# Noahs flood debate **URL:** \ **Category:** Religion and Secularism\ **Created:** [August 9, 2021, 7:33am UTC](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/t/noahs-flood-debate/8119 "2021-08-09T07:33:31Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![djtexas](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex019/user_avatar/forum.centerforinquiry.org/djtexas/32/18_2.png) [@djtexas](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/u/djtexas)\ **Post date:** [August 9, 2021, 7:33am UTC](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/t/noahs-flood-debate/8119/1 "2021-08-09T07:33:31Z")
Erika is a star [![](https://us1.discourse-cdn.com/flex019/uploads/centerforinquiry/original/3X/d/5/d5c9f680f2c8b4743bf0288eb1f61cd4f55a6be7.jpeg "DEBATE: Did the Flood of Noah Happen? | Gutsick Gibbon Vs MrBatman | Podcast") ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ej9tFLlWfpc) ---
**Author:** ![djtexas](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex019/user_avatar/forum.centerforinquiry.org/djtexas/32/18_2.png) [@djtexas](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/u/djtexas)\ **Post date:** [August 9, 2021, 10:30am UTC](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/t/noahs-flood-debate/8119/2 "2021-08-09T10:30:35Z")
Ken Hams ark is made of steel and concrete and has flood insurance!! Ha ha ha ---
**Author:** ![michaelmckinney1951](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex019/user_avatar/forum.centerforinquiry.org/michaelmckinney1951/32/18_2.png) [@michaelmckinney1951](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/u/michaelmckinney1951)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2021, 10:29pm UTC](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/t/noahs-flood-debate/8119/3 "2021-08-13T22:29:13Z")
We know where that silly, childish myth came from. Thousands of years ago people walking in the mountains saw sea shells embedded in the rocks but because they had no idea of the immense age of the earth and that in it’s 4.6 billion year history the surface of our planet has been churned, shifted and resurfaced many times. Long before geology provided clear explanations about why fossilized sea creatures are found in very high elevations primitive people would take these rocks to their tribal chief, or shaman for an explanation. Now if you are that priest or shaman and you want to keep your favored status in your local tribe you need to come up with a credible answer. You can’t say “I don’t know” that would undermine your credibility. Hmm, let’s see oh yeah, how about a big, very big flood, big enough to cover mountain tops? That should do it, but when the question was asked “why didn’t all the animals drown?” Okay, let’s see oh yeah, God told Noah to build a boat a real big one and Noah traveled all around the world getting a male and female of the millions of different species from all around the world. Then he led them onto his ark and when the water receded he let them go. Have you ever heard a more ridiculous piece of moronic piffle? This world is filled with wonders but the infantile story of Noah’s Ark isn’t one of them. ---
**Author:** ![djtexas](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex019/user_avatar/forum.centerforinquiry.org/djtexas/32/18_2.png) [@djtexas](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/u/djtexas)\ **Post date:** [August 14, 2021, 10:29am UTC](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/t/noahs-flood-debate/8119/4 "2021-08-14T10:29:23Z")
How did you like that line from Mr Batman that God put all the animals into hibernation so food not need and there was no crap ! Magic! ---
**Author:** ![martin-peter-clarke](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex019/user_avatar/forum.centerforinquiry.org/martin-peter-clarke/32/375_2.png) [@martin-peter-clarke](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/u/martin-peter-clarke)\ **Post date:** [August 17, 2021, 2:19pm UTC](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/t/noahs-flood-debate/8119/5 "2021-08-17T14:19:42Z")
What’s silly, childish, infantile about a Bronze Age myth common to humanity? It’s not even sophomoric to judge the infancy of civilization with such pubescent arrogance. ---
**Author:** ![michaelmckinney1951](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex019/user_avatar/forum.centerforinquiry.org/michaelmckinney1951/32/18_2.png) [@michaelmckinney1951](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/u/michaelmckinney1951)\ **Post date:** [August 17, 2021, 4:33pm UTC](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/t/noahs-flood-debate/8119/6 "2021-08-17T16:33:24Z")
Respectfully, Do you honestly believe the biblical story of Noah’s ark? It’s true to say that the myth of great floods was common in the ancient world and even preceded the Bronze Age, the myth of Noah’s Ark is based wholly on a misplaced belief in the infallibility of biblical text and thereby earns the description of being religious dogma. Modern science pays God far greater homage to his creation than silly fables of human invention. ---
**Author:** ![michaelmckinney1951](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex019/user_avatar/forum.centerforinquiry.org/michaelmckinney1951/32/18_2.png) [@michaelmckinney1951](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/u/michaelmckinney1951)\ **Post date:** [August 17, 2021, 4:37pm UTC](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/t/noahs-flood-debate/8119/7 "2021-08-17T16:37:05Z")
By the way, I forgot to ask; what exactly is judging “the infancy of civilization” as you say? ---
**Author:** ![martin-peter-clarke](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex019/user_avatar/forum.centerforinquiry.org/martin-peter-clarke/32/375_2.png) [@martin-peter-clarke](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/u/martin-peter-clarke)\ **Post date:** [August 17, 2021, 4:46pm UTC](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/t/noahs-flood-debate/8119/8 "2021-08-17T16:46:26Z")
(Modern) science is a story that stands on the shoulders of giant Bronze Age story tellers. Respect them and yourself. ---
**Author:** ![michaelmckinney1951](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex019/user_avatar/forum.centerforinquiry.org/michaelmckinney1951/32/18_2.png) [@michaelmckinney1951](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/u/michaelmckinney1951)\ **Post date:** [August 17, 2021, 7:01pm UTC](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/t/noahs-flood-debate/8119/9 "2021-08-17T19:01:23Z")
Thank you for the free advice. Would you say part of self-respect involves someone stating as clear and convincingly as possible why they think something is true and why they believe it isn’t? I do. ---
**Author:** ![djtexas](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex019/user_avatar/forum.centerforinquiry.org/djtexas/32/18_2.png) [@djtexas](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/u/djtexas)\ **Post date:** [August 18, 2021, 4:36am UTC](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/t/noahs-flood-debate/8119/10 "2021-08-18T04:36:46Z")
I can’t get past those that have grown up and unable to dismiss such mickey mouse fairytales. ---
**Author:** ![martin-peter-clarke](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex019/user_avatar/forum.centerforinquiry.org/martin-peter-clarke/32/375_2.png) [@martin-peter-clarke](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/u/martin-peter-clarke)\ **Post date:** [August 18, 2021, 7:05am UTC](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/t/noahs-flood-debate/8119/11 "2021-08-18T07:05:36Z")
After you. . . . . . ---
**Author:** ![michaelmckinney1951](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex019/user_avatar/forum.centerforinquiry.org/michaelmckinney1951/32/18_2.png) [@michaelmckinney1951](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/u/michaelmckinney1951)\ **Post date:** [August 18, 2021, 2:39pm UTC](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/t/noahs-flood-debate/8119/12 "2021-08-18T14:39:31Z")
Thank you Martin, I was just thinking how fortunate we all are in this country. We take it as an absolute right to make any statement we want (provided it’s not willfully injurious to any individual or organization) but if we lived in any of those countries where religious orthodoxy is woven into the cultural and political life of the government and there are many, we could face prosecution from the state and even violent reprisal. The title of this discussion as listed above is “Noah’s flood debate” Those who espouse belief in this and other biblical myths either can’t or don’t want to consider the real damage such teaching can cause. Many young people who are searching for and receptive to convincing answers about the universe around them and their place in it are turned off, sometimes permanently turned off by biblical dogma. When they hear from those proselytizing about snakes in “The Garden of Eden” and “Noah’s Ark” they know they’re hearing nonsense and they can mistakenly conclude there is no deeper spiritual reality to strive toward or at least wonder about because orthodoxy, especially religious orthodoxy is the enemy of human curiosity. Dogma is and has always been opposed to imagination and free thinking. Unfortunately it doesn’t end there. Despite what many religious conservatives think, the climate crisis poses a serious danger to our collective future and a large part of our inability to deal with this threat is the ongoing fact that many in congress are religious conservatives who firmly believe this threat is completely imaginary. Their reasoning is "If climate change was a real threat it would’ve been written in the bible to warn us, and since it isn’t in the bible, it’s not real. Religious dogma like the fable of “Noah’s Ark” and the “Garden of Eden” is a form of human ignorance and poses a real impediment to mankind’s future. I thank the Center For Inquiry for maintaining this critically needed First Amendment, free speech platform ---
**Author:** ![citizenschallengev4](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex019/user_avatar/forum.centerforinquiry.org/citizenschallengev4/32/28718_2.png) [@citizenschallengev4](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/u/citizenschallengev4)\ **Post date:** [August 18, 2021, 4:17pm UTC](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/t/noahs-flood-debate/8119/13 "2021-08-18T16:17:28Z")
> [@michaelmckinney1951](#): > > Respectfully, Do you honestly believe the biblical story of Noah’s ark? > It’s true to say that the myth of great floods was common in the ancient world and even preceded the Bronze Age, Or another way to look at it is that damaging Floods were a common experience, particularly around 10 thousand years ago as the ice age melted away raising sea levels, creating a few new seas and so on, as we were entered the climate optimal situation that enabled humanity to explode in complexity and capabilities, farming, society, religion, science, these past ten thousand years or so. To mention but one of the more dramatic moments in the historical record: > **[Evidence found of Noah's ark flood victims](https://www.theguardian.com/science/2000/sep/14/internationalnews.archaeology)** > > Marine archaeologists have found the first evidence of a people who perished in a great flood of the Black Sea that has been linked with the story of Noah's ark. ---
**Author:** ![michaelmckinney1951](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex019/user_avatar/forum.centerforinquiry.org/michaelmckinney1951/32/18_2.png) [@michaelmckinney1951](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/u/michaelmckinney1951)\ **Post date:** [August 18, 2021, 7:10pm UTC](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/t/noahs-flood-debate/8119/14 "2021-08-18T19:10:55Z")
Yes I agree with you CC, There’s no doubt that in nearly all coastal human settlements myths of enormously large floods are based on real historic events, but that’s true because tsunamis occur regularly though not frequently back through human history. If we directly experienced the devastating power of a tidal wave that killed off most of the community we lived in we would make sure the incredible story was preserved for future generations. This is where the universal myth of civilization ending floods comes from. It’s not from some imaginary pact with Noah from God to build a boat and gather animals. That’s just a fairy tale. As far as the above report is concerned, what a laugh! No facts cited, no evidence cited, no named researchers cited, no name or names of those who “linked” “the story of Noah’s Ark.” You know, there are people who say there’s no Santa Claus, but I know they’re wrong because every Christmas Eve I hear reports on the evening news of Santa’s progress in his night’s work. ---
**Author:** ![michaelmckinney1951](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex019/user_avatar/forum.centerforinquiry.org/michaelmckinney1951/32/18_2.png) [@michaelmckinney1951](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/u/michaelmckinney1951)\ **Post date:** [August 18, 2021, 8:04pm UTC](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/t/noahs-flood-debate/8119/15 "2021-08-18T20:04:26Z")
Or another way to look at it is that damaging Floods were a common experience, particularly around 10 thousand years ago as the ice age melted away raising sea levels, creating a few new seas and so on, as we were entered the climate optimal situation that enabled humanity to explode in complexity and capabilities, farming, society, religion, science, these past ten thousand years or so. To mention but one of the more dramatic moments in the historical record: ![](https://us1.discourse-cdn.com/flex019/uploads/centerforinquiry/original/2X/b/b446610aa6abf0f3557e414be6d977a849df24d9.png)[the Guardian – 14 Sep 00](https://www.theguardian.com/science/2000/sep/14/internationalnews.archaeology) ### [Evidence found of Noah’s ark flood victims](https://www.theguardian.com/science/2000/sep/14/internationalnews.archaeology) Marine archaeologists have found the first evidence of a people who perished in a great flood of the Black Sea that has been linked with the story of Noah’s ark. ---
**Author:** ![michaelmckinney1951](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex019/user_avatar/forum.centerforinquiry.org/michaelmckinney1951/32/18_2.png) [@michaelmckinney1951](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/u/michaelmckinney1951)\ **Post date:** [August 18, 2021, 8:09pm UTC](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/t/noahs-flood-debate/8119/16 "2021-08-18T20:09:26Z")
The above entry of what was already posted was a result of my error in mistakenly hitting send form my email. ---
**Author:** ![citizenschallengev4](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex019/user_avatar/forum.centerforinquiry.org/citizenschallengev4/32/28718_2.png) [@citizenschallengev4](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/u/citizenschallengev4)\ **Post date:** [August 18, 2021, 10:35pm UTC](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/t/noahs-flood-debate/8119/17 "2021-08-18T22:35:24Z")
Okay so here we had a case of an idiotic title meant purely to sell the story. I think the intent was to say that the Black Sea flood was probably the specific event that inspired Noah’s Story. The story itself makes no claim, in fact the last paragraph: > But he does not claim to have found the landscape of Noah. " We really cannot say in any way, shape or form that this is the biblical flood. All we can say is that there has been a major flood, that people were living here when it happened. We prefer to stick with the facts -and who knows where those facts will lead us." ---
**Author:** ![djtexas](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex019/user_avatar/forum.centerforinquiry.org/djtexas/32/18_2.png) [@djtexas](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/u/djtexas)\ **Post date:** [August 18, 2021, 10:39pm UTC](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/t/noahs-flood-debate/8119/18 "2021-08-18T22:39:12Z")
Youre boring everyone to tears ---
**Author:** ![michaelmckinney1951](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex019/user_avatar/forum.centerforinquiry.org/michaelmckinney1951/32/18_2.png) [@michaelmckinney1951](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/u/michaelmckinney1951)\ **Post date:** [August 18, 2021, 11:55pm UTC](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/t/noahs-flood-debate/8119/19 "2021-08-18T23:55:28Z")
It’s interesting that purveyors of the Noah’s Ark flood myth always use language that’s wholly generic and totally non-specific and the reason is very simple. They know they can never conclusively prove the story of Noah’s ark but they also know they don’t have to. All they need to keep the believers of this myth stoked is to skillfully describe a sketchy scenario like the one above and the believer’s inclination will do the rest. ---
**Author:** ![citizenschallengev4](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex019/user_avatar/forum.centerforinquiry.org/citizenschallengev4/32/28718_2.png) [@citizenschallengev4](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/u/citizenschallengev4)\ **Post date:** [August 19, 2021, 5:40am UTC](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/t/noahs-flood-debate/8119/20 "2021-08-19T05:40:27Z")
> [@michaelmckinney1951](#): > > All they need to keep the believers of this myth stoked is to skillfully describe a sketchy scenario like the one above Help me out here. Besides the title, (_which you need to hang on the editor_.), can you share a quote from the article itself that you find offensive to your sense of scientific inquiry [Next page](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/t/noahs-flood-debate/8119.md?page=2)