I’m talking about following the full letter and formality of the right to plead the Fifth
I’m not a lawyer. I’m not going to review every bit of testimony there is. The one I remember, to the best of my recollection, the guy turned to his lawyer, then made the full statement, then there were more questions, and he kept answering, “fifth”. Yeah, that was frivolous and callous. It was shown more than once on news channels. Any normal person could see what was going on.
Not really. No. It doesn’t.
In the last couple minutes of this Minchin critiques the liberal hypocrisy
Let’s not go there, I’m in the lap of middle class luxury this past week and another couple to come, it may be the American normal, but it has nothing to with sanity, or even situational awareness.
So, if I listen to you close enough it all makes sense the MAGA crowd has simply has been misunderstood, the totally suspension of honesty is no big deal. Using God as hateful bludgeon ain’t no big deal either, let it slide
I’m not familiar with Minchin, and he didn’t impress much.
More diversion than anything.
You don’t think so?
I do.
Especially if you’re able to recognize, I never said they shouldn’t have been allowed to take the Fifth. All, I said was they should have been forced to fully cop to what they were doing by taking that privilege.
How that relates to Minchin’s dialogue, I don’t see.
Too bad you don’t know Minchin, he’s a musician/comedian/philosopher. In the piece, he ends by pointing out that the principles of hearing all the evidence, providing the rights equally to all, and allowing equal access to defenders and witnesses, all of that must be done for the obviously guilty or it won’t be possible to do it for the innocent. If we decide in advance who is guilty and take away their rights, or who is innocent and give them a special pass, then it’s not a just system.
This is getting silly. You want them to say certain words, and you want the interrogator to make them say the words. Again, I’m not a lawyer, but I doubt anyone is getting off free because they didn’t repeat a phrase. So, when you say you “listen” to me “close enough”, that seems more like putting words in my mouth. I let nothing slide. It was obvious as I watched it live, in the 187 minutes that Trump was silent in his fortress that he was guilty, that inaction at that point was the culmination of his plan. But the wheels of justice turn slow, and it has taken this long to get all the facts, the depositions, the evidence entered, the reports made, and recommendations forwarded.
I’m not saying you are suggesting this, but the alternative is to be like one of those countries that drags their leaders out in the streets.
Minchin also makes fun of the liberals online who are compelled to comment because someone is just slightly different from them, even if they are just as liberal, like not posting some color flag on a certain day. It’s the narcissism of small differences, and it’s eating away at the strength of the movement.
No? All I’m talking about is political optics and how the Democrats have a way of dropping the ball too often.
That’s it.
As for liberals, I truly don’t know what that stands for anymore, since some of the stuff I hear coming out of liberals these days is stomach churning and unrecognizable to me.
I do know, I agree this is getting neither of us anywhere.
Seems to me the “movement” doesn’t understand what it is anymore, I’m thinking that’s the bigger problem.
But then we, as in society in general (left, right and center-ish) have decades worth of denial over so many critically important matters, I wonder why I even care anymore.
It’s probably why the Obama Birther thing & the Newt Gingrich’s thing, & the Tea Party thing were so successful. Facts and truth simply aren’t an important issues for most the people anymore. Hollywood nation and he who can put on the most lavish show wins, one under the God’s of self-indulgence and Ego.
And for sure, I don’t want to get in a fight with you over something so futile.
I see what you mean. You want them to “look” guilty in public. The problem is this kind of moral scolding doesn’t work in court.
A great example of this was O.J. Simpson. Everyone thinks he killed those people, but his lawyers were able to play the system — which is how the law actually works whether we like it or not. We can all point at Simpson and yell shame on you, but it doesn’t matter since he was found not guilty, and he doesn’t care about our outrage.
I’m not talking about court rooms,
Not even talking about the deluded, so much,
I’m talking about supposed children of the intellectual enlightenment, and the Democratic grassroots.
Gotta get our own acts together before we can do too much preaching to others - so you see I’m not really that oblivious, or dismissive, of things you advise.
So we roll over and call it good?
Christian nationalism and conspiracy propaganda in Michael Flynn’s Hate Democracy Roadshows, . . .
nothing to see here.
Nothing to think about, nothing to discuss, no point in caring about respecting honesty and community civility and democratic governance by the people, for the people, of the people?
Which includes all the people of color the whitie’s kept convincing to come over and join our melting pot, because our economy and the robber baron’s wealth depended on their labor.
Jan 26, 2023 - MSNBC
Michael Flynn, convicted of lying to the FBI, is fusing Christian nationalism and conspiracy propaganda in his radical roadshows. Joy Reid and her panel discuss this and other elements of the specter of the radicalized right.
Regarding Flynn’s upset that trump didn’t invoke martial law after legally losing the election.
I know this thread went a bit off the rails, but it’s a theme we’ve been bouncing back and forth to for a while.
Just finished Michael Pollan’s “How to Change Your Mind” on Netflix. The last one was about Peyote. It has an interesting place in the history of psychedelics because of its connection to the Native American Church. It was banned by the Conquistadors and that was passed on to the USA until very recently. Now, with a strong movement to decriminalize natural substances, the question of where peyote fits in has come back.
In its traditional use, it’s part of community rituals for healing and connecting to their spirits. Spirits that have more to do with nature than Western religions. If US law makes it something that doctors control, or something that is used casually, we could lose that. But as Michael points out in the conclusion, the mind-altering effects of the drug include a view into the harmonies and oneness of the natural world, something we could use more of in this disconnected culture, that mind/body landscape thing you talk about.
Psychedelics provide a path to seeing that landscape, but there needs to be a culture, a structure of some kind, that continues to nurture that shift of consciousness.
I have an idea that will have an immediate impact on lawmakers in regard to gun regulation.
Being that most mass shootings are acts of terrorism designed to make a statement that impacts the general public, I believe that the people’s representatives should be made to witness these acts in order to understand the difference between the abstract discussion of what impact terrorism and concrete exposure to the factual results of terrorism, such as being made to look at the actual carnage a “weapon of war” can inflict on innocent people going peacefully about their business.
No more abstract talk and prayer about “how terrible it must be”. Only actual exposure and experiencing the emotional impact of “how terrible it is”, will change mindsets and laws regulating offensive “weapons of war”, instead of laws permitting the possession of single-shot black powder muskets for which the original law was intended as a means of self-defense.
Lawmakers must be made to witness the horror from 6 feet away instead of a picture of a grieving parent. There are no pictures of actual dead bodies anywhere except at the coroner’s office. Show the results of what lawmakers are responsible for to the lawmakers who passed the laws making these horrors possible!!!
Mass shootings are a form of domestic terrorism. This is a fact, not just a belief. That alone should be enough to get lawmakers to start passing gun laws, especially concerning weapons of war, like AK 47. Alas, Repugs care more about banning books, controlling women, putting children as young as 5 or younger to work, banning LBGT etc.
Policemen don’t forget what they see. This is why they didn’t dare to attack the kid in New Mexico because they have seen what an AR 15 can do, even when it hits just a part of your body and the shockwave renders you unconscious.
Oh yes they do. That is why they attack that little Black kid with Skittles and kill him. They do it over and over again. It is also why they didn’t do anything in Texas, when all those Latino kids were slaughtered, with an AK47 (was it an AR? Doesn’t matter, still the same outcome) by some sicko. If they cared, they’d do the job taxpayers pay them to do, but they are too corrupt by Repugs who don’t care about anyone except rich WASPs who pay them to suppress others and/or let them be slaughtered. You could show Repugs many pics of dead Black kids, Latino kids, Native kids, LGBT, women, etc and it would probably fill them with joy, because they don’t care. Repugs support the domestic terrorism, because the NRA lines their pockets handsomely.
Yes, I don’t want to minimize the current gun fetish. But there are many “reasonable” NRA members who have seen death, not only from game but also during war, and once you have been exposed to death it creates engrams that may affect you for the rest of your life.
To recall my Shepherd “Odin” dying in my arms after having been run over by a truck 20 years ago, and seeing his eyes glaze over while I cried his name to the heavens, I still weep and cringe with grief .
Unless it’s a video game or virtual reality and then it seems to give people hard-ons.
But, it’s just a game they tell me, as the blood & guts splatter across the insides of their screens,
helps 'em blow off some steam, no harm no fault I’m reassured.
Got in a Facebook discussion about the term “assault rifle”. It is indeed an undefined word that manufacturers don’t use in advertising. However, they do market to that video game demographic. Hunting became less cool in the 60s, and gun sales were down. But they found young people were interested in self defense and “tactical” weapons and feeling like they were military.
