# Science is universal - James Poskett **URL:** \ **Category:** Science and Technology\ **Created:** [December 2, 2022, 8:24am UTC](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/t/science-is-universal-james-poskett/10005 "2022-12-02T08:24:50Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![morgankane01](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex019/user_avatar/forum.centerforinquiry.org/morgankane01/32/28536_2.png) [@morgankane01](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/u/morgankane01)\ **Post date:** [December 2, 2022, 8:24am UTC](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/t/science-is-universal-james-poskett/10005/1 "2022-12-02T08:24:50Z")
The common view is that modern science was invented and great scientific discoveries in West. James Poskett challenges this view. [[James Poskett Science Has Always Been Global - YouTube](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X5sQ3Z86nuI)] ---
**Author:** ![citizenschallengev4](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex019/user_avatar/forum.centerforinquiry.org/citizenschallengev4/32/28718_2.png) [@citizenschallengev4](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/u/citizenschallengev4)\ **Post date:** [December 2, 2022, 7:51pm UTC](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/t/science-is-universal-james-poskett/10005/2 "2022-12-02T19:51:03Z")
> [@morgankane01](#): > > The common view is that modern science was invented and great scientific discoveries in West. > > James Poskett challenges this view. > > [[James Poskett Science Has Always Been Global - YouTube](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X5sQ3Z86nuI)] That was fun. I wasn’t familiar with Poskett, looks to be a real gem. I’ve already ordered his book and hope he makes good on this future plans. Thanks Morgan [https://www.harpercollins.com/products/horizons-james-poskett?variant=39936141918242](https://www.harpercollins.com/products/horizons-james-poskett?variant=39936141918242) ---
**Author:** ![lausten](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex019/user_avatar/forum.centerforinquiry.org/lausten/32/23705_2.png) [@lausten](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/u/lausten)\ **Post date:** [December 9, 2022, 2:22pm UTC](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/t/science-is-universal-james-poskett/10005/3 "2022-12-09T14:22:05Z")
I’ve been distracted a lot this week. I learned of the Islamic Golden Age years ago, I’ll see if I can dig up that source. I might have got a little too enamored with that, thinking it was the “real” source of the scientific revolution, but still, it’s important that we throw off these old prejudices, that somehow science came out of nowhere in Europe, because Europeans are intellectually superior. ---
**Author:** ![lausten](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex019/user_avatar/forum.centerforinquiry.org/lausten/32/23705_2.png) [@lausten](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/u/lausten)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2022, 12:10am UTC](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/t/science-is-universal-james-poskett/10005/4 "2022-12-11T00:10:49Z")
I think this is the series i saw. You might have to fish around to get all the episodes. Science and Islam [Science and Islam (TV series) - Google Search](https://g.co/kgs/uQVXoy) ---
**Author:** ![thatoneguy](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex019/user_avatar/forum.centerforinquiry.org/thatoneguy/32/28536_2.png) [@thatoneguy](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/u/thatoneguy)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2022, 4:33am UTC](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/t/science-is-universal-james-poskett/10005/5 "2022-12-13T04:33:52Z")
Sounds like a straw man argument. No one in academia denies that science has been done in other parts of the world. However, that doesn’t change the fact is modern science is a Western enterprise. ---
**Author:** ![lausten](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex019/user_avatar/forum.centerforinquiry.org/lausten/32/23705_2.png) [@lausten](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/u/lausten)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2022, 1:12pm UTC](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/t/science-is-universal-james-poskett/10005/6 "2022-12-13T13:12:22Z")
Apparently you’ve never met anyone who claims Europeans invented science because of their intellectual superiority. I find it quite common. Almost nonexistent are those who can give an explanation of why it arose as it did. As an easy example, ask people what Arabic numbers are. ---
**Author:** ![citizenschallengev4](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex019/user_avatar/forum.centerforinquiry.org/citizenschallengev4/32/28718_2.png) [@citizenschallengev4](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/u/citizenschallengev4)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2022, 1:26am UTC](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/t/science-is-universal-james-poskett/10005/7 "2022-12-14T01:26:02Z")
> [@thatoneguy](#): > > Sounds like a straw man argument. No one in academia denies that science has been done in other parts of the world. However, that doesn’t change the fact is modern science is a Western enterprise. How do you know that? ---
**Author:** ![thatoneguy](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex019/user_avatar/forum.centerforinquiry.org/thatoneguy/32/28536_2.png) [@thatoneguy](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/u/thatoneguy)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2022, 2:31am UTC](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/t/science-is-universal-james-poskett/10005/8 "2022-12-14T02:31:42Z")
It’s in any book covering world history. The consensus is that every civilization of note has used science and contributed to scientific progress. ---
**Author:** ![citizenschallengev4](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex019/user_avatar/forum.centerforinquiry.org/citizenschallengev4/32/28718_2.png) [@citizenschallengev4](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/u/citizenschallengev4)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2022, 2:50am UTC](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/t/science-is-universal-james-poskett/10005/9 "2022-12-14T02:50:30Z")
> [@thatoneguy](#): > > It’s in any book covering world history. The consensus is that every civilization **of note** has used science and contributed to scientific progress. Were it only so. Besides the obvious that archeologists and scholars have been making amazing new discoveries that keep teaching us more, and often putting older knowledge into a new light, so “any book” isn’t’ something to start a discussion on, more like a dare or something. 🤠 > **[Hijacking History](https://www.texastribune.org/2010/01/12/sboe-conservatives-rewrite-american-history-books/)** > > Was America ordained by God to lead the world? Are our public school students taught enough about the African American and Hispanic experiences? Was Joseph McCarthy an American hero? The always controversial State Board of Education meets this week... September 2014 > **[Rewriting history? Texas tackles textbook debate](https://www.cbsnews.com/news/rewriting-history-texas-tackles-textbook-debate/)** > > "We do our students a disservice when we scrub history clean of unpleasant truths," academic tells state's Board of Education [https://www.washingtonpost.com/outlook/2020/10/19/conservative-activists-texas-have-shaped-history-all-american-children-learn/](https://www.washingtonpost.com/outlook/2020/10/19/conservative-activists-texas-have-shaped-history-all-american-children-learn/) > **[Republicans aren't content to just "stop" history — they want to erase...](https://www.salon.com/2022/03/11/arent-content-to-just-stop-history-they-want-to-erase-decades-of-progress-entirely/)** > > Book banning, forcing people into the closet, even childbirth death: The GOP can't wait to bring it all back > **[The rightwing US textbooks that teach slavery as ‘black immigration’](https://www.theguardian.com/education/2021/aug/12/right-wing-textbooks-teach-slavery-black-immigration)** > > Guardian analysis finds that private schools, especially Christian schools, use textbooks that tell of a version of history that is racially biased and inaccurate just say’n 😕 ---
**Author:** ![thatoneguy](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex019/user_avatar/forum.centerforinquiry.org/thatoneguy/32/28536_2.png) [@thatoneguy](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/u/thatoneguy)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2022, 2:57am UTC](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/t/science-is-universal-james-poskett/10005/10 "2022-12-14T02:57:59Z")
> [@lausten](#): > > Apparently you’ve never met anyone who claims Europeans invented science because of their intellectual superiority. I find it quite common. Almost nonexistent are those who can give an explanation of why it arose as it did. > > As an easy example, ask people what Arabic numbers are. I’ve heard those people and they are historically illiterate. They aren’t the history professors, though. But the fact is Europeans have been intellectually superior for the last few centuries. ---
**Author:** ![thatoneguy](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex019/user_avatar/forum.centerforinquiry.org/thatoneguy/32/28536_2.png) [@thatoneguy](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/u/thatoneguy)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2022, 3:11am UTC](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/t/science-is-universal-james-poskett/10005/11 "2022-12-14T03:11:50Z")
> [@citizenschallengev4](#): > > > [@thatoneguy](#): > > > > It’s in any book covering world history. The consensus is that every civilization **of note** has used science and contributed to scientific progress. > > Were it only so. > Besides the obvious that archeologists and scholars have been making amazing new discoveries that keep teaching us more, and often putting older knowledge into a new light, so “any book” isn’t’ something to start a discussion on, more like a dare or something. 🤠 > > [SBOE Conservatives Rewrite American History Books | The Texas Tribune](https://www.texastribune.org/2010/01/12/sboe-conservatives-rewrite-american-history-books/) > September 2014 > [Rewriting history? Texas tackles textbook debate - CBS News](https://www.cbsnews.com/news/rewriting-history-texas-tackles-textbook-debate/) > > [https://www.washingtonpost.com/outlook/2020/10/19/conservative-activists-texas-have-shaped-history-all-american-children-learn/](https://www.washingtonpost.com/outlook/2020/10/19/conservative-activists-texas-have-shaped-history-all-american-children-learn/) > > [https://www.salon.com/2022/03/11/arent-content-to-just-stop-history-they-want-to-erase-decades-of-progress-entirely/](https://www.salon.com/2022/03/11/arent-content-to-just-stop-history-they-want-to-erase-decades-of-progress-entirely/) > > [The rightwing US textbooks that teach slavery as ‘black immigration’ | Race in education | The Guardian](https://www.theguardian.com/education/2021/aug/12/right-wing-textbooks-teach-slavery-black-immigration) > > just say’n 😕 I was hoping you would go off topic. ---
**Author:** ![morgankane01](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex019/user_avatar/forum.centerforinquiry.org/morgankane01/32/28536_2.png) [@morgankane01](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/u/morgankane01)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2022, 7:59am UTC](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/t/science-is-universal-james-poskett/10005/12 "2022-12-14T07:59:09Z")
> [@thatoneguy](#): > > But the fact is Europeans have been intellectually superior for the last few centuries. I would not use “intellectually superior” Now, even in modern times, extra European people have contributed. An exemple: [[Srinivasa Ramanujan - Wikipedia](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Srinivasa_Ramanujan)] [[List of Indian mathematicians - Wikipedia](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Indian_mathematicians)] Without really knowing the topic, it took me the time of typing " Indian mathematicians " in my search bar ---
**Author:** ![mriana](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex019/user_avatar/forum.centerforinquiry.org/mriana/32/18174_2.png) [@mriana](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/u/mriana)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2022, 12:12pm UTC](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/t/science-is-universal-james-poskett/10005/13 "2022-12-14T12:12:02Z")
A lot of the articles you posted show the Xian Reich agenda, which many Repugs are part of. The agenda is nothing more than control over everyone who isn’t a white male, preferably a rich white male and to pump out misinformation, especially in schools. Basically it’s the Xian version of Sharia Law as the goal. ---
**Author:** ![citizenschallengev4](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex019/user_avatar/forum.centerforinquiry.org/citizenschallengev4/32/28718_2.png) [@citizenschallengev4](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/u/citizenschallengev4)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2022, 2:53pm UTC](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/t/science-is-universal-james-poskett/10005/14 "2022-12-14T14:53:17Z")
> [@thatoneguy](#): > > I was hoping you would go off topic. What’s off topic? Pointing out your flippant remark is inaccurate and that many books don’t tell the story, in fact many books do what they can to dismiss the interconnected nature of human development of the growth of knowledge. Then you drop something idiotic like this. > [@thatoneguy](#): > > I’ve heard those people and they are historically illiterate. They aren’t the history professors, though. But the fact is Europeans have been intellectually superior for the last few centuries. How many of those bright minds in Europe of the past centuries, weren’t actually of European origin, schmatty pant? You really should try to get outside your comfort zone, try reading the book, or watch a little quality YouTube - “James Poskett” > [@morgankane01](#): > > [[James Poskett Science Has Always Been Global - YouTube](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X5sQ3Z86nuI)] > [@lausten](#): > > Science and Islam [Science and Islam (TV series) - Google Search](https://g.co/kgs/uQVXoy) ---
**Author:** ![thatoneguy](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex019/user_avatar/forum.centerforinquiry.org/thatoneguy/32/28536_2.png) [@thatoneguy](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/u/thatoneguy)\ **Post date:** [December 15, 2022, 4:04am UTC](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/t/science-is-universal-james-poskett/10005/15 "2022-12-15T04:04:40Z")
> [@citizenschallengev4](#): > > What’s off topic? Pointing out your flippant remark is inaccurate and that many books don’t tell the story, in fact many books do what they can to dismiss the interconnected nature of human development of the growth of knowledge. > > Then you drop something idiotic like this. None of your links have anything to do with the history of science. And the school officials who want to teach a sanitized version of slavery are a fringe group. > [@citizenschallengev4](#): > > How many of those bright minds in Europe of the past centuries, weren’t actually of European origin, schmatty pant? You really should try to get outside your comfort zone, try reading the book, or watch a little quality YouTube - “James Poskett” I can’t think of any European scientist of note who was not actually European. Closest thing to that idea might be Jews like Einstein – who are well represented in European science, because they are a mixed ethnicity with Near Eastern and European DNA. But labeling Einstein as non-European would call for a huge amount of hair splitting. It is worth pointing out there are groups like Black nationalists and their clownish White left-wing keepers who try to claim that big European names from the past were not White – [Beethoven is a popular one](https://www.smithsonianmag.com/smart-news/was-beethoven-black-and-why-might-be-wrong-question-ask-) – but these claims can be easily refuted. ---
**Author:** ![thatoneguy](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex019/user_avatar/forum.centerforinquiry.org/thatoneguy/32/28536_2.png) [@thatoneguy](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/u/thatoneguy)\ **Post date:** [December 15, 2022, 4:26am UTC](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/t/science-is-universal-james-poskett/10005/16 "2022-12-15T04:26:40Z")
> [@morgankane01](#): > > > [@thatoneguy](#): > > > > But the fact is Europeans have been intellectually superior for the last few centuries. > > I would not use “intellectually superior” > > Now, even in modern times, extra European people have contributed. > > An exemple: > > [[Srinivasa Ramanujan - Wikipedia](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Srinivasa_Ramanujan)] > > [[List of Indian mathematicians - Wikipedia](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Indian_mathematicians)] > > Without really knowing the topic, it took me the time of typing " Indian mathematicians " in my search bar True, although these Indians came to Europe to work because that’s where the modern scientific enterprise exists. They had little opportunity utilize their talents in Asia. ---
**Author:** ![citizenschallengev4](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex019/user_avatar/forum.centerforinquiry.org/citizenschallengev4/32/28718_2.png) [@citizenschallengev4](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/u/citizenschallengev4)\ **Post date:** [December 15, 2022, 2:41pm UTC](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/t/science-is-universal-james-poskett/10005/17 "2022-12-15T14:41:42Z")
> [@thatoneguy](#): > > None of your links have anything to do with the history of science. And the school officials who want to teach a sanitized version of slavery are a fringe group. Oh, got me on that. No science. GOP already managed to trash science, no need to address it at all anymore. > [@thatoneguy](#): > > I can’t think of any European scientist of note who was not actually European. > [@thatoneguy](#): > > True, although these Indians came to Europe to work because that’s where the modern scientific enterprise exists. They had little opportunity utilize their talents in Asia. Of course ‘you’ can’t, because it doesn’t seem like you’re interested in finding out, so of course you can’t think if anything you’ve not allowed yourself to be exposed to. No one is arguing that there aren’t extremist crazies on all sides, always have been, but the Crazies have never captured a third of the country and one of our two political parties, the way they have these days, thanks to internet crazy making, and loss of interest in practicing critical thinking skills. **Then get some education you can start with “Horizons”** What really gets me about you and your attitude seems depend on clinging to some notions of American Exceptionalism - never realizing, let alone appreciating that Americans became great, first and foremost because of the landmass we discovered and took over. Plus, it took in people from all over the world, the great American Melting Pot. Diversity is life and progress. Guess I got lucky, I didn’t grow up in a sterile household where Saturday morning cartoons was the height of my world exposure and intellectual experience. We (siblings) were exposed to the world, in those early years the stand out for me was the multicolumn time line: [Kulturfahrplan](https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kulturfahrplan), printed in old German even, fascinated the heck out of me and occasionally my mom would explain this or that section. Though I couldn’t really read it, the way it had the timeline laid out chronological and in columns representing specific human endeavors, Politics, Science, Military, Music, Literature, ? - it was perfectly named, [Culture Road Map](https://www.thriftbooks.com/w/the-timetables-of-history-a-horizontal-linkage-of-people-and-events/314142/item/809185/?gclid=Cj0KCQiAqOucBhDrARIsAPCQL1Z5R7fPn2KJ_Hp17Ym7VvIB31-wUDUayBL6kAg5383cTxAenvgLX8waAjTFEALw_wcB#idiq=809185&edition=2248909), because it was sort of laid out that way, just looking at it closely informed about the interwoven nature of human development. ---
**Author:** ![lausten](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex019/user_avatar/forum.centerforinquiry.org/lausten/32/23705_2.png) [@lausten](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/u/lausten)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2022, 2:36am UTC](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/t/science-is-universal-james-poskett/10005/18 "2022-12-16T02:36:14Z")
Counting recent scientists is not what the video is about. No one is born thinking in the way that’s required to publish and pass peer review. That’s why it took thousands of years for us to develop the methods. The “thing” about “science” is that it’s not like agriculture or inventing gunpowder, it’s a process, a way of approaching problems. It’s not something that one nation can see others doing and just adopt it. I put up something recently about why that is, but I’ll apply it here. After thousands of years of discoveries, and the spread of information, Europe was in a position to adopt of all of that knowledge and process from around the world. The Islamic world had done a lot of the work of gathering it, but then the Mongols burned their cities. Science needs a protected environment, that is, there needs to be a dominant military and government that can fund it. A degree of luck was involved with Europe coming out of its dark age just as the globalization was bringing these forces together. Unlucky for the rest of the world is that they decided to hide the history of how they gained much of this information, and claim the military superiority was due to their intellectual superiority. They turned India into a company, literally, and did not invest in a university system there, because they had everyone believing the brown people weren’t smart enough to bother. The book “The Boy Who Knew Infinity” is a great story about how it was finally recognized that isn’t true, and that we should spread our knowledge, not hoard it. We should look for genius everywhere and nurture it. ---
**Author:** ![thatoneguy](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex019/user_avatar/forum.centerforinquiry.org/thatoneguy/32/28536_2.png) [@thatoneguy](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/u/thatoneguy)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2022, 3:18am UTC](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/t/science-is-universal-james-poskett/10005/19 "2022-12-16T03:18:37Z")
> [@citizenschallengev4](#): > > Of course ‘you’ can’t, because it doesn’t seem like you’re interested in finding out, > so of course you can’t think if anything you’ve not allowed yourself to be exposed to. I’ve read enough history to know what is bullcrap and what is legitimate history, so I don’t need to expose myself to alternate theories. > [@citizenschallengev4](#): > > What really gets me about you and your attitude seems depend on clinging to some notions of American Exceptionalism - never realizing, let alone appreciating that Americans became great, first and foremost because of the landmass we discovered and took over. Plus, it took in people from all over the world, the great American Melting Pot. Diversity is life and progress. I thought we were talking about history of science. ---
**Author:** ![lausten](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex019/user_avatar/forum.centerforinquiry.org/lausten/32/23705_2.png) [@lausten](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/u/lausten)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2022, 3:29am UTC](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/t/science-is-universal-james-poskett/10005/20 "2022-12-16T03:29:41Z")
> [@thatoneguy](#): > > I thought we were talking about history of science. We are. 1492 is one point in history that they discuss. It goes with my post. That the circumstances of how cultures were conquered led to the environment for science to flourish, rather than some genetic superiority leading to science, and science leading to conquering. [Next page](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/t/science-is-universal-james-poskett/10005.md?page=2)