# Citizen's Right to Know. **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics and Social Issues\ **Created:** [March 1, 2019, 5:27pm UTC](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/t/citizens-right-to-know/6334 "2019-03-01T17:27:21Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 16\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![citizenschallengev3](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex019/user_avatar/forum.centerforinquiry.org/citizenschallengev3/32/17_2.png) [@citizenschallengev3](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/u/citizenschallengev3)\ **Post date:** [March 1, 2019, 5:27pm UTC](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/t/citizens-right-to-know/6334/1 "2019-03-01T17:27:21Z")
  > **We The People of the United States have a moral, ethical right - along with a pragmatic need - to learn what scientists have learned about this planet's biosphere and climate engine without constant dishonest crossfire.** > > **We should not tolerate serious scientists constantly being drown out by amoral, malicious and frankly ignorant arguments - that an astoundingly ruthless GOP PR factory repeats over and over again, without ever learning a damned thing from the evidence in front of us.** Anyone care to discuss it? _;- )_ ---
**Author:** ![mikeyohe](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex019/user_avatar/forum.centerforinquiry.org/mikeyohe/32/28536_2.png) [@mikeyohe](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/u/mikeyohe)\ **Post date:** [March 2, 2019, 12:30am UTC](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/t/citizens-right-to-know/6334/2 "2019-03-02T00:30:44Z")
In post #297592 - NASA “Scientists” talk about Global Warming epidemic danger. Located under “Science and Technology”. You posted about the GISS and the Nasa climate scientists. I think this would be good for a debate on the climate change issues of just WHAT the scientists are saying. The common factor is that we both agree that these are good scientists. But I think we disagree on what they are telling us. This would be a good debate and should cover some of the issues you brought up.   ---
**Author:** ![citizenschallengev3](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex019/user_avatar/forum.centerforinquiry.org/citizenschallengev3/32/17_2.png) [@citizenschallengev3](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/u/citizenschallengev3)\ **Post date:** [March 2, 2019, 11:15am UTC](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/t/citizens-right-to-know/6334/3 "2019-03-02T11:15:04Z")
What NASA “climate scientists” ? You’re parroting bullshit again. Besides it has already been addressed previously but you possess **that quintessential hallmark of the contrarian type** , **That ability to absolutely refuse to look at and absorb any evidence that doesn’t fit into their preconceived self-certain notions.** It’s pathetic beyond my comprehension. But, when most citizens are willing to roll over for it, what’s a guy to do, but watch this slow motion train wreck unfold and deal with it in the comfort of knowing that I will die before it gets into the really ugly stages. You know, we’re just beginning of our human made Extreme Weather Roulette game, but be sure the odds are getting slightly smaller for you, and me, as each year passes.   _So, mikie go off and play in your hollyworld mindscape, don’t matter what you’re thinking one way or the other anyways, does it now._ ---
**Author:** ![mikeyohe](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex019/user_avatar/forum.centerforinquiry.org/mikeyohe/32/28536_2.png) [@mikeyohe](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/u/mikeyohe)\ **Post date:** [March 2, 2019, 12:44pm UTC](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/t/citizens-right-to-know/6334/4 "2019-03-02T12:44:55Z")
Your view is the only good scientists are the ones that agree with your point of views? Is that correct? Is it correct to say you claim that Nasa has no good science about climate change? Same old BS. The world is in trouble. That would be the alarmists part. When, where and how much? Well, you will take anything that mother nature creates and try and make it fit. I’m I to understand with your statement that “_ **we’re just beginning of our human made Extreme Weather Roulette game** _”, that you started the clock over again for the X time in two decades? Do you want me to tell you how long the extreme weather is going to last. Or are you able to look up the GSM cycles yourself? For a person who is making claims that we are just beginning “Extreme Weather”. You have a short memory. I told you years back that the GSM’s is predicted to bring extreme weather in a few years. And these same changes were predicted years ago by Dr. Judith Curry. as part of the weather cycles. Now that we are in the Maximum GSM and the predictions are coming true. You are spreading fake BS to pin this on unproven political science. Meanwhile the sun cycles are moving more into the mainstream science along with the clouds. The two items you claim have zero or so little measurable affect on weather that it is not worth talking about. One has to assume that you have never once complained about in thirty years of no successful climate model data of any major level that you are fine with your slow political science methods. So, how much of this **extreme weather** is caused by Climate Change? All of it, some of it. If I read your statement correctly, all the extreme weather is human made. After all you are starting you weather clock over again, this time do we get any predictions that are before the 2100 date? It would be nice if you had scientists that can predict weather in your lifetime. Like the rest of us have. But then could not use weather as a political tool, could you? I accept the reason for not wanting to debate is on the same grounds that the science you are promoting would not do a public televised debate on Climate Change. Political science does not hold up to real scientific facts. Your use of derogatory name calling just shows that you are just hanging on by a thread of political science today. Take away the natural changes of mother nature and what you have left is due to humans. While it is not good, it is not the end of the world. CO2 is increasing food production, Without population controls, more protein is required. Please try and be progressive not regressive. Being progressive is knowing the difference between man-made and mother nature.   ---
**Author:** ![citizenschallengev3](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex019/user_avatar/forum.centerforinquiry.org/citizenschallengev3/32/17_2.png) [@citizenschallengev3](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/u/citizenschallengev3)\ **Post date:** [March 2, 2019, 4:35pm UTC](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/t/citizens-right-to-know/6334/5 "2019-03-02T16:35:55Z")
_Y.F.A.H!!!_ All I asked was which NASA climate scientists are you talking about? **But of course you don’t have an answer and instead have to toss pure bullshit at me.** The scientists that I respect are the ones that have the respect of their professional peers. The scientists I can’t stand are the one’s that deal in double talk and confusion and distractions and misdirections so juvenile I can see through them! > **Name these NASA climate scientists whom you respect so much.** > > **Show us some papers they’ve written that explain the science behind their objections.** > > **CAN YOU DO IT?** My bet is, of course not. You have a chance to prove me wrong.   _What ya got punk?_     ---
**Author:** ![mikeyohe](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex019/user_avatar/forum.centerforinquiry.org/mikeyohe/32/28536_2.png) [@mikeyohe](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/u/mikeyohe)\ **Post date:** [March 3, 2019, 3:06am UTC](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/t/citizens-right-to-know/6334/6 "2019-03-03T03:06:57Z")
No, you did not ask what Nasa climate scientists I was talking about. You were down grading Nasa. I had entered the post number #297592 which covered the Nasa scientists in question. I am not saying all the scientists are correct. As I have stated before, if you don’t make mistakes then you are most likely not doing much. As far as M. Mann I have said that I don’t follow him, and he may have done some good things. But he handled the Hockey Stick wrong. If he had said, if there is a problem, let see what it is and get everyone on the same page. I don’t think anyone would have had a problem. But he sued and fought everyone. That doesn’t make happy taxpayers. The Nasa guys are good Americans trying to help fix a problem. I have no problem with them. You’re the one with the big ego problem. Do you even remember how many years ago it is now that you claimed all the Climate Science was done? Another lie, you respect scientists that have respect of their professional peers. That’s BS. That was one of the biggest complaints about Mann was his use of peers to get junk published. For you, professionalism means dollar payments and belonging to the Democratic Party. On the timeline of Climate Change. We are at a point of claiming to reach a few of the Gold Standards. By the end of the year we will know if this is the facts or not. To anyone following this. Climate science is many hypotheses that are trying to be worked into theories. An example of gold standards would be. The diameter of the earth would have been a hypothesis until there were some gold standards to work with. And one of the gold standards is the mile. Until units of measurements were established no theories of diameter of the earth could be proven by how many steps it took. And that’s what the NASA guys are getting at. The Climate Change computer models needs gold standards to work with. An example of Climate Change gold standard is CO2 in the upper atmosphere. But that is now being challenged by solar winds. Personally, I prefer the term datum points, lines and planes better than Gold Standards. The point being you got to first have the Gold Standards before the science can really begin. We are just now getting close to starting the climate science. Sure, we can do hundreds of hypotheses every day for three decades now. And hundreds of computer runs. But where has all that gotten us? A thousand hypotheses and not one proven theory. We don’t really know if CO2’s bad affects are offset by it’s good affects. We don’t even know if the CO2 is the earth’s thermometer. Or if the earth even has a thermometer or the clouds are the thermometer. There is no wisdom being used by people claiming the science is done and the CO2 is the cause of the problem. For example. Today the news is covering stories about extreme weather cause by Climate Change. The data shows extreme weather has been on the decline since 1900. And we are only at 60% of the extreme weather average from 1900 to today. How can so much false data be headline stories today? It’s political, not scientific. ---
**Author:** ![citizenschallengev3](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex019/user_avatar/forum.centerforinquiry.org/citizenschallengev3/32/17_2.png) [@citizenschallengev3](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/u/citizenschallengev3)\ **Post date:** [March 3, 2019, 11:29am UTC](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/t/citizens-right-to-know/6334/7 "2019-03-03T11:29:57Z")
> Yohe, flaps arms while decrying: > > “No, you did not ask what Nasa climate scientists I was talking about.” **Hell I’m not!**   Yo, I asked you who were these NASA climate scientists who’s complaint you take for such gospel??? Can’t do it, can you? Oh and I don’t give a flying fart about any link you’re pointing at right now -----\> **_Here all we want to know who are these NASA climate scientists who are questioning the well understood and recognized consensus on the topic._** **Let’s have it? Names, perhaps even their expertise?** **Or are you going to give me the License to call you a _disconnected from reality fraud_?** ---
**Author:** ![citizenschallengev3](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex019/user_avatar/forum.centerforinquiry.org/citizenschallengev3/32/17_2.png) [@citizenschallengev3](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/u/citizenschallengev3)\ **Post date:** [March 3, 2019, 1:14pm UTC](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/t/citizens-right-to-know/6334/8 "2019-03-03T13:14:49Z")
> Yohe: "The data shows extreme weather has been on the decline since 1900." Based on what? [Kelly MJ 2016](https://www.omicsonline.org/open-access/trends-in-extreme-weather-events-since-1900--an-enduring-conundrum-for-wise-policy-advice-2167-0587-1000155.php). Seriously? I just read that abstract and intro to the thing, it's not about discussing any study he's done, it's about attacking established science. That's the sign of a fraud, not someone with anything constructive and important to share. Oh it doesn't help that it sure does look like a pay to publish outfit - Journal of Climatology & Weather Forecasting, and given the tone of Kelly's paper, doesn't seem like they've got very high standards. > Bob Ward, March 20, 2015 **Britain's climate sceptics' dishonest tactics need to stop** Climate sceptics are turning to increasingly tricky ruses to hide their motives. > > [https://www.newstatesman.com/politics/2015/03/britains-climate-sceptics-dishonest-tactics-need-stop](https://www.newstatesman.com/politics/2015/03/britains-climate-sceptics-dishonest-tactics-need-stop) > > Professor Kelly publicised the Foundation’s new pamphlet, published on Sunday, which criticises a short guide to climate science produced by the Royal Society last December. > > The attack is part of a co-ordinated ongoing war by the Foundation against mainstream scientific organisations, such as the Royal Society and the Met Office, which are documenting how the UK and the rest of the world are being affected by rising greenhouse gas levels in the atmosphere. > > The Foundation hopes to create confusion about the science to undermine the case for climate change policies, in a clear echo of tactics used by tobacco companies to delay regulation of smoking. … > > … Professor Kelly’s political motivation for doing Lord Lawson’s bidding at the expense of the Royal Society is obvious from the newspaper article. > > He complains about the Climate Change Act and wind farms, blaming them for having “contributed to electricity prices increasing by twice the level of inflation over the last decade”. > > But again, Professor Kelly is wrong about the evidence. … > > (it’s an interesting read for the curious: [https://www.newstatesman.com/politics/2015/03/britains-climate-sceptics-dishonest-tactics-need-stop](https://www.newstatesman.com/politics/2015/03/britains-climate-sceptics-dishonest-tactics-need-stop)) Oh, just found another one, this one even better. ATTP does a very nice job of examining Kelly’s arguments, if you’re interested in the underlying science and data processing tricks, this is the article to read. > [**Extreme events**](https://andthentheresphysics.wordpress.com/2016/03/22/extreme-events/) March 22, 2016, by ... and Then There's Physics > > "I thought I would write about another paper I encountered today. It’s by Michael Kelly, a Professor at the University of Cambridge. He was also part of a panel that assessed the Climatic Research Unit after the email controversy, typically referred to as Climategate. > > The main conclusion of his paper can probably be gleamed from the first half of the abstract > > It is widely promulgated and believed that human-caused global warming comes with increases in both the intensity and frequency of extreme weather events. A survey of official weather sites and the scientific literature provides strong evidence that the first half of the 20th century had more extreme weather than the second half, when anthropogenic global warming is claimed to have been mainly responsible for observed climate change. > What I think he misses pointing out here is that his sources are not simply official weather sites and the scientific literature, but also blogs, many of which could justifiably be regarded as promoting science denial. … > ... At the end of the day, detecting trends in extreme events is difficult. Given that nothing presented in this paper is a remotely reliable way of determining this, suggesting that there has been no increase is simply wrong. However, even if it is difficult, we do have some confidence that some extremes should show an increase in intensity and frequency; heatwaves and extreme precipitation events are two examples. Others are more complicated and uncertain, although there is some indication of an increase in the frequency and intensity of extreme Tropical Cyclones in some ocean basins. However, if we keep adding energy to the climate system, it would be extremely surprising if it didn’t have any effect on the intensity of extreme weather events, and – given that there’ll be more energy – it might be surprising if the most extreme events didn’t become more energetic." > > Read all of it at [Extreme events | …and Then There's Physics](https://andthentheresphysics.wordpress.com/2016/03/22/extreme-events/) Oh gosh another one of the WWII physicists that never related to Earth to begin with, now it’s making more sense. [Michael Kelly (physicist) - Wikipedia](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Michael_Kelly_%28physicist%29) ---
**Author:** ![mikeyohe](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex019/user_avatar/forum.centerforinquiry.org/mikeyohe/32/28536_2.png) [@mikeyohe](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/u/mikeyohe)\ **Post date:** [March 3, 2019, 7:46pm UTC](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/t/citizens-right-to-know/6334/9 "2019-03-03T19:46:38Z")
Yohe, flaps arms while decrying: “No, you did not ask what Nasa climate scientists I was talking about.” Hell I’m not! Yo, I asked you who were these NASA climate scientists who’s complaint you take for such gospel??? Can’t do it, can you? Oh and I don’t give a flying fart about any link you’re pointing at right now —–\> Here all we want to know who are these NASA climate scientists who are questioning the well understood and recognized consensus on the topic. Let’s have it? Names, perhaps even their expertise? Or are you going to give me the License to call you a disconnected from reality fraud? This reply was modified 8 hours, 9 minutes ago by Citizenschallenge-v.3.   _I went to the posting and got this information from the links given, Mike_ **The Right Climate Stuff Research Team** • Volunteer group of primarily retired NASA scientists and engineers - veterans of the Apollo Program. More than 25 active members • Formed in February 2012 as an independent, objective, research team with no funding INITIAL GOAL: Determine the extent to which burning fossil fuels can cause harmful global warming   **The Right Climate Stuff Research Team** • We aren’t climate scientists • We do have education, training, and experience in the same scientific disciplines that climate scientists use • We have expertise in identifying and mitigating Threats from exploring the unknowns of manned space flight We define Problems in terms of a deviation from “Normal” Global temperatures are not deviating from Normal limits of the last 10,000 years ! • We have bounded the warming that atmospheric CO2 and other GHG can have Not a serious nor immediate Threat requiring Global Action • CONCLUSIONS: Due to world-wide rising energy demand and rising fossil fuel prices, as fossil fuel reserves are consumed, A market-driven transition to alternative fuels will be required before any climate problems can occur A USA national energy plan is needed to ensure our energy future Climate alarmism is causing irrational energy-related decisions Climate alarmism results from complex climate simulation models; not from data! o Models are not sufficiently accurate to guide public policy decision-making regarding CO2 emissions o Models are not validated !   CC, this is the base idea that goes on for many more pages.   **Donald Bogard** , PhD **Harold H Doiron** , PhD, Mechanical Engineering Chairman, The Right Climate Stuff Research Team (NASA JSC 1963-1979) VP, Engineering, InDyne, Inc. (retired)   **Robert M. Bauman** , a proud TRCS member, 3 years   **Martin C. Cornell** , B.S. Chemistry Member, The Right Climate Stuff Research Team Senior Scientist, The Dow Chemical Co. (1967-2003; retired)   **Walter Cunningham** , M.S. Physics Apollo 7 Astronaut Colonel, USMCR-Ret   **J. Douglas Drewry** , B.S. Physical Science, M.A. Eng Mgt NASA JSC Aerospace Engineer 1989 - 2012, Retired (USAF 1972-1976)   **Charles M Duke, Jr** Brig. Gen. USAF, (Ret) Apollo 16 Astronaut   **John Dale Dunn** MD JD Civilian Faculty Emergency Medicine   **Carl R Darnall** Army Medical Center Fort Hood, Texas Advisor, Heartland Institute and American Council on Science and Health   **Sally Fernandez** , Author Climatized; Separating Climate Science Facts from Fiction   **Laurence I. Gould** , Professor of Physics (University of Hartford), Past Chair (2004) New England Section of the American Physical Society, Member of The Right Climate Stuff research team   **Will Happer** , PhD Physics Princeton University, Professor of Physics   **Thomas J Harmon** , JSC retiree   **Mike Hernandez** PE NASA-JSC Retiree Flight Operations and Crew Training   **Jack Knight** Member TRCS, NASA- JSC, Chief, Advanced Operations and Development Division, MOD, 40 years   **Joel Leavitt** , B.S. Ch. E., M.A. Comm. Member TRCS Research Team (CCPC, Inc. Refinery Eng. and Eco., 1975 - 2006, retired.)   **Lubert Leger** PhD Member TRCS, Retired NASA JSC   **Jay Lehr** , PhD Science Director The Heartland Institute, author, co-author and editor of 36 science books. Former Professor The Ohio State University and the University of Arizona Executive Director of the Association of Ground Water Scientists and Engineers.   **Howard R. Lowe** , BS Geology Retired Professional Engineer, Member of the TRCS   **Humboldt C. Mandell, Jr.** , Ph. D. (40 year NASA veteran.) The Viscount Monckton of Brenchley Hobbit Court, Dyrham, Chippenham, SN14 8HE Tel. 0117 937 4155: cell +44 7814 556423 [monckton@mail.com](mailto:monckton@mail.com)   **Thomas L. (Tom) Moser**, BSME, MSME, NASA - JSC, Director of Engineering; Dep. Assoc. Admin. & Director, Space Station Program (retired)   **James M. Peacock,** B.S. in M.E. TexasA & M Charter Member of The Right Climate Stuff Research Team (NASA JSC Aerospace Engineer 1962-83 retired) USAF R&D, Air Force Special Weapons Center 1958-1962   **Aldara G. Peacock** B.S. Biology Chicken Husbandry Specialist, Charter Member of TRCS Research Team   **Orvis Pigg** NASA-JSC Retired   **A,G, (Randy) Randol III** BSME(Nuclear Option),1965 Notre Dame M.S.E. Nuclear Engineering Sciences, 1967 U of Florida Ph.D. Nuclear Engineering Sciences, 1969 U of Florida Both advanced degrees involved NASA research. Exxon 25 years. Responsible for climate issues in Washington Office. Co-founder, VA Scientists & Engineers for Energy and Environment   **Joseph E. Rogers** , PE, BSME & MSCE Chief, Structures Branch (formerly) (NASA JSC 1966-2007 retired)   **Bernard J. Rosenbaum,** B.S. ChE, Member TRCS, Senior Engineer, Propulsion & Power Div., Engr. Directorate, 1963 - 2013, retired   **Richard L. Sauer** Member TRCS, NASA-JSC, Life Sciences Environmental Engineer 1997-2000   **Dr. William C. Schneider** Retired NASA Senior Engineer Johnson Space Center and Texas A&M University Endowed Professor   **H. Leighton Steward BS** , MS Geologist Environmentalist, President of Plants Need CO2 Co-founder and member of The Right Climate Stuff team and a director of Dr. Will Happer’s CO2 Coalition   **Robert (Bob) Thompson** Formerly Space Shuttle Program Manager NASA-JSC 37 years   **James B Tollison Jr**., B.S. in E.E Lunar EVA Communications Engineer, NASA-JSC 1963-70 Nuclear Weapons Program, DOE 1970-89 Senior Scientist, SAIC 1989-2013   **James T. Visentine** , MS in Atmospheric Physics Member, The Right Climate Stuff Research Team (NASA JSC Aerospace Scientist 1964-2007 retired)   **Thomas (Tom) Wysmuller**, Meteorologist NASA-JSC TRCS Member, Meteorologist, 5 years   **Ken Young** BS-ASE-1962 Director/President, The Right Climate Stuff Foundation, NASA-JSC Aerospace Engr. 1962-1987, retired ---
**Author:** ![citizenschallengev3](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex019/user_avatar/forum.centerforinquiry.org/citizenschallengev3/32/17_2.png) [@citizenschallengev3](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/u/citizenschallengev3)\ **Post date:** [March 3, 2019, 8:22pm UTC](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/t/citizens-right-to-know/6334/10 "2019-03-03T20:22:58Z")
There you go, not a climatologist amongst them, though they are all known for being politically biased and active - but that doesn’t bug yohe. They telling him what he wants to hear while the real experts are raining on his parade.   The Right Climate Stuff Foundation - Ain’t that the cuties bit of PR bullshit, I looked at their website. > We, a group of retired and highly experienced engineers and scientists from the Apollo, Skylab, Space Shuttle and International Space Station eras, have volunteered our time and effort **conducting an objective** , independent assessment **of the AGW alarm and reality of the actual threat**. Christ it sure sounds purely political right out the gate. a **director of Dr. Will Happer’s CO2 Coalition** **Advisor, Heartland Institute and American Council on Science and Health** **Dr. Will Happer** the looneytoon himself. Exxon 25 years. etc, etc   There was a meteorologist in their, yippy (He’s quite a bit of work, once you look into his background, [https://www.desmogblog.com/thomas-wysmuller](https://www.desmogblog.com/thomas-wysmuller)) - all of these old guys are known for being a tad on the right wing wind nut end of the spectrum -. Sure did great science were involved in great engineering feats, but not a climateologists. But the logic I’m supposed to buy, I’ll take my MRI to my mechanic because I don’t trust all those Brain surgeons since they’re all part of the same click.   > **NASA Climate 'Skeptics' Respond with Science! Just Kidding. Posted on 12 April 2012 by dana1981** > > **[https://skepticalscience.com/NASA-climate-denialist-letter.html](https://skepticalscience.com/NASA-climate-denialist-letter.html)\** > > > > **Expertise Matters > Let’s be explicit about our choice here.** > > > > **On the one hand we have a bunch of former administrators, astronauts, and engineers who between them have zero climate expertise and zero climate science publications. > On the other hand we have the climate scientists at NASA GISS who between them have decades, perhaps even centuries of combined professional climate research experience, and hundreds, perhaps even thousands of peer-reviewed climate science publications. > Amongst those individuals at NASA GISS are some of the world’s foremost climatescientists. They include James Hansen, who created one of the earliest global climate models in the 1980s, which has turned out to be remarkably accurate (Figure 2). …** ** ** ** ** **NASA Retirees Appeal to their Own Lack of Climate Authority Posted on 24 January 2013 by dana1981** **[https://www.skepticalscience.com/NASA-retirees-letter2.html](https://www.skepticalscience.com/NASA-retirees-letter2.html)** ** ** **In April of 2012, 49 former NASA employees sent a letter to the current NASA administrator requesting that he effectively muzzle the climate scientists at NASA Goddard Institute for Space Studies (GISS). None of those former NASA employees have conducted any climate science research, but based on their own lack of understanding of the subject, they objected to the conclusions drawn by the climate experts at NASA GISS. This letter drew media attention because folks who have worked at NASA are well-respected (and rightly so), but there was really no substance to it, or any particular reason to lend it credence. Astronauts and engineers are not climate experts.** **Now in January of 2013, a group of 20 “Apollo era NASA retirees” has put together a rudimentary climate “report” and issued a press release declaring that they have decided human-caused global warming is not “settled” and is nothing to worry about. This time around they have not listed the 20 individuals who contributed to this project, but have simply described the group as being:** **“…comprised of renowned space scientists with formal educational and decades career involvement in engineering, physics, chemistry, astrophysics, geophysics, geology and meteorology. Many of these scientists have Ph.Ds” The project seems to be headed by H. Leighton Steward, a 77-year-old former oil and gas executive. The press release also links the NASA group to his website, “co2isgreen”, which also has an extensive history of receiving fossil fuel industry funding.** **This story can be summed up very simply: a group of retired NASA scientists with no climate science research experience listened to a few climate scientists and a few fossil fuel-funded contrarian scientists, read a few climate blogs, asked a few relatively simple questions, decided that those questions cannot be answered (though we will answer them in this post), put together a very rudimentary report, and now expect people to listen to them because they used to work at NASA. It’s purely an appeal to authority, except that the participants have no authority or expertise in climate science.** **Answering the NASA Retirees’ Questions Most of the group’s report is devoted to summarizing some basic aspects of climatescience, such as the greenhouse effect. At the end it lists seven “conclusions”, most of which are questions they claim “are still to be resolved”, but in reality are generally simple to answer.** **1. How really well known is the global temperature of the earth over the past century? Quite really well known. The accuracy of the surface temperature record has been confirmed by many different studies using a variety of different approaches, including by natural thermometers and satellites. There is very little difference between the results of different groups analyzing the surface temperature data (Figure 1).** ** ** ** ** ** ** ** ** ** ** ---
**Author:** ![citizenschallengev3](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex019/user_avatar/forum.centerforinquiry.org/citizenschallengev3/32/17_2.png) [@citizenschallengev3](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/u/citizenschallengev3)\ **Post date:** [March 4, 2019, 9:43am UTC](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/t/citizens-right-to-know/6334/11 "2019-03-04T09:43:15Z")
Oh I forgot another important question **Mike why did you have to lie and present these shills as “climate scientists,”** when not a single one has any climate science education - and no the onetime weather man turned political bully does not count as a climate scientists! - ? ---
**Author:** ![mikeyohe](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex019/user_avatar/forum.centerforinquiry.org/mikeyohe/32/28536_2.png) [@mikeyohe](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/u/mikeyohe)\ **Post date:** [March 4, 2019, 2:35pm UTC](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/t/citizens-right-to-know/6334/12 "2019-03-04T14:35:24Z")
Were you born yesterday? The site posted this. • We aren’t climate scientists. • We do have education, training, and experience in the same scientific disciplines that climate scientists use.   You would have to be brain dead to not know that there are very few experienced climate scientists. In fact, the government was giving $200,000 grants for people to enter the field because of the shortage of scientists. The team has Thomas (Tom) Wysmuller, a meteorologist. If a meteorologist is not good enough to be a climate scientist. Then M. Mann is no good either. Because Mann is only a Geophysics and you are telling me that team has “not a climatologist amongst them….”. Dr. Judith Curry is a climatologist and I consider to be one of the very top climate scientists America has. A key difference between meteorologists and climatologists lies in the time perspectives they bring to the study of weather and climate. Meteorologists produce forecasts that are intended to predict weather conditions over the short term, often a horizon no longer than 7 to 10 days. Dr. M. Mann graduating college with degrees in Physics, Geology, Geophysics. Perfect for locating and extracting different natural resources from the earth, including ores, minerals, precious gems, water, or gases. Not even close to Tom Wysmuller training as a climate scientist.   You can’t keep playing the eating shit game. Either the team is no good and Dr. Mann is also no good. Or the team is good and Dr. Mann is good. What’s it going to be? ---
**Author:** ![citizenschallengev3](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex019/user_avatar/forum.centerforinquiry.org/citizenschallengev3/32/17_2.png) [@citizenschallengev3](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/u/citizenschallengev3)\ **Post date:** [March 4, 2019, 3:39pm UTC](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/t/citizens-right-to-know/6334/13 "2019-03-04T15:39:36Z")
> We aren’t climate scientists. Then why do you pretend and call them climate scientists? I took chemistry in high school that does not make me a chemist even if I learned a little about it. > Dr. Judith Curry is a climatologist and I consider to be one of the very top climate scientists America has. You! Really? You've done nothing but parade your biased self-certain ignorance around here? What makes you think you're a judge of the quality of the scientific career she did before jettisoning it. Perhaps if you spent some time puzzling out why her CV look so damned anemic, you might not be so self-certain.   Can’t figure out what you’re trying to fart out regarding Michael Mann > Mentoring > >   > > Program Coordinator: > > Dual Title Ph.D. program in Climate Science, Penn State University, 2018- > > Postdoctoral Researchers: > > Penn State University (2005-) > > Dept. of Meteorology: > > Palash Sinha (joint w/ J. Fuentes), 2013-15 > Ryan Sriver (NOAA Postdoctoral Fellow), 2008-2009 > Byron Steinman (NSF Postdoctoral Fellow), 2012-2014 > Zhihua Zhang, 2005-2009 > University of Virginia (1999-2005) > > Dept. of Environmental Sciences: > > Feinbao Ni (joint w/ M. Hughes, University of Arizona), 2002-2003 > Pedro Ribera, (Visiting postdoctoral research fellow, University of Vigo, Spain), 2000 > Scott Rutherford, 2000-2003 > Mei-Yu (joint w/ H. Epstein), 2002-2003 > Graduate Students: > > Penn State University (2005-) > > Dept. of Meteorology: > > Aviva Braun, M.S. 2009: committee member, 2008-09 > Daniel Brouillette, M.S. 2015: major adviser, 2012-15 > Fangxing Fan, Ph.D. 2011: major adviser, 2005-11 > Screece Dawn Goldberger, M.S. 2015: major adviser, 2013-15 > Maria Herrmann, Ph.D. 2010: committee member, 2008-10 > Holly Hamilton, Ph.D 2015: committee member, 2012-15 > Brandon Katz, M.S. 2009: co-adviser, 2006-09 > Muge Komercu, Ph.D. candidate: co-adviser, 2006-08 > Alexander Kowaleski, M.S. candidate: committee member, 2013-14 > Michael Kozar, M.S. 2011: major adviser, 2010-11 > Liang Ning, Ph.D. 2012: major adviser, 2008-12 > Andrew Ross, M.S./Ph.D candidate: committee member, 2012-17 > Andra Reed, Ph.D. 2016: major adviser, 2012-16 > Michelle Ricciardi, M.S. 2011: committee member, 2011 > Thomas Sabbatelli, M.S. 2009 (AMS Graduate Fellow): co-adviser, 2008-09 > Steven Simon, M.S. 2015: major adviser, 2011-15 > Vanessa Vanyo, M.S. candidate: major adviser, 2013-15 > Amanda Walker, M.S. candidate: co-adviser, 2015-17 > Dept. of Geosciences: > > Patrick Applegate, Ph.D. 2009: committee member, 2005-09 > Joshua Dorin, M.S. 2008: committee member, 2006-08 > John Mischler, M.S. 2008: committee member, 2007-08 > Dept. of Geography: > > Weiming Hu, Ph.D. candidate: committee member, 2018- > Chris Karmosky, Ph.D. 2012: committee member, 2009-12 > Dept. of Civil and Environmental Engineering > > Kathryn van Werkhoven, Ph.D. 2008: committee member, 2007-08 > Other: > > Penn State Intellectual Decisions on Environmental Awareness Solutions (“I.D.E.A.S”) undergraduate club, Faculty Sponsor/Adviser, 2017- > Penn State Science Policy Society (Graduate Student Organization), Faculty Sponsor/Adviser, 2014- > Dual Title Graduate Program in Climate Science (Department of Meteorology and Atmospheric Science), Program Coodinator 2016- > University of Virginia (1999-2005) > > Dept. of Environmental Sciences: > > Julian Adams, M.S. 2003: major adviser, 2000-2003 > Kaycie Billmark, Ph.D. 2003: committee member, 1999-2003 > Joel Carr, M.S. 2002: committee member, 2000-2002 > Peter Cleary, M.S. 2004: co-adviser, 2002-2004 > Benjamin Cook, M.S. 2004; Ph.D. 2007: co-adviser, 2001-2005 > Dan Druckenbrod, Ph.D. 2003: committee member, 1999-2003 > Oliver Frauenfeld Ph.D. 2003: committee member, 2001-2003 > Ian German-Mesner, M.S. candidate: major adviser, 2002-2005 > Kevin Jones, M.S. 2002: committee member, 2001-2002 > Courtenay Strong, Ph.D. 2005: committee member, 2003-2005 > Tana Wood, M.S. 2002; Ph.D. 2005: committee member, 2001-2005 > Zhihua Zhang, Ph.D. 2006: major adviser, 2000-2006 > University of Massachusetts (1997-1999) > > Dept. of Geosciences: > > Caspar Ammann, Ph.D. 2000: co-adviser, 1998-2000 > Anne Waple, Ph.D. 1999: co-adviser and committee member, 1997-1999 > Bo-Min Sun, Ph.D. 1999: committee member, 1998-1999 > External Committee Member (2001-) > > Phil Lane, Ph.D. 2001: external committee member, MIT, 2010-11 > Heidi Cullen, Ph.D. 2001: external committee member, Columbia University, 2000-01 > Silvia Venegas, Ph.D. 2001: external committee member, University of Copenhagen, 2000-01 > Undergraduates: > > Penn State University (2005-) > > Dept. of Meteorology: > > Anson Hill-Yu Cheung, 2015 (NSF REU summer student from U. Arizona) > Nathan Lis, 2015 > Greg Drelich, 2012 > Michael Kozar, 2009-2010 > Thomas Sabbatelli, 2005-2008 > University of Virginia (1999-2005) > > Dept. of Environmental Sciences: > > Michelle L’Heureux, 2001-2004 > Primary Research Interests > >   > > (1) Climate model/data comparisons; (2) Climate signal detection and climate change attribution; > > (3) Climate modeling; (4) Climate impacts; (5) Statistical and time series analysis methods; (6) High-resolution paleoclimate reconstruction > >   > > Research Grants > >   > > 2018-2020 Improved Characterization of Internal Decadal-Multidecadal Climate Variability Using Paleoclimate Archives, Observational Climate Data and Model Simulations, NSF-Paleoclimate Program (Award #1748097) [Principal Investigators: M.E. Mann (Penn State Univ.), B. Steinman (Univ. of Minnesota-Duluth)] PSU award (M.E. Mann): $474,083 > > 2016-2019 The Power of Many: Ensemble Toolkit for Earth Sciences, NSF- ICER (“EarthCube”) Program (Award #1639707) [Principal Investigators: S. Jha (Rutgers Univ), G. Cervone (Penn State Univ.), M.E. Mann (Penn State Univ.)] PSU award (M.E. Mann and G. Cervone): $391,000 > > 2015-2018 Quantitative Reconstruction of Past Drought Patterns in Western North America Using Lakes, Stable Isotopes, and Modeling, NSF-P2C2 Program (Award #1446329) [Principal Investigators: B. Steinman (Univ. of Minnesota-Duluth), M. Abbott (Univ. of Pittsburgh), M.E. Mann (Penn State Univ.)] PSU award (M.E. Mann): $145,002 > > 2012-2017 WSC-Category 2 Collaborative: Robust decision-making for South Florida water resources by ecosystem service valuation, hydro-economic optimization, and conflict resolution modeling, NSF-Water Sustainability & Climate Program (Award #1204666) [Multi-institution award (Univ. of Central Florida/Univ. of Florida/Univ. of Hawaii/Michigan Tech. Univ/Univ. South Florida/Univ. of Miami/Univ. of Penn/Penn State Univ). Principal Investigator (Penn State Univ): J.D. Fuentes; Co-Investigator (Penn State Univ.): M.E. Mann] PSU award (J.D. Fuentes/M.E. Mann): $300,514 > > 2011-2014 Megadrought: Local vs Remote Causal Factors for Medieval North America, NSF-Paleo Perspectives on Climate Change Program (Award #1103316) [Principal Investigator: S. Feng (Univ. of Nebraska); Co-Investigators: Q. Hu, R.J. Oglesby, C.M. Rowe (Univ. of Nebraska), M.E. Mann (Penn State Univ.)] PSU award (M.E. Mann): $151,755 > > 2011-2014 Advanced Regional And Decadal Predictions Of Coastal Inundation for the U.S. Atlantic and Gulf Coasts, NOAA-Improving NOAA’s Climate Services for the Coastal Zone (Special Competition) (Award #NA11OAR4310101 [Principal Investigators: B. Horton (Univ. of Pennsylvania), J. Donnelly (WHOI), Reide Corbett (East Carolina Univ.), A. Kemp (Yale University), K. Lindeman (Florida Inst. Tech.), M.E. Mann (Penn State Univ.), D. Peltier (Univ. of Toronto, Canada), S. Rahmstorf (University of Potsdam, Germany)] PSU award (M.E. Mann): $120,463 > > 2011-2014 Climate and Society – Innovative and Sustainable Collaboration with Senegal, Penn State University-AESEDA program [Principal Investigator: J.D. Fuentes; Co-Investigators: P. Tschakert, J. L. Evans, A. M. Thompson, and M.E. Mann] PSU internal award: $75,000 > > 2010-2013 Development of a Northern Hemisphere Gridded Precipitation Dataset Spanning the Past Half Millennium for Analyzing Interannual and Longer-Term Variability in the Monsoons, NOAA-Climate Change Data & Detection (CCDD) Program (Award #NA10OAR4310111[Principal Investigators: Q. Hu, S. Feng, R.J. Oglesby (Univ. of Nebraska), M.E. Mann (Penn State Univ.)] PSU award (M.E. Mann): $249,800 > > 2010-2012 Climate Literacy Zoo Education Network, NSF-Arctic Research & Education (Award #1043284) [Principal Investigators: A. Grajal (Chicago Zoological Society), S.R. Goldman (Univ. of Illinois-Chicago), M.E. Mann (Penn State Univ.)] PSU award (M.E. Mann): $32,733 > > 2009-2013 Quantifying the influence of environmental temperature on transmission of vector-borne diseases, NSF-EF (Award #0914384) [Principal Investigator: M. Thomas; Co-Investigators: R.G. Crane, M.E. Mann, A. Read, T. Scott (Penn State Univ.)] $1,884,991 > > 2009-2012 Toward Improved Projections of the Climate Response to Anthropogenic Forcing: Combining Paleoclimate Proxy and Instrumental Observations with an Earth System Model, NSF-ATM (Award #0902133) [Principal Investigator: M.E. Mann; Co-Investigators: K. Keller (Penn State Univ.), A. Timmermann (Univ. of Hawaii)] $541,184 > > 2008-2011 A Framework for Probabilistic Projections of Energy-Relevant Streamflow Indices, DOE [Principal Investigator: T. Wagener; Co-Investigators: M. Mann, R. Crane, K. Freeman (Penn State Univ.)] $330,000 > > 2008-2009 AMS Industry/Government Graduate Fellowship (Anthony Sabbatelli), American Meteorological Society [Principal Investigator: M.E. Mann (Penn State Univ.)] $23,000 > > 2006-2009 Climate Change Collective Learning and Observatory Network in Ghana, USAID (Award #EEM-A-00-06-00014) [Principal Investigator: P. Tschakert; Co-Investigators: M.E. Mann, W. Easterling (Penn State Univ.)] $759,928 > > 2006-2009 Analysis and testing of proxy-based climate reconstructions, NSF-ATM (Award #0542356 [Principal Investigator: M.E. Mann (Penn State Univ.)] $459,000 > > 2006-2009 Constraining the Tropical Pacific’s Role in Low-Frequency Climate Change of the Last Millennium, NOAA-Climate Change Data & Detection (CCDD) Program (Grant #NA06OAR4310116) [Principal Investigators: K. Cobb (Georgia Tech Univ.), N. Graham (Hydro. Res. Center), M.E. Mann (Penn State Univ.), Hoerling (NOAA Clim. Dyn. Center), Alexander (NOAA Clim. Dyn. Center)] PSU award (M.E. Mann): $68,065 > > 2006-2007 Acquisition of high-performance computing cluster for the Penn State Earth System Science Center (ESSC), NSF-EAR (Award #0548962) [Principal Investigator: M.E. Mann, Co-Investigators: R. Alley, M. Arthur, J. Evans, D. Pollard (Penn State Univ.)] $100,000 > > 2003-2006 Decadal Variability in the Tropical Indo-Pacific: Integrating Paleo & Coupled Model Results, NOAA-Climate Change Data & Detection (CCDD) Program (Award #NA03OAR4310145) [Principal Investigators: M.E. Mann (U.Va), J. Cole (U. Arizona), V. Mehta (CRCES)] U.Va award (M.E. Mann): $102,000 > > 2002-2005 Reconstruction and Analysis of Patterns of Climate Variability Over the Last One to Two Millennia, NOAA-Climate Change Data & Detection (CCDD) (Award #NA16GP2913) Program [Principal Investigator: M.E. Mann, Co-Investigators: S. Rutherford, R.S. Bradley, M.K. Hughes] $315,000 > > 2002-2005 Remote Observations of Ice Sheet Surface Temperature: Toward Multi-Proxy Reconstruction of Antarctic Climate Variability, NSF-Office of Polar Programs, Antarctic Oceans and Climate System (Award #0125670) [Principal Investigators: M.E. Mann (U. Va), E. Steig (U. Wash.), D. Weinbrenner (U. Wash)] U.Va award (M.E. Mann): $133,000 > > 2002-2003 Paleoclimatic Reconstructions of the Arctic Oscillation, NOAA-Cooperative Institute for Arctic Research (CIFAR) Program [Principal Investigators: Rosanne D’Arrigo, Ed Cook (Lamont/Columbia); Co-Investigator: M.E. Mann] U.Va subcontract (M.E. Mann): $14,400 > > 2002-2003 Global Multidecadal-to-Century-Scale Oscillations During the Last 1000 years, NOAA-Climate Change Data & Detection (CCDD) Program [Principal Investigator: Malcolm Hughes (Univ. of Arizona); Co-Investigators: M.E. Mann; J. Park (Yale University)] U.Va subcontract (M.E. Mann): $20,775 > > 2001-2003 Resolving the Scale-wise Sensitivities in the Dynamical Coupling Between Climate and the Biosphere, University of Virginia-Fund for Excellence in Science and Technology (FEST) [Principal Investigator: J.D. Albertson; Co-Investigators: H. Epstein, M.E. Mann] U.Va internal award: $214,700 > > 2001-2002 Advancing predictive models of marine sediment transport, Office of Naval Research [Principal Investigator: P. Wiberg (U.Va), Co-Investigator: M.E. Mann] $20,775 > > 1999-2002 Multiproxy Climate Reconstruction: Extension in Space and Time, and Model/Data Intercomparison, NOAA-Earth Systems History (Award #NA96GP0404) [Principal Investigator: M.E. Mann (U.Va), Co-Investigators: R.S. Bradley, M.K. Hughes] $381,647 > > 1998-2000 Validation of Decadal-to-Multi-century climate predictions, DOE [Principal Investigator: R.S. Bradley (U. Mass); Co-Investigators: H.F. Diaz, M.E. Mann] > > 1998-2000 The changing seasons? Detecting and understanding climatic change, NSF-Hydrological Science [Principal Investigator U. Lall (U. Utah); Co-investigators: M.E. Mann, B. Rajagopalan, M. Cane] $266,235K > > 1996-1999 Patterns of Organized Climatic Variability: Spatio-Temporal Analysis of Globally > > Distributed Climate Proxy Records and Long-term Model Integrations, NSF-Earth Systems History [Principal Investigator: R.S. Bradley (U. Mass); Co-Investigators: M.E. Mann, M.K. Hughes] $270,000 > > 1996-1998 Investigation of Patterns of Organized Large-Scale Climatic Variability During the Last Millennium, DOE, Alexander Hollaender Postdoctoral Fellowship [M.E. Mann] $78,000 > >   > > Professional Activities > >   > > 2018 Co-convener/organizer (w/ G. Stone and R. Mandel), Session on “Accelerating Rates of Change Forewarn of Catastrophic Impacts”, GSA Annual Meeting > > 2018- Board of Directors, National Center for Science Education > > 2018 Co-convener/organizer, Invited session on “Energy Flows in the Climate System”, APS March Meeting > > 2018 Chair, Topical Group on Physics of Climate (GPC), American Physical Society (APS) > > 2017- Judge, Roddenbery Foundation Fellowship Program > > 2017- Board of Directors, PennFuture > > 2017 Co-convener/organizer (w/ J.M. Byrne, R. Alley), Session on “Climate Solutions: Policy, Planning, Science and Engineering in Uncertain Political and Economic Times”, AGU Fall Meeting > > 2017 Provided testimony to U.S. House of Representatives (Science & Technology Committee hearing, Mar 29) > > 2017 Chair-Elect, Topical Group on Physics of Climate (GPC), American Physical Society (APS) > > 2016- Chair, Scientific Advisory Board, Climate Science Legal Defense Fund (CSLDF) > > 2016- Editorial Board, Palgrave Series in Environmental Sustainability > > 2016 Vice Chair, Topical Group on Physics of Climate (GPC), American Physical Society (APS) > > 2015 Invited Science Foo Camp (“Sci Foo”) participant, event organized by Nature, O’Reilly Media, and Google, GooglePlex, Mountain View, CA, Jun 26-28, 2015. > > 2015 Co-convener/organizer (w/ S. Hassol), Science Communication Workshop, Global Change Center/Interfaces of Global Change Interdisciplinary Graduate Education Program, Virginia Tech, Blacksburg, VA, Mar 20, 2015. > > 2015 Co-convener/organizer (w/ D. J. Wuebbles and M. Wehner), Session on “Severe Weather in a Changing Climate: Informing Risk”, AAAS Annual Meeting, Feb 13, 2015. > > 2015- Committee on Academic Freedom and Tenure, American Association of University Professors (AAUP) > > 2014- Advisory Council, National Center for Science Education (NCSE) > > 2013 Co-convener/organizer (w/ T.S. Ledley, F. Niepold, E. Maibach), Union Session on “Climate Literacy: The Role of the AGU Scientific Community in Climate Change Communication and Engagement”, AGU Fall Meeting > > 2013 Co-convener/organizer (w/ J.M. Byrne, S.D. Donner, P.J. Rasch), Session on “Climate Change Adaptation and Mitigation”, AGU Fall Meeting > > 2013 Co-convener/organizer (w/ S.D. Donner, J.M. Byrne, P.J. Rasch), Session on “Cutting-Edge Challenges in Climate Change Science”, AGU Fall Meeting > > 2013 Co-convener/organizer (w/ J. Evans), Penn State PSIEE/EESI/EMS Workshop “Climate Change and Impacts Downscaling”, Bald Eagle State Park, PA, Aug 27-29, 2013. > > 2012 Co-convener/organizer (w/ G. Stone, S. Riggs, and A. Buddington), Session on “Rapid sea-level rise: past, present and future”, GSA Annual Meeting > > 2012-16 Hans Oeschger Medal Committee, European Geophysical Union > > 2011-12 Expert Reviewer, Working Group I report, Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change (IPCC), Fifth Assessment Report > > 2011-12 Co-organizer (w/ G. Schmidt, V. Masson-Delmotte, M. Kageyama, E. Guilyardi, A. Timmermann), Workshop on using paleo-climate model/data comparisons to constrain future projections, PAGES/CLIVAR, Honolulu, Hawaii, Mar 1-3, 2012. > > 2011-15 Member-at-Large of Section W (Atmospheric & Hydrospheric Sciences), American Association for the Advancement of Science (AAAS) > > 2010-11 Editor for series (volumes 1-10): Confronting Global Warming, Greenhaven Press, Detriot. > > 2011 Co-convener/organizer (w/ F. Mekik, S. Mitra, R. Sriver, C. Whitlock, J. Zhu, A. Zimmer), Session on “Using Paleo and Modern Observations to Improve Understanding of Climate Projections, Environmental Change, and Biomass Burning”, AGU Fall Meeting > > 2011 Co-convener/organizer (w/ G. Stone, A. Buddington, and M. Chandler), Session on “Extreme Climate and Weather: Past, Present, and Future”, GSA Annual Meeting > > 2010 Invited Science Foo Camp (“Sci Foo”) participant, event organized by Nature, O’Reilly Media, and Google, GooglePlex, Mountain View, CA, July 30-Aug 1, 2010 > > 2010 Co-convener/organizer (w/ G. Stone, A. Buddington), Session on “Exposing Myths and Misrepresentations of Climate Change and Evolution Science”, GSA Annual Meeting > > 2009 Co-convener/organizer (w/ G. Stone, A. Buddington), Pardee Keynote Symposium on “Crisis In The Cryosphere”, GSA Annual Meeting > > 2009- Guest Editor, Proceedings of the National Academy of Sciences > > 2007-08 Associate Editor, G-Cubed, special issue on “Tropical Cyclone-Climate Interactions on All Time Scales" > > 2007 Co-convener/organizer (w/ P. Jones), IAMAS session on “The Holocene-Anthropocene Transition: From Natural to Human-Dominance of the Earth System”, IUGG24th General Assembly > > 2007-08 Member of steering committee, “post-Earth Systems History” workshop, NSF > > 2007 Co-convener/organizer (w/ J. Jouzel, P. Jones, W. Dullo), special session `` Climate of the last millennium”, 4th General Assembly, European Geophysical Union > > 2006 Co-convener/organizer (w/ K. Emanuel, M. Huber, J. Gulledge, P. Webster), theme session ``Tropical Cyclone-Climate Interactions on All Time Scale”, Annual Fall meeting, American Geophysical Union > > 2006 Provided testimony to U.S. House of Representatives (Energy and Commerce Committee hearing, July 27) > > 2006 Co-chair, Workshop on “Past Millennia Climate Variability”, Wengen Switzerland > > 2006 Co-convener/organizer (w/ J. Jouzel, P. Jones, W. Dullo), special session `` Climate of the last millennium”, 3rd General Assembly, European Geophysical Union > > 2005-08 Editorial advisory board, The Holocene > > 2005-06 Expert Reviewer, Working Group I report, Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change (IPCC), Fourth Assessment Report > > 2005 Co-convener/organizer (w/ J. D. Gong and Luterbacher), special session ``Explaining the Climates of Historic Times: Detection and Attribution of Anthropogenic Influences’’, Biennial Assembly of IAMAS > > 2005 Co-convener/organizer (w/ J. Jouzel, P. Jones, W. Dullo), special session `` Climate of the last millennium”, 2nd General Assembly, European Geophysical Union > > 2004 Co-convener/organizer (w/ J. Jouzel, P. Jones, W. Dullo), special session `` Climate of the past millennium”, 1st General Assembly, European Geophysical Union > > 2003-04 Member, National Academy of Sciences/National Research Council Committee on Radiative Forcing Effects on Climate > > 2003 Provided testimony to U.S. Senate (‘Environment and Public Works’ Committee hearing, July 29) > > 2003 Chair of organizing committee, National Academy of Sciences Frontiers of Science symposium > > 2003 Co-convener/organizer (w/ P. Jones, V. Masson-Delmotte), IAMAS session on `` Climate of the Holocene”, IUGG > > 2003 Co-convener/organizer (w/ J. Jouzel, P. Jones, W. Dullo), special session `` Climate of the past millennium”, 28th General Assembly, European Geophysical Society > > 2003-05 Advisory board member for Scientific American ‘Scientific American 50’ > > 2003 Invited Participant, Workshop on Estimating Climate Sensitivity, National Academy of Sciences > > 2003-06 Member of steering committee, NSF Marine Earth Systems History (MESH) Panel > > 2003-05 Committee on Probability & Statistics, American Meteorological Society > > 2002-05 IAMAS delegate for U.S./International Commission on Climate (ICCL) > > 2002 Organizing committee, National Academy of Sciences Frontiers of Science symposium > > 2002 Co-convener/organizer (w/ H. Von Storch, R. Brazdil), theme session ``Understanding the Late Maunder Minimum climate anomaly”, Annual Spring meeting,American Geophysical Union > > 2002 Co-convener/organizer (w/ J. Jouzel, P. Jones, W. Dullo), special session `` Climate of the past millennium”, 27th General Assembly, European Geophysical Society > > 2001-02 Member, advisory board, Earth Interactions (American Geophysical Union) > > 2001 Chair/Organizer, session on “Climate Change Detection/Attribution”, National Academy of Science Frontiers of Science annual symposium, Irvine, California, Nov 8-10, 2001. > > 2001 Organizer and Host, PAGES/CLIVAR workshop on Reconstructing Late Holocene Climate, Charlottesville, Virginia, April 17-20, 2001. > > 2001 Co-convener/organizer (w/ J. Jouzel, P. Jones), special session `` Climate of the past millennium”, 26th General Assembly, European Geophysical Society > > 2001 Co-convener/organizer, NASA /IPRC/ CLIVAR workshop on Decadal Climate Variability, Manoa, Hawaii, Jan 8-12, 2001. > > 2000-04 Member of Working Group, International PAGES/CLIVAR > > 2000-04 Panel member, NOAA Climate Change Data and Detection Program > > 2000-02 Editor, Journal of Climate > > 2000 Co-convener (w/ J. Jouzel, P. Jones), special session `` Climate of the past millennium”, 25th General Assembly, European Geophysical Society > > 1999 Co-convener/organizer (w/ J. Jouzel), special session ``Data and model studies of climate changes over the last millennium”, 24th General Assembly, European Geophysical Society > > 1999 Invited adviser, NOAA Global Change and Climate Panel, Boulder, CO > > 1999 Guest editor, special issue of Climatic Change > > 1999 Co-convener (w/ J. Overpeck), PAGES/CLIVAR workshop on multiproxy climate reconstruction, Boulder, CO > > 1998-00 Lead author, Chapter 2, Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change (IPCC), Third Assessment Report > > 1998-00 Contributing author, Chapters 7,8,12, Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change (IPCC), Third Assessment Report > > 1997 Co-convener/organizer (w/ E. Cook, H. Pollack, D. Chapman) , theme session ``Multiproxy Climate Reconstruction…”, Annual Fall meeting, American Geophysical Union > >   > > · Memberships: American Meteorological Society; American Geophysical Union; European Geophysical Society; Geological Society of America; American Physical Society; American Association for the Advancement of Science; Sigma Xi; American Association of University Professors; Authors Guild > > · Reviewer for: Nature; Nature Climate Change; Nature Geoscience; Nature Communications; Scientific Reports; Science; PNAS; Geology; Climatic Change; Geophysical Research Letters; Journal of Climate; JGR-Ocean; JGR-Atmospheres; Paleoceanography; Climate Dynamics; Eos; Int. J. Climatol.; Water Resources Research; Holocene; GSA Today; Climate of the Past; Earth and Planetary Science Letters; Global & Planetary Change; Water Resources Research; Atmospheric & Solar-Terrestrial Physics; Climate Research; PLoS Biology; QJRMS; National Research Council/National Academy of Sciences; IPCC AR5; NSF, NOAA, DOE grant programs; U.S. CCSP; numerous books and/or book chapters.   What has Judy done besides whine about how unfairly she thinks she’s been treated. That ol strategy of victimhood - you libertarian right wing nuts sure have figured out how to play that pathetic song. Always intent of taking attention away from learning about the physical science at work in our world.             ---
**Author:** ![mikeyohe](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex019/user_avatar/forum.centerforinquiry.org/mikeyohe/32/28536_2.png) [@mikeyohe](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/u/mikeyohe)\ **Post date:** [March 5, 2019, 12:14pm UTC](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/t/citizens-right-to-know/6334/14 "2019-03-05T12:14:39Z")
**We aren’t climate scientists.** **Then why do you pretend and call them climate scientists?** **I took chemistry in high school that does not make me a chemist even if I learned a little about it.** The same reason I call 2 plus 2 equals 4. Because it adds up. I do not pretend to call them climate scientists, I do call them climate scientists. Just like I call Mann a climate scientist. I use the America ways and methods. I really don’t understand your communist way of thinking. Do you understand the following statement? _We do have education, training, and experience in the same scientific disciplines that climate scientists use._ It is really quite simple. Take a look at how the defense and aerospace programs are working. To be a machinist you start off as a trainee for one to three years. Then move to a C man level for three to four years. Then a B man for three to four years. Then you become a A man or journeyman. You are then able to become a contractor of the trade after seven years as a journeyman. Meaning you can go anywhere and work anyplace using any system anywhere in the country. Not just as a contract machinist but as a contractor of any of the related trades. It is not uncommon for journeymen to become contractors after they retire from a company. They are highly skilled in the trade and know what they are doing. Contractors usually make thirty to fifty percent more base pay than Journeymen and work more hours. So, to explain how I have seen the American system working. Let’s say the government needs 200 contract planners for a new drone. In other words, the government needs 200 of the top people in this trade to come to one area of the country and put together and complete this project. They want and could use 200 people. They will be lucky to get 100 people. The background of these top contractor will be pattern makers, template layout, aerospace engineers, program managers, quality inspectors, jig and fixture builders, tool and die maker, mechanical design, model makers, NC programmers just to name a few of the trades these 100 people will have. You will be lucky to get 8 people of the 100 with a direct planning background. What you do have is people that all have trade knowledge and have the wisdom of the trades that is needed to get the job done. And all their backgrounds are suitable for the job of being a planner. This system has worked for decades here in America and is still working today. Nothing different with the climatologist trade. I look at Dr. Mann as a climatologist because that is what he does. He obviously can do what it takes. And it is known that you get better results with teams than individuals. **You! Really? You’ve done nothing but parade your biased self-certain ignorance around here? What makes you think you’re a judge of the quality of the scientific career she did before jettisoning it. Perhaps if you spent some time puzzling out why her CV look so damned anemic, you might not be so self-certain.** I don’t think you understand how the system works. This is not a job at McDonalds. Where you use a resume or Curriculum Vitae. When you reach the skill level of a contractor you are hired by the project director, not the personal department. And that hiring is a two-minute phone call at most, consisting of what projects you have worked on. For example, you say I worked on the cruise at AF Plant 19 as a jig builder and the B-2 at Northrop as an inspector. You got the job as a planner for the new drone. Because the project director is going to know exactly what you did because he knows the industry. The project director will say, contact CDI and be here Monday. CDI would be the contract employment agency that will be paying you. You call CDI and then you might send them a one-page resume for their files. CDI will check on the status of your security clearance and call the personal department at the company you will be going to work for and tell them that you have been hired and are expected for work on Monday. Age, sex, race, not being able to pass a physical have nothing to do with the hiring. It is all about the skill level. Four-hundred plus papers. Dr. Curry didn’t jettison her career. She now runs a very successful company, Climate Forecast Applications Network. A big step up. _ **CFAN Takes the Lead in the Race to Provide Better Forecasts of Hurricane Paths** _ > **[CFAN Takes the Lead in the Race to Provide Better Forecasts of Hurricane Paths](https://www.businesswire.com/news/home/20180411005475/en/CFAN-Takes-Lead-Race-Provide-Forecasts-Hurricane)** > > In 2017 CFAN took the lead in the race to provide better forecasts of Atlantic hurricane paths.   CFAN develops weather and climate prediction tools. It offers OmniCast, a Web-based tool that provides probabilistic forecast maps of surface weather and anomalies, location specific forecasts of surface weather, probabilistic extreme events forecasts, and probabilistic forecast of teleconnection regimes; tropical cyclone forecasts, which provides probabilistic forecasts of individual storms and monthly outlooks of track density; and climate impact assessments, which provides historical attribution studies of climate impacts and decadal scale climate change scenarios, including enterprise and sectoral climate risk assessment, and regional climate impact assessments. The company also provides tailored decision support products for energy, emergency management, agricultural, financial/development, and insurance sectors.   **Can’t figure out what you’re trying to fart out regarding Michael Mann** Sorry but that is not the resume of someone who has a good resume in the private world. Great for government work and grant receiving world. As pointed out about the planning job for the contractors. You name the projects you were part of. The climate models are nothing to brag about. The IPCC is nothing to brag about. You left out the time spent on writing and promoting four books. How about using part of the last 22 years getting a theory published or one of the climate models working? Something of value for the public. ---
**Author:** ![citizenschallengev3](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex019/user_avatar/forum.centerforinquiry.org/citizenschallengev3/32/17_2.png) [@citizenschallengev3](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/u/citizenschallengev3)\ **Post date:** [March 5, 2019, 8:16pm UTC](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/t/citizens-right-to-know/6334/15 "2019-03-05T20:16:54Z")
You think all of that lip flapping says anything? We are talking fundamental science, go us google scholar to make you point, instead you lecture about the contract system and who know what other distraction. BALONEY DETECTED   Then you tell me Curry has 400 plus papers, what are you counting blog posts as papers? Then to verify your statement to take me right to a link that is all Curry heaping praise upon herself, trying to sell her own product. And this is the shit you’ll accept from your team.   It seems to me all you’ve been good for is underscoring how totally hopeless it is trying to rationally reason with a libertarian right winger. ---
**Author:** ![citizenschallengev3](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex019/user_avatar/forum.centerforinquiry.org/citizenschallengev3/32/17_2.png) [@citizenschallengev3](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/u/citizenschallengev3)\ **Post date:** [March 5, 2019, 8:24pm UTC](https://forum.centerforinquiry.org/t/citizens-right-to-know/6334/16 "2019-03-05T20:24:36Z")
Hey can you offer any independent links that look at CFAN - because all I could find is tinged with self-authorship and self-promotion - though I did find one CFAN storm track image on a Weather Underground page. But, it’s pretty slim pickings. Still, if you don’t mind me pointing out this is all one big bullshit distraction from the topic of this post. But I’ve learned to expect distractions from you. > We The People of the United States have a moral, ethical right – along with a pragmatic need – to learn what scientists have learned about this planet’s biosphere and climate engine without constant dishonest crossfire. > > We should not tolerate serious scientists constantly being drown out by amoral, malicious and frankly ignorant arguments – that an astoundingly ruthless GOP PR factory repeats over and over again, without ever learning a damned thing from the evidence in front of us.