I am aware that people in USA and UK may on occassion consider islam to be a race by mistake (independently from Sam Harris and Richard Dawkins).
Because I live in Slovakia, there is everything up-side down, some time ago I was accused to support islamism.
Mr. Marcel Burkert in the wake of migration crisis started to write a lot of anti-muslim blogs, while he perpetrated few known myths about Islam (like the one with 70 virgins for martyrs… thats not in Quran).
I made some study about Islam, its tenets and about extremists groups and i came to quite fine distinctions between Islam as a religion (which i would oppose), Islam as political movement and Islamic extremism.
Bill Maher in his documentary Religulous made an interview in Holland with local imam. He said that “religion is this” and mass murder is politics. The thing is he wasnt lying about any of the statements. I had an occasion to speak with two anonymous people. One of them was from Turkey and he is a secular guy, the other was from Qatar and is a believer. To my surprise both of them were able to draw a line between religion and politics in a very similar manner. The religious one even told me that he was not aware that there are other than Sunni muslims until he was 15 or so, and that for most of his life, ignorant of the difference he could not feel any hate towards competing islamic sect.
So I learned a lot about Salafism and Wahabi sects of islam, and i realized that first one is more like “Anti-colonial” movement from 19th century. Most prominent and infamous member of salafistic movement was Bin Laden. Wahabism is sort of orthodox and extreme interpretation of Quran, and its religious movement. Their most prominent organization is known as Islamic State, and on political level they attempt to restore caliphate - in other words to bring back “islamic pope”. This goal is more political than religious, but here you cannot draw any line.
Mr. Burkert liked to accuse either refugees or the migrants of being members of “the one and the same religion”. When I pointed out that its the muslims who are being oppresed by Wahabi terror, he dedicated one of his blogs to me, and accused me of support of the Islam.
Did anything like this happened in USA?
Its a complete nonsense of course, because I would be put to death immediatelly as an atheist. When educated muslim confronts an educated christian they at least agree that they believe in same God, yet Mr. Burkert denied that Quran mentions Jesus as a prophet or that its another Abrahamic religion.
Only, all the time. It’s a specific example of common argument tactic; ignore the actual content and make what the person says be what you want it to be.
In America, it’s mostly about putting all Christians in the fundamentalist bucket. Now, there is a case to be made supporting moderate religion does support extremes, but it’s rarely intentional. And I don’t see much value in telling someone to stop feeding the poor in the name in Jesus because someone else persecuting Jews in the name of Jesus.
I also talked about the way Muslims mix religion with politics in this thread:
http://www.centerforinquiry.net/forums/viewthread/19775/
Specifically here http://www.centerforinquiry.net/forums/viewthread/19775/#239185
Only, all the time. It's a specific example of common argument tactic; ignore the actual content and make what the person says be what you want it to be. I also talked about the way Muslims mix religion with politics in this thread: http://www.centerforinquiry.net/forums/viewthread/19775/ Specifically here http://www.centerforinquiry.net/forums/viewthread/19775/#239185Well... from my point of view Mr. Burkert embodies word "islamophobia". 1. He has no idea about practical religion, except for his own interpretation of Quran. 2. He does not distinct between islamic sects at all, its a single unified religion to him. This partially comes from the idea of unity in christian culture, and he can barely grasp the fact that certain ideas are divisive even among one religion of one community. 3. He feels, and wants to spread the fear, while he himself is convinced its for common good. In some way he represents one of the religious extreme, simply because he spreads both hate and fear against specific religious group. If he sees muslim agents everywhere, its nothing else but paranoia. Even when certain personalities claimed there is no such thing as islamophobia, i beg to differ. But people in USA and UK who were accused of it, usually know the topic, are critical of islamic religious tenets and certain cultural aspects, but do not spread fear or hate in a manner "they are going to colonize us, and turn us into muslims, or will kill us with bombs". Distinctive discussion about Islam as the religion which brings more risks is a different thing.
In America, it's mostly about putting all Christians in the fundamentalist bucket. Now, there is a case to be made supporting moderate religion does support extremes, but it's rarely intentional. And I don't see much value in telling someone to stop feeding the poor in the name in Jesus because someone else persecuting Jews in the name of Jesus.At this time we have similar trouble in Slovakia... but its the christians themselves who are willingly entering the "religious nuts" buckets. Quite a lot of catholics, including high-ranked priests started to spread various conspiracy theories - the secular ones. Like EU wants to turn all men gay and such things... But its important to not drop all religious people in the "nuts" bucket, yet on other hand they are not making it easy for us.
But its important to not drop all religious people in the "nuts" bucket, yet on other hand they are not making it easy for us.Very succinct, well said. Kinda funny too.
I am aware that people in USA and UK may on occassion consider islam to be a race by mistake (independently from Sam Harris and Richard Dawkins). Because I live in Slovakia, there is everything up-side down, some time ago I was accused to support islamism. Mr. Marcel Burkert in the wake of migration crisis started to write a lot of anti-muslim blogs, while he perpetrated few known myths about Islam (like the one with 70 virgins for martyrs... thats not in Quran). I made some study about Islam, its tenets and about extremists groups and i came to quite fine distinctions between Islam as a religion (which i would oppose), Islam as political movement and Islamic extremism. Bill Maher in his documentary Religulous made an interview in Holland with local imam. He said that "religion is this" and mass murder is politics. The thing is he wasnt lying about any of the statements. I had an occasion to speak with two anonymous people. One of them was from Turkey and he is a secular guy, the other was from Qatar and is a believer. To my surprise both of them were able to draw a line between religion and politics in a very similar manner. The religious one even told me that he was not aware that there are other than Sunni muslims until he was 15 or so, and that for most of his life, ignorant of the difference he could not feel any hate towards competing islamic sect. So I learned a lot about Salafism and Wahabi sects of islam, and i realized that first one is more like "Anti-colonial" movement from 19th century. Most prominent and infamous member of salafistic movement was Bin Laden. Wahabism is sort of orthodox and extreme interpretation of Quran, and its religious movement. Their most prominent organization is known as Islamic State, and on political level they attempt to restore caliphate - in other words to bring back "islamic pope". This goal is more political than religious, but here you cannot draw any line. Mr. Burkert liked to accuse either refugees or the migrants of being members of "the one and the same religion". When I pointed out that its the muslims who are being oppresed by Wahabi terror, he dedicated one of his blogs to me, and accused me of support of the Islam. Did anything like this happened in USA? Its a complete nonsense of course, because I would be put to death immediatelly as an atheist. When educated muslim confronts an educated christian they at least agree that they believe in same God, yet Mr. Burkert denied that Quran mentions Jesus as a prophet or that its another Abrahamic religion.Does it really matter?
Asking out of curiosity.
If you are accused of being islamist and racist at the same time its usually not a problem on your side 
Just want to know if such things happen.
Only, all the time. It's a specific example of common argument tactic; ignore the actual content and make what the person says be what you want it to be. In America, it's mostly about putting all Christians in the fundamentalist bucket. Now, there is a case to be made supporting moderate religion does support extremes, but it's rarely intentional. And I don't see much value in telling someone to stop feeding the poor in the name in Jesus because someone else persecuting Jews in the name of Jesus. I also talked about the way Muslims mix religion with politics in this thread: http://www.centerforinquiry.net/forums/viewthread/19775/ Specifically here http://www.centerforinquiry.net/forums/viewthread/19775/#239185Are you sayimg Christiams don’t mix religion with politics? Which religions do not mix their beliefs with politics? Lois
Religious people who accepted principle of secularism.
Not a common thing …
Only, all the time. It's a specific example of common argument tactic; ignore the actual content and make what the person says be what you want it to be. In America, it's mostly about putting all Christians in the fundamentalist bucket. Now, there is a case to be made supporting moderate religion does support extremes, but it's rarely intentional. And I don't see much value in telling someone to stop feeding the poor in the name in Jesus because someone else persecuting Jews in the name of Jesus. I also talked about the way Muslims mix religion with politics in this thread: http://www.centerforinquiry.net/forums/viewthread/19775/ Specifically here http://www.centerforinquiry.net/forums/viewthread/19775/#239185Are you sayimg Christiams don’t mix religion with politics? Which religions do not mix their beliefs with politics? Lois The thesis is, from the book "Was Jesus a Muslim", that Christianity developed as a reaction to the political world. The Jewish community had integrated with the Roman power structure, so they identified themselves as something separate. This created something that was fairly unique. You could now define yourself as a part of a religion without being part of a culture. Jews have mostly had this imposed on them, they get labeled and then dealt with however the power structure wanted. For early Christianity, it worked in the short run to recruit people from anywhere, but it also isolated them. There isn't anything inherent in their theology that drives their politics. But, obviously they still do link to politics, partly because of their bringing the Old Testament with them. Islam on the other hand, is difficult to unlink from politics. It is baked into the theology and doctrine and history. The book doesn't really judge one way or the other. In fact there is a chapter showing how parables can be political and suggesting maybe Christianity should embrace that. It could actually make for a more consistent application of the myths to the real world.
Religious people who accepted principle of secularism. Not a common thing ...IMO, this is due to fact that almost all religions are "exclusive" of all other beliefs. Each religion claims to be the "true religion" and discourages reading or practising secular moral and ethical philosophies based on reason and scientific knowledge of the "way things work".
Religious people who accepted principle of secularism. Not a common thing ...IMO, this is due to fact that almost all religions are "exclusive" of all other beliefs. Each religion claims to be the "true religion" and discourages reading or practising secular moral and ethical philosophies based on reason and scientific knowledge of the "way things work". There is a duality in sense that "scientist who is also christian" separates his work and his beliefs. In my country people adhere to the secular/worldly laws, while its common thing to put religious or personal ethics on top of that. But this is primarily because in Slovakia is claim of exclusivity replaced by claim of universality. Catholics took seriously ecumenical movement so they are going with the idea that "we are all believing in the same god". They even extended this to local jewish community. I am waiting when they extend this to the muslim community as well :D. Of course they have problem to take seriously secularists, but there at least is no claim "there are no morals without god". Non belief, along with non-abrahamic religions might be dismissed as a delusion, yet this stance isnt made publicly by clergy or members of the church, mainly because its divisive and thats against ecumenism. Instead Conference of Bishops in Slovakia is attempting to stop certain lawa by scaring religious citizens by conspiracy theories, and affect legislative process. That goes straight against secularism.