
You're really convinced it's that easy. A little seat of the pants calculation, sorta, kinda including the stuff you can think of, lordie only knows how much you've missed in there. Short answer, 4th grade math may give you a rough ball park (if you haven't forgotten anything important) guesstimate, okay for conveying a rough to notion to the unschooled but certainly not enough to base science on.
120

Mike,

Fourth grade math ain’t going best this stuff!

This is the kind of math you would need to learn to comprehend or explain in a serious mathematical way, if you’re going to talk big about it the way you do. That’s why I use references to real experts, since I appreciate I ain’t one of them, I’m just someone who pays attention and demands/expects honesty.

Oh and remember this one is especially apt for you ponder a while : Unidirectional skepticism equals denial!

 

 

For more details: http://sections.maa.org/epadel/awards/studentpaper/winners/2010_Hamermesh.pdf