# Is the Quantum/Classical boundary, Coherence VS Decoherence? **URL:** \ **Category:** Science and Technology\ **Created:** [April 3, 2020, 3:03pm UTC](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/t/is-the-quantum-classical-boundary-coherence-vs-decoherence/7200 "2020-04-03T15:03:21Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![pittsburghjoe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/e19adc/32.png) [@pittsburghjoe](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/u/pittsburghjoe)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2020, 3:03pm UTC](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/t/is-the-quantum-classical-boundary-coherence-vs-decoherence/7200/1 "2020-04-03T15:03:21Z")
Coherence is for quantum waves that can entangle, tunnel, and be in superposition. Decoherence is for physical/classical particles. ---
**Author:** ![pittsburghjoe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/e19adc/32.png) [@pittsburghjoe](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/u/pittsburghjoe)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2020, 3:31pm UTC](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/t/is-the-quantum-classical-boundary-coherence-vs-decoherence/7200/2 "2020-04-03T15:31:02Z")
Wake up people, this is the UNIFIED THEORY. ---
**Author:** ![pittsburghjoe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/e19adc/32.png) [@pittsburghjoe](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/u/pittsburghjoe)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2020, 3:47pm UTC](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/t/is-the-quantum-classical-boundary-coherence-vs-decoherence/7200/3 "2020-04-03T15:47:50Z")
Somewhere around 50,000 bonded atoms will automatically be decohered. Anything smaller requires a decoherence event in its path to be classical. ---
**Author:** ![pittsburghjoe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/e19adc/32.png) [@pittsburghjoe](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/u/pittsburghjoe)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2020, 10:44pm UTC](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/t/is-the-quantum-classical-boundary-coherence-vs-decoherence/7200/4 "2020-04-03T22:44:47Z")
If an object needs a decoherence event in its path to decohere, is it physical/real after the event? Is it still a group of wave packets, but only condensed now? Does it take around 50,000 bonded atoms to be physical particles? ---
**Author:** ![citizenschallengev3](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex019/user_avatar/forum.centerforinquiry.org/citizenschallengev3/32/17_2.png) [@citizenschallengev3](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/u/citizenschallengev3)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2020, 11:52pm UTC](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/t/is-the-quantum-classical-boundary-coherence-vs-decoherence/7200/5 "2020-04-03T23:52:15Z")
What are you doing? You think blitz bombing this Board with a dozen threads lends your case support? what kind of atoms??? Or does their size not matter???     ---
**Author:** ![pittsburghjoe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/e19adc/32.png) [@pittsburghjoe](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/u/pittsburghjoe)\ **Post date:** [April 4, 2020, 12:37am UTC](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/t/is-the-quantum-classical-boundary-coherence-vs-decoherence/7200/6 "2020-04-04T00:37:32Z")
This explains why decohered particles can be influenced by the quantum field. ---
**Author:** ![pittsburghjoe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/e19adc/32.png) [@pittsburghjoe](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/u/pittsburghjoe)\ **Post date:** [April 4, 2020, 12:50am UTC](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/t/is-the-quantum-classical-boundary-coherence-vs-decoherence/7200/7 "2020-04-04T00:50:21Z")
This means I was very wrong about decoherence causing physical/real particles. Decoherence is causing condensed wave packets that give the impression they are physical. ---
**Author:** ![pittsburghjoe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/e19adc/32.png) [@pittsburghjoe](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/u/pittsburghjoe)\ **Post date:** [April 4, 2020, 1:06am UTC](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/t/is-the-quantum-classical-boundary-coherence-vs-decoherence/7200/8 "2020-04-04T01:06:46Z")
Is decohered-condensed wave packets a new state of matter? ---
**Author:** ![pittsburghjoe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/e19adc/32.png) [@pittsburghjoe](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/u/pittsburghjoe)\ **Post date:** [April 4, 2020, 9:38am UTC](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/t/is-the-quantum-classical-boundary-coherence-vs-decoherence/7200/9 "2020-04-04T09:38:38Z")
Decoherence and Wave collapse are not the same thing. Wave collapse is when a particle hits a physical object and dead stops. Decoherence is a particle being measured in flight and allowed to continue moving on its path. Decoherence now means all quantum particles are not physical/real …they are condensed wave packets that give the appearance they are physical/real after a decoherence event. Coherence is the state a wave has to be in to perform quantum weirdness events. Coherence is orderly waves. Coherence is the world of the unobservable. Did we overlook one crucial detail about duality? Duality is not a physical/wave object. It is never physical, it is either waves or condensed wave packets (decoherence). ---
**Author:** ![write4u](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex019/user_avatar/forum.centerforinquiry.org/write4u/32/23410_2.png) [@write4u](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/u/write4u)\ **Post date:** [April 4, 2020, 2:19pm UTC](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/t/is-the-quantum-classical-boundary-coherence-vs-decoherence/7200/10 "2020-04-04T14:19:49Z")
> pjoe said; Does it take around 50,000 bonded atoms to be physical particles? No it takes a bunch of atoms to form molecules (physical patterns) with emergent properties over and beyond the individual properties of the atoms. A Hydrogen atom is not wet, an Oxygen atom is not wet, an H2O molecules is not wet . However, 50,000 H2O molecules arranged in a specific pattern may have an emergent property of “wetness” , i.e. liquid water. Arranged in a denser pattern it may attain an emergent property of non-wet solid, i.e. ice. Think of patterns at all levels. It is the **patterns in which particles, atoms, molecules are arranged** , which give matter its specific properties and potentials. ---
**Author:** ![pittsburghjoe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/e19adc/32.png) [@pittsburghjoe](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/u/pittsburghjoe)\ **Post date:** [April 4, 2020, 2:29pm UTC](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/t/is-the-quantum-classical-boundary-coherence-vs-decoherence/7200/11 "2020-04-04T14:29:09Z")
Someone actually wrote something worth reading for once. Thank you. ---
**Author:** ![pittsburghjoe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/e19adc/32.png) [@pittsburghjoe](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/u/pittsburghjoe)\ **Post date:** [April 4, 2020, 9:24pm UTC](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/t/is-the-quantum-classical-boundary-coherence-vs-decoherence/7200/12 "2020-04-04T21:24:56Z")
Are plane waves coherent as they live in their respective quantum fields as unobservable? Is a wave packet decohered and a composite of all the plane waves that makeup the “object”? ![](https://us1.discourse-cdn.com/flex019/uploads/centerforinquiry/original/2X/f/fe0ff7e637e1d20bd86a7cee4a53d765665dcf5e.jpeg) ![](https://us1.discourse-cdn.com/flex019/uploads/centerforinquiry/original/2X/9/9e2556a47c30dd87ab2e606d8ca76250e423a774.jpeg) ![](https://us1.discourse-cdn.com/flex019/uploads/centerforinquiry/original/2X/9/954f1827423965aff2ad0415f89b881d1f0d279e.jpeg) ---
**Author:** ![pittsburghjoe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/e19adc/32.png) [@pittsburghjoe](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/u/pittsburghjoe)\ **Post date:** [April 4, 2020, 10:36pm UTC](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/t/is-the-quantum-classical-boundary-coherence-vs-decoherence/7200/13 "2020-04-04T22:36:07Z")
Does the standard model tell us that each quantum field has its own coherent plane wave? And that decoherence causes the waves to combine into a single wave packet? Plane waves are infinite and fall out of coherence with future decoherence events. ---
**Author:** ![pittsburghjoe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/e19adc/32.png) [@pittsburghjoe](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/u/pittsburghjoe)\ **Post date:** [April 5, 2020, 1:23am UTC](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/t/is-the-quantum-classical-boundary-coherence-vs-decoherence/7200/14 "2020-04-05T01:23:09Z")
Does decoherence cause wave packets before the decoherence event because quantum fields do not use distance or time (aka spacetime)? Are wave packets using spacetime and the reason they can not be in superposition, entangle, or tunnel? ---
**Author:** ![pittsburghjoe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/e19adc/32.png) [@pittsburghjoe](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/u/pittsburghjoe)\ **Post date:** [April 5, 2020, 10:27am UTC](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/t/is-the-quantum-classical-boundary-coherence-vs-decoherence/7200/15 "2020-04-05T10:27:36Z")
Do any of you grasp what I’ve solved here? Wave packets are not physical despite the connotations. They are not just for light, matter waves can be a wave packet also. Duality of a free particle is many waves to a single wave. It’s like going from digital to analog. Decoherence triggers many plane waves to compile into a single wave packet. The quantum fields don’t use space and time, they are filled with plane waves. Compiled wave packets are restricted via spacetime. ---
**Author:** ![pittsburghjoe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/e19adc/32.png) [@pittsburghjoe](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/u/pittsburghjoe)\ **Post date:** [April 5, 2020, 12:43pm UTC](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/t/is-the-quantum-classical-boundary-coherence-vs-decoherence/7200/16 "2020-04-05T12:43:19Z")
The many layers of infinite coherent quantum fields are digital/virtual/holographic. Decoherence and Wave collapse are not the same thing. Wave collapse is when a particle hits a physical object and dead stops. Decoherence is a particle being measured in flight and allowed to continue moving on its path. Wave collapse does not influence the state of the wave in flight. The measurement problem is not a problem anymore. Coherence is the state a wave has to be in to perform quantum weirdness events (superposition, entangle, and tunnel). ---
**Author:** ![pittsburghjoe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/e19adc/32.png) [@pittsburghjoe](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/u/pittsburghjoe)\ **Post date:** [April 5, 2020, 1:12pm UTC](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/t/is-the-quantum-classical-boundary-coherence-vs-decoherence/7200/17 "2020-04-05T13:12:46Z")
I think wave packets are a candidate to be a new state of matter. Wave packets don’t exist in a certain group number of patterns or molecules. It equates the mass energy necessary to bend spacetime. It is the quantum/classical boundary. ---
**Author:** ![pittsburghjoe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/e19adc/32.png) [@pittsburghjoe](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/u/pittsburghjoe)\ **Post date:** [April 5, 2020, 4:49pm UTC](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/t/is-the-quantum-classical-boundary-coherence-vs-decoherence/7200/18 "2020-04-05T16:49:22Z")
Did we know all along that plane waves do not use spacetime? This means quantum fields do not use spacetime. ![](https://us1.discourse-cdn.com/flex019/uploads/centerforinquiry/original/2X/c/cfe9c4a83a9526ec3f356f386fe97682a306d5b0.jpeg) ---
**Author:** ![pittsburghjoe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/e19adc/32.png) [@pittsburghjoe](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/u/pittsburghjoe)\ **Post date:** [April 5, 2020, 6:41pm UTC](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/t/is-the-quantum-classical-boundary-coherence-vs-decoherence/7200/19 "2020-04-05T18:41:17Z")
For the slower out there, “x” and “t” being undefined for planes waves means spacetime is not being used. Unobserved/Coherent quantum waves do not propagate. This changes everything. Hint: coherent waves are not real. Laser light can be coherent because they are not waves after wave collapse. Decohered laser light is wave packets that use spacetime. ---
**Author:** ![pittsburghjoe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/e19adc/32.png) [@pittsburghjoe](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/u/pittsburghjoe)\ **Post date:** [April 5, 2020, 7:58pm UTC](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/t/is-the-quantum-classical-boundary-coherence-vs-decoherence/7200/20 "2020-04-05T19:58:01Z")
This explains why superposition, entanglement, and tunneling require coherence. The unreal can get away with things like this. Each quantum field has its own coherent plane wave. This is what unobservable quantum waves are. You’re welcome. Consider QM solved. [Next page](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/t/is-the-quantum-classical-boundary-coherence-vs-decoherence/7200.md?page=2)